Originally Posted By: The Critic
Originally Posted By: Jimmy9190
It's not that we hate Fram or want to publicly disparage Fram products. For most of us I think the main issue is the simple fact that you can buy much better oil filters for the same and often less of a price than you can buy a Fram.
Plus there have been a lot of quality and construction problems and some engine problems with Fram reported over the years. Fram air filters are fine but I do not and will not use their oil filters.
Because they are ignorant that cardboard endcaps can be as good as metal end caps. They also refuse to believe that Fram's design has not shown an abnormally high number of failures in the field compared to other brands.
Fram's quality control is also better than Purolator or Wix. I have had a number of issues with Purolator and Wix products but I have NEVER had a quality control or fitment issue with a Fram product.
Mike:
Respectfully, I can't agree with your position on this. I will readily agree that we don't know of a rash of Fram-induced failures out there (doesn't mean that there aren't any happening, though).
What does it for me is the simple matter of comparing the construction. When I can get an obviously better-made and/or perhaps overbuilt filter for the same price, why on earth would I voluntarily contribute to Allied Signal's bottom line, when I can have better for myself.
If I needed a filter today, and all I could find was a Fram, I'd use it with reservation (and probably replace it early just because...).
For me, the question is, and has long been, "why bother with Fram?" (NOT that I expect a Fram to immediately destroy my engine). If virtually every other filter maker out there can provide obviously more robust filters, and still make a profit that keeps their shareholders happy, I'll go with virtually ANY of those over Fram any day of the week.
If fairness, I will add that Toyota itself (through Denso IIRC), makes an OEM filter that has no end caps at all, metal, cardboard, or otherwise. They're price competitive, and I would use one if I needed to because I've cut one open and inspected for myself. None of the sloppy glueing I've seen on a Fram, the filter structure is rigid (element and skeletal structure), and despite very hard work, it was very, very difficult to open the crimped ends, even with my razor sharp Leatherman tool knife. By contrast, I have (pictures provided in a long-ago thread) managed to tear apart a Fram element with my bare hands, and then manually crush it. That's something you can NEVER do to any of the metal cap designs, or a Toyota cap-free design.
Nope, no Frams for me (except in an emergency...).
