Ducati Dry Clutch Automotive vs. Motorcycle oil

[SamMan23]

As many people know, most Ducati's except 2004+ ST models came with dry clutches. Now most motorcyclist use motorcycle oils because of their wet clutches.
What are the differences in motorcycle and automotive oil? Would there be advantages to using automotive oils on a ducati dry clutch?

 

[swjohnsey]

The reason stated for using "motorcycle oil" has more to do with the shared oil supply for crankcase and gearbox. That said, IMHO there is no reason to use "motorcycle" oil. The advantage of using car oil is that it is cheaper.

 

[dwendt44]

Rotella synthetic and other diesel oils have a loyal following among cycle riders.
Up until cycle manufacturers started selling their own 'branded', overpriced oil, plain old car oil was what was recommended.
Now, if you use car oil, your engine will blow up, you hair will fall out, and the IRS will take strong interest in your activities.

 

[KBFXDLI]

The motorcycle oils really have a more robust additive package that their auto counterparts. This really comes into play with air cooled engines. As for wet clutches I use Redline MTL which is a manual trans lubricant and not a motor oil. But in my engine which is a very loose tolerance heavy duty Vtwin TC88 I only use a motorcycle rated synthetic 20w50 oil like Mobil1Vtwin or Redline. If the Ducati is water cooled the temperature reduction you get from synthetics is not really a factor. You could easily use an automotive synthetic. Just don't go extended OCI.

 

[Jaybird]

What sort of temp reduction do we see by using a synthetic fluid???
A synthetic fluid may well fight degredation of the fluid, allowing it to remain viable for longer than it's organic counterpart, but a reduction in temperature simply by using a synthetic fluid?

And, I think it will be easy to find many oils not marketed towards the moto crowd that has every bit or more robust an add pack than many of the moto specific choices.

Elevated moto specific oil pricing is, for the most part, a big scam on the consumer.

 

[road_rascal]

Off topic: a couple of issues ago in Motorcycle Consumer News there was a great article about how to maintain yer dry clutch in yer Ducati- very informative. Remember- loud clutches save lives

! Or is that loud valves?

 

[TeeDub]

True synthetic motorcycle oils are formulated using a high molecular basestock blend. The reason is to bias the formulation to achieve the best thermal/shear stability at very high temps. The tradoff you make is a reduction in low temp pumpability. However since most motorcycle owners don't ride in very cold weather, it makes sense to go this route.

Here is a comparison of the Amsoil 10w-40 motorcycle oil(MCF) and their SL/CI-4+ rated, 10w-40 passenger vehicle oil(AMO) at cold/hot temps:

10w-40/AMO, CCS of approx 4000 Cp @ -25C/-13F
10w-40/MCF, CCS of approx 6000 Cp @ -25C/-13F
(note the motorcycle oil is about 50% thicker)

10w-40/AMO, vis of 14.4 Cst @ 100C, HT/HS of 4.3 Cp
10w-40/MCF, vis of 13.9 Cst @ 100C, HT/HS of 4.5 Cp
(note the motorcycle oil has lower ratio of kinematic viscosity to HT/HS viscosity, ie it's more shear stable)

In this case the passenger car oil has been formulated with a fairly even tradeoff between high/low temp properties. The purpose built motorcycle oil has been biased towards having the best high temp properties, but the higher molecular weight basestocks limit its' ability to pump in very cold temps.

The one caveat here is that there are many motorcycle oils that are just re-badged car oils. So it pays to do a little research before paying a premium for a motorcycle oil. The standout MC oils I've seen are Amsoil, Mobil 1, Motul 300V and Redine, in the 10w-40/20w-50 grades.

 

[KBFXDLI]

Quote:

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What sort of temp reduction do we see by using a synthetic fluid???
A synthetic fluid may well fight degredation of the fluid, allowing it to remain viable for longer than it's organic counterpart, but a reduction in temperature simply by using a synthetic fluid?

And, I think it will be easy to find many oils not marketed towards the moto crowd that has every bit or more robust an add pack than many of the moto specific choices.

Elevated moto specific oil pricing is, for the most part, a big scam on the consumer.

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I get a 10-20*F heat reduction from using synthetic MC oil in my air cooled Harley. This is a well published fact in air cooled engines. That is really the only reason I use synthetic. Extended OCI with an engine that uses 2.5 qts is penny pinching.

 

[Jaybird]

Quote:

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I get a 10-20*F heat reduction from using synthetic MC oil in my air cooled Harley. This is a well published fact in air cooled engines. That is really the only reason I use synthetic. Extended OCI with an engine that uses 2.5 qts is penny pinching.

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I see benefit in using a synthetic base such as PAO for extended OCI and for cold weather starts. But I haven't seen any of the "well published" reports of any sort of synthetic providing a cooler run, other than by mechanism of a lower viscosity. And we can tweek viscosity with any basestock oil.

Can you point me to some of this well published data? I'm having trouble finding it.

 

[KBFXDLI]

Quote:

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Quote:

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I get a 10-20*F heat reduction from using synthetic MC oil in my air cooled Harley. This is a well published fact in air cooled engines. That is really the only reason I use synthetic. Extended OCI with an engine that uses 2.5 qts is penny pinching.

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I see benefit in using a synthetic base such as PAO for extended OCI and for cold weather starts. But I haven't seen any of the "well published" reports of any sort of synthetic providing a cooler run, other than by mechanism of a lower viscosity. And we can tweek viscosity with any basestock oil.

Can you point me to some of this well published data? I'm having trouble finding it.

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The data is rumbling under my butt when I'm riding my Harley and I check the oil temp in the case. This is documented by RP as they made a video commercial about it. Check their website. Obviously you have never ridden an air cooled motorcycle in the Summertime.

 

[Jaybird]

You may have taken some advertizing information, and turned it into "synthetic oils keep your engine cooler"...but that is not fact.
The RP claim that you are touting says nothing at all about synthetic basestock being the reason for the temperature reduction. If you look into things a bit closer, you will see that Royal Purple is touting their proprietary additive as the contributor to this reduced wear and temperature reduction.

I have ridden quite a few air cooled bikes since 1969, as if that has anything to do with this issue.
But I have known lots of guys over the years that swear by their butt dynos and crotch themometers too. I spose whatever makes you feel good.
Other consumers like to rely on a bit more sophisticated and factual data than that.

 

[KBFXDLI]

Quote:

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You may have taken some advertizing information, and turned it into "synthetic oils keep your engine cooler"...but that is not fact.
The RP claim that you are touting says nothing at all about synthetic basestock being the reason for the temperature reduction. If you look into things a bit closer, you will see that Royal Purple is touting their proprietary additive as the contributor to this reduced wear and temperature reduction.

I have ridden quite a few air cooled bikes since 1969, as if that has anything to do with this issue.
But I have known lots of guys over the years that swear by their butt dynos and crotch themometers too. I spose whatever makes you feel good.
Other consumers like to rely on a bit more sophisticated and factual data than that.

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It's easy for me to tell that the engine is running cooler by warm up time. My sportster (carbed version) would take at least an additional 10 minutes to get to operating temperature and you could easily tell by the amount of time you needed the choke out. My TC88 takes about 5 additional minutes and is FI so not so noticable. But many many guys report the same thing with big twins and they all have oil temp guages as well. This difference is VERY noticable in the Winter months as my sportster would take forever to get hot with Syn3 in it. With HD360 it would get hot in no time. I know guys who ride a lot in the Winter and specifically use dino because of the delayed warm up with synthetics. This condition exists with Syn3, M1Vtwin and Redline in my experience. But if you don't believe me log onto a MC forum and post the question in the oil section.