Will a new Wireless Router speed up my internet?

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Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Those routers run hot, and I get the best performance and stability out of it, and it runs much cooler, like that.

Not sure how much hotter the AC66 runs, but my N66U on Tomato only feels warm to the touch when propped on its stand. I wouldn't call it hot.

The stock Asus firmware has a temperature display. What temps are you seeing when you have it mounted sideways vs. the normal way on stand?


When mounted on it's stand, The antenna connectors, and any metal on the back, feels hot, hot enough to actually be painful. The top/middle/front of the unit is fine mostly, but the back of it and bottom get ridiculously hot. I burned my finger on the antenna connector once.

With it mounted sideways, you can feel the heat coming out of the vents that are on the top, and the whole unit feels much cooler. Mine doesn't appear to have the temp display, but it got hot. And I'm talking about the N66U which is what I have.

This is with stock output, and both radios at 200mW


Sounds like POOR design. Have they heard of things called heat sinks and fans?

Nothing should get that warm INO.. Esp for long life.
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: Nick R
Those routers run hot, and I get the best performance and stability out of it, and it runs much cooler, like that.

Not sure how much hotter the AC66 runs, but my N66U on Tomato only feels warm to the touch when propped on its stand. I wouldn't call it hot.

The stock Asus firmware has a temperature display. What temps are you seeing when you have it mounted sideways vs. the normal way on stand?


When mounted on it's stand, The antenna connectors, and any metal on the back, feels hot, hot enough to actually be painful. The top/middle/front of the unit is fine mostly, but the back of it and bottom get ridiculously hot. I burned my finger on the antenna connector once.

With it mounted sideways, you can feel the heat coming out of the vents that are on the top, and the whole unit feels much cooler. Mine doesn't appear to have the temp display, but it got hot. And I'm talking about the N66U which is what I have.

This is with stock output, and both radios at 200mW


Sounds like POOR design. Have they heard of things called heat sinks and fans?

Nothing should get that warm INO.. Esp for long life.


Gotta agree with Bill here. I'm a big fan of ASUS gear, but if you've gotta orient this product a certain way just so it stays cool, that stinks of bad design.

My SSG5 barely gets warm.
 
All I say if I had one of these I'd have a fan on it all the time.

Something simple but some air flow so its cooler and hopefully lasts longer.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah


Sounds like POOR design. Have they heard of things called heat sinks and fans?

Nothing should get that warm INO.. Esp for long life.


Gotta agree with Bill here. I'm a big fan of ASUS gear, but if you've gotta orient this product a certain way just so it stays cool, that stinks of bad design.

My SSG5 barely gets warm.


You don't have to orient it any way. No where in the directions or user manual does it state anything of the sort.

Countless users and tech review organizations rave about this router. I have read it gets warm. Nothing wrong with that.
That is part of its operational design.


I could almost cook an egg on my MacBook Pro when I'm editing/rendering a project, converting files, and browsing the net at the same time.. It is operating normally.

Nick is just suggesting a placement that he has observed to work well for him.
 
Originally Posted By: rg200amp

I could almost cook an egg on my MacBook Pro when I'm editing/rendering a project, converting files, and browsing the net at the same time.. It is operating normally.


Sounds like the router is not the only thing poorly designed...
whistle.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: rg200amp

I could almost cook an egg on my MacBook Pro when I'm editing/rendering a project, converting files, and browsing the net at the same time.. It is operating normally.


Sounds like the router is not the only thing poorly designed...
whistle.gif




LOL.

Correct, this is the orientation I've had best results with .It would probably operate fine the other way, but I like things to stay as cool as possible. It stays plenty cool this way, without a fan. And it also helps keep it out of the way, so it works out well either way.
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: rg200amp

I could almost cook an egg on my MacBook Pro when I'm editing/rendering a project, converting files, and browsing the net at the same time.. It is operating normally.


Sounds like the router is not the only thing poorly designed...
whistle.gif



Its actually one of, if not the best designed computers available.

The amount of power built into such a small package requires new ways to deal with the massive amount of heat generated. Apple designs the uni-body aluminum frame of the new MacBook Pro to be an integral part of the computer. They design the body to be a part of the computer, it acts as the skeletal structure and enclosure while being a key component of heat dissipation. Using the actual laptop as a heat sink saves on a lot of space that dedicated, larger, heat sinks would take up.

Unlike the vast majority of laptops that are just generic parts thrown together into a plastic shell, Apple actually puts some effort on the design aspects.

So well in fact, that other laptop makers have been scurrying to reproduce Apple's design principles.

You look at design as form vs function.

True design genius is incorporating form and function.
 
Originally Posted By: rg200amp
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah


Sounds like POOR design. Have they heard of things called heat sinks and fans?

Nothing should get that warm INO.. Esp for long life.


Gotta agree with Bill here. I'm a big fan of ASUS gear, but if you've gotta orient this product a certain way just so it stays cool, that stinks of bad design.

My SSG5 barely gets warm.


You don't have to orient it any way. No where in the directions or user manual does it state anything of the sort.

Countless users and tech review organizations rave about this router. I have read it gets warm. Nothing wrong with that.
That is part of its operational design.


I could almost cook an egg on my MacBook Pro when I'm editing/rendering a project, converting files, and browsing the net at the same time.. It is operating normally.

Nick is just suggesting a placement that he has observed to work well for him.



My concern is based more on long-term durability. You can't really compare the heat dissipation characteristics of a laptop to a router. No high quality commercial router gets hot, I know because I deal with them regularly. Any of the ones capable of generating significant amounts of heat are properly equipped with an appropriately sized heatsink and variable speed fan.

That being said, Nick's observations don't appear to align with those of Quattro Pete (though he cited a slightly different model), so perhaps it is usage profile that plays a role here. I also don't take too much stock in on-line reviews or user testimonials, as they would be based on short-term testing, not long-term durability.

To be clear: I expect the performance (and subsequently the reviews) to be excellent. My concern is that if it gets as hot as Nick says it does, that its life expectancy may be compromised. This is based on my experience with the WL-500W, which would also get hot and didn't last anywhere near as long as the WL-566gM that it replaced, or the WL-520GU, which wasn't as capable, but didn't get hot either.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: rg200amp
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah


Sounds like POOR design. Have they heard of things called heat sinks and fans?

Nothing should get that warm INO.. Esp for long life.


Gotta agree with Bill here. I'm a big fan of ASUS gear, but if you've gotta orient this product a certain way just so it stays cool, that stinks of bad design.

My SSG5 barely gets warm.


You don't have to orient it any way. No where in the directions or user manual does it state anything of the sort.

Countless users and tech review organizations rave about this router. I have read it gets warm. Nothing wrong with that.
That is part of its operational design.


I could almost cook an egg on my MacBook Pro when I'm editing/rendering a project, converting files, and browsing the net at the same time.. It is operating normally.

Nick is just suggesting a placement that he has observed to work well for him.



My concern is based more on long-term durability. You can't really compare the heat dissipation characteristics of a laptop to a router. No high quality commercial router gets hot, I know because I deal with them regularly. Any of the ones capable of generating significant amounts of heat are properly equipped with an appropriately sized heatsink and variable speed fan.

That being said, Nick's observations don't appear to align with those of Quattro Pete (though he cited a slightly different model), so perhaps it is usage profile that plays a role here. I also don't take too much stock in on-line reviews or user testimonials, as they would be based on short-term testing, not long-term durability.

To be clear: I expect the performance (and subsequently the reviews) to be excellent. My concern is that if it gets as hot as Nick says it does, that its life expectancy may be compromised. This is based on my experience with the WL-500W, which would also get hot and didn't last anywhere near as long as the WL-566gM that it replaced, or the WL-520GU, which wasn't as capable, but didn't get hot either.


We must keep in mind that Asus has been producing this router for, in realm of technology, a fairly long time. The N66 and the AC66 are essentially the same router. If the build methods that allow for heat production caused any issues, Asus has had plenty of time and user trial to rectify an issue.

Since everyone states the router runs warm and no issues have ever come up and Asus has not changed the building methods to reduce heat generation, one can safely assume that their are no foreseeable concerns. No issues found thus no issues to be fixed.

Just because a tech product runs warm does not automatically equate shorter life expectancy.

I know you, both as a IT professional as well as computer guru, like hardware running as cool as possible, but the amount of heat my router puts off, as well as the vast majority of the Asus 66 line I would imagine, is trivial at best when considering the thresholds of it's hardware's heat allowances.
 
Originally Posted By: rg200amp


We must keep in mind that Asus has been producing this router for, in realm of technology, a fairly long time. The N66 and the AC66 are essentially the same router. If the build methods that allow for heat production caused any issues, Asus has had plenty of time and user trial to rectify an issue.


I know, but they never did with the WL-500W/WL-500G family though
wink.gif


Quote:
Since everyone states the router runs warm and no issues have ever come up and Asus has not changed the building methods to reduce heat generation, one can safely assume that their are no foreseeable concerns. No issues found thus no issues to be fixed.

Just because a tech product runs warm does not automatically equate shorter life expectancy.

I know you, both as a IT professional as well as computer guru, like hardware running as cool as possible, but the amount of heat my router puts off, as well as the vast majority of the Asus 66 line I would imagine, is trivial at best when considering the thresholds of it's hardware's heat allowances.



Warm and hot are two different things though, warm isn't an issue. How warm is yours running currently? Does it align with Nick's observations or QP's?

For reference:

QP

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete

Not sure how much hotter the AC66 runs, but my N66U on Tomato only feels warm to the touch when propped on its stand. I wouldn't call it hot.

The stock Asus firmware has a temperature display. What temps are you seeing when you have it mounted sideways vs. the normal way on stand?


vs

Nick:

Originally Posted By: Nick R


When mounted on it's stand, The antenna connectors, and any metal on the back, feels hot, hot enough to actually be painful. The top/middle/front of the unit is fine mostly, but the back of it and bottom get ridiculously hot. I burned my finger on the antenna connector once.


Those appear to be pretty different observations!

QP's device sounds normal. Nick's sounds "too hot" per my criteria.
 
Originally Posted By: rg200amp
We must keep in mind that Asus has been producing this router for, in realm of technology, a fairly long time. The N66 and the AC66 are essentially the same router. If the build methods that allow for heat production caused any issues, Asus has had plenty of time and user trial to rectify an issue.

Interestingly enough, early versions of N66U had a built-in physical fan. Later on, Asus abandoned the fan and replaced it with heat sinks. I guess they decided the internals weren't getting hot enough to warrant an actual fan. Either that, or they just wanted to make it quieter or less expensive to make.

IIRC, back when I had the stock firmware, it was showing radio temps of around 54-55C.

Also let me clarify, what felt warm to the touch was the middle of the case. I did not try touching the antenna connectors, which is what Nick described as hot. I don't have the router in sight so I can't verify right now. But if they're at 55C, I can see how that could feel hot to the touch.
 
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: rg200amp


We must keep in mind that Asus has been producing this router for, in realm of technology, a fairly long time. The N66 and the AC66 are essentially the same router. If the build methods that allow for heat production caused any issues, Asus has had plenty of time and user trial to rectify an issue.


I know, but they never did with the WL-500W/WL-500G family though
wink.gif


Quote:
Since everyone states the router runs warm and no issues have ever come up and Asus has not changed the building methods to reduce heat generation, one can safely assume that their are no foreseeable concerns. No issues found thus no issues to be fixed.

Just because a tech product runs warm does not automatically equate shorter life expectancy.

I know you, both as a IT professional as well as computer guru, like hardware running as cool as possible, but the amount of heat my router puts off, as well as the vast majority of the Asus 66 line I would imagine, is trivial at best when considering the thresholds of it's hardware's heat allowances.



Warm and hot are two different things though, warm isn't an issue. How warm is yours running currently? Does it align with Nick's observations or QP's?

For reference:

QP

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete

Not sure how much hotter the AC66 runs, but my N66U on Tomato only feels warm to the touch when propped on its stand. I wouldn't call it hot.

The stock Asus firmware has a temperature display. What temps are you seeing when you have it mounted sideways vs. the normal way on stand?


vs

Nick:

Originally Posted By: Nick R


When mounted on it's stand, The antenna connectors, and any metal on the back, feels hot, hot enough to actually be painful. The top/middle/front of the unit is fine mostly, but the back of it and bottom get ridiculously hot. I burned my finger on the antenna connector once.


Those appear to be pretty different observations!

QP's device sounds normal. Nick's sounds "too hot" per my criteria.



I am on my MacBook, my downstairs TV is playing Netflix, and there is one iPad in use in the house now.

The router is just warm. The antenna metal screw on mounts are also just warm.


If I run every wireless device at once, I would assume the router may get warmer/hot. But I have not seen, heard, or read of any issues from that. So what is "too hot"???

One's perception of "too hot" and the hardware's tolerances of "too hot" are two different concepts on the table here.

Nick is more than likely running a lot more data through his network than the majority of wifi users. So it would stand to reason his would be hotter.

On the flip side however, it's people like Nick, the content/data heavy users, that are buying and using the $200 routers like the Asus 66.

Considering that the heaver users are the ones really putting this router to use, the lack of issues reported are one aspect that drew me to this router.

Believe me, I would of wanted nothing else to spend the same $200 on an Apple Airport Extreme. You know me!

After doing my research of the hardware, specs, reviews, features, range, ect. . . Hands Down the Asus is a solid router. So solid, it swayed me from my beloved Apple. That aint no easy feat!!! lol
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: rg200amp
We must keep in mind that Asus has been producing this router for, in realm of technology, a fairly long time. The N66 and the AC66 are essentially the same router. If the build methods that allow for heat production caused any issues, Asus has had plenty of time and user trial to rectify an issue.

Interestingly enough, early versions of N66U had a built-in physical fan. Later on, Asus abandoned the fan and replaced it with heat sinks. I guess they decided the internals weren't getting hot enough to warrant an actual fan. Either that, or they just wanted to make it quieter or less expensive to make.

IIRC, back when I had the stock firmware, it was showing radio temps of around 54-55C.

Also let me clarify, what felt warm to the touch was the middle of the case. I did not try touching the antenna connectors, which is what Nick described as hot. I don't have the router in sight so I can't verify right now. But if they're at 55C, I can see how that could feel hot to the touch.




I know I could google it, but would you mind explaining something?

Why are you running an alternative firmware?

What are you looking to gain/overcome in not using the updated Asus firmware?

What kind of usage are you putting through your network?

I am just wondering if this is something I may want to investigate further for my own use. . .
 
My question is whether Nick's experience with skin-scorching heat is typical or unusual.
smile.gif


BTW, with respect to what is too hot or not, I'm sure we'll know in a few years if those that have routers running as hot as Nick's have issues with them failing. It took a number of years for the WL-500W to fail, it certainly wasn't a overnight problem. I had a pile of them in service, so my experience with them isn't limited.

One thing to note is that with DD-WRT on them, they appeared to last a lot longer. And they ran cooler
wink.gif
 
Originally Posted By: rg200amp
I know I could google it, but would you mind explaining something?

Why are you running an alternative firmware?

What are you looking to gain/overcome in not using the updated Asus firmware?

What kind of usage are you putting through your network?

I am just wondering if this is something I may want to investigate further for my own use. . .

I've been running Tomato on all my routers for years, so I am just used to the interface and know exactly where to find what features/options. That was the main reason for uploading Tomato onto this new Asus as well. I don't think there is much advantage in terms of performance. But there are various versions of Tomato available... some of them include built-in bit torrent clients, VLAN management, TOR Project, IPSec, UPS monitoring, etc., if you need it.

It also gives you a more detailed view into network activity of every single client that's connected to it. But again, it's more of a "nice to have" type thing.

You can also define various traffic classes and set up QoS based on that. I can't remember if the stock Asus firmware supports it nowadays or not.

More info on the particular Tomato branch that I'm using:
http://tomato.groov.pl/?page_id=81

There are also others such as Toastman, Victec, Teaman... all have dedicated builds for N66U. Can't remember if AC66U is supported yet...
 
I'm also probably pretty unusual in that I run both radios at maximum output power of 200mW. It is worth mentioning that though it still runs warm at default of 80, it's not nearly as hot as at 200. But at 200mW it gives ridiculous range.
 
If it can be set for x then it should handle it. Esp for the cost of the router.

Looking at the feedback on that unit it seems to be a problem child quite a bit.

My old standby (the Linksys WRT54GL) lasted over 7 years on the first one, the 2nd 13 months so I went with what Overkill suggested and I'm happy as with it. Great speeds both wireless and wired and excellent range.

Bill
 
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
If it can be set for x then it should handle it.

The radio on my WRT-54G died not long after I increased the transmit power level above stock. Maybe it was a coincidence...
 
Quick question.

Asus leaves the channel selection on Auto from the start.

I have heard that may not be the best.

Any recommendations on what channels are preferred? I know you want to use something other than your neighbors. . .

28sgme.png


Thanks!
 
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