Why I buy American

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Originally Posted By: Nick R
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Not really.

Whats with all this pandering and cheerleading for American manufacturing ?
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Because the current biggest employer in the US is Walmart. That menas that overall, the industry that employs the most people in this country is RETAIL. If that is not sad, then I don't know what is. We need manufacturing jobs if we are to survive. We cannot live being a service industry only country.


Nick, they just REFUSE to 'get' this!!
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As long as their IT jobs have not yet been outsourced, all is OK.

I SOOOO wish that they were as doomsday worried about the obscene TRADE deficit, as they are about the budget deficit!!
Or as concerned about foreign entities/corporations taking U.S. over, as they are with those U.S. citizens of differing idealogies taking over.
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Just HOW far are these devout 'free-traders/global economists types/open marketers' willing to take their 'principles', to the outright destruction of OUR country???!!!

But NOOOO, just keep right on helping/promoting/rewarding outsourcing and loss of manufacturing (in the name/glory of IMPOSSIBLE/UNSUSTAINABLE stock dividends/returns) while at the same time wanting to cut to nothing EVERY ONE OF and ALL of the middle class' 'safety nets'.

Yeah, that sounds like a 'great' plan for "recovery".
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Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
For the record: I have owned stock in WMT for the past 15 years and I think its a great company. I worked retail when I was 14 years old ($3.25 an hour back then) and theres nothing wrong with that type of job. If you don't like it get some schooling and go onto a better job with better pay. Don't complain that you are at a dead end job with low pay and high stress.

What gets my blood boiling is that all these Pro Union folks are now blaming other countries for the loss of jobs and industries here in the USA but will not take any blame for slowing destroying our country over the past 40 years.

Labor Unions accomplished exactly what the Communists couldn't do..... destroy our great nation.



The Federal and State governments have more union employees than ALL the private(non governmental) companies combined.

Our own Government destroyed our great nation, not the working men and women.

Being intimately familiar with your postings in the past, that is all I will have to say on the subject.

And for the record. I am NOT, nor have I EVER been a member of ANY union.
 
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
I'm all for the USA, but its foolish not to accept that manufacturing is simply a dying industry in our country.


A country that is on life support.

The US can not survive without industry and service jobs do not pay a great wage.If the trend continues,the only jobs will be,service jobs.What will be the next profession to outsource? Will it be IT jobs? Will it be CAD? Will it be executive positions?

While some may think that such cant happen,why not?

If a person had a profitable business and could earn even more by letting someone in another country run that business,for a quarter of the pay,why not? Many CEO's make millions here and to allow an CEO in say,India,to run a company at 100K would be of a huge benefit to both parties.

An education is not the end all when it comes to a job.There are jobs that must be done and getting a doctorate is of little use.Those that do these jobs are just as good as anyone else and if someone doesnt think so,that just shows what kind of person they are.

The US needs manufacturing jobs and it is a double standard to give foreign companies tax breaks etc. while American companies get stuck with trying to compete with those that get tax breaks and unfair trading practices.

It is not easy to compete with another company when the playing field isnt level.

I too worked in a service job when I was young and worked my way into manufacturing.I too am not and never have been a union worker.
 
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
For the record: I have owned stock in WMT for the past 15 years and I think its a great company. I worked retail when I was 14 years old ($3.25 an hour back then) and theres nothing wrong with that type of job. If you don't like it get some schooling and go onto a better job with better pay. Don't complain that you are at a dead end job with low pay and high stress.

What gets my blood boiling is that all these Pro Union folks are now blaming other countries for the loss of jobs and industries here in the USA but will not take any blame for slowing destroying our country over the past 40 years.

Labor Unions accomplished exactly what the Communists couldn't do..... destroy our great nation.



As a Union member I am offended
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. Seriously, It is comments like this why unions still need to be around. Not everybody can afford the luxury of going to college. Then what happens there. If everyone went to college then you would have a nation of college grads getting 3.25/hr because there are only so many well paying educated jobs. Punishing the working middle class is getting to be an old song and dance. Bring back the middle class and you will see the economy pick up. After all, it was the middle class that supported our communities, not the wealthy.
 
I am pretty old, but my Dad who died in 1981, would have been about a 100 now. He was in the machinist's union from day one in Chicago. You anti union guys maybe should look on your internet search to get some idea what life used to be before unions in the USA, for average people. 12 hour days, 6 days a week, no sick leave, no vacation, no PTO. No pay increases, $2-3 a week. No like $2-3 a week? The guy behind you will. If you get sick, too bad, no job. Slave wages, child labor, on and on, look it up. The rich were doing fine though.

Of course reading about it isn't quite the same as living it year after year.

That said, in my career I became on the other side, in an exempt position. I had a guy who couldn't do his job, was on the phone trading stocks 50% of the time, and wouldn't work. It was near impossible to fire him, and the union attacked me terribly, when I had done nothing of what they said etc. So there are two sides to it. That kind of unionizing is bad.

As a master machinist my Dad made $8.50/hr at Lockheed in the 70's at retirement age of 67. Pension $136/mo. Thanks to the union he got that much. Rarely he was not at work on Sat getting some overtime. Thank goodness for social security too. I think people are spoiled now. In the 70's most everything in the house was made in USA.

The Chinese average workers don't have this problem, they have only one choice, work your behind to death, or jump out the window. Which apparently some are doing in the Chinese factories. The rich in China are very rich, and are even buying up real estate in the USA. I see the pattern.
 
My post above was way too long, and personal, too late to delete. Short opinion:

1. Without strong unions of the past, you wouldn't have the benefits, working conditions (safety, hours, etc) and retirement packages of today. They wouldn't exist. There would probably be no internet to go to BITOG either.

2. Some unions today are too strong and hinder honest business practices, where some rules need to be enforced.
 
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Take some time and read whats happening.

http://www.dailyjobcuts.com/

I'm all for the USA, but its foolish not to accept that manufacturing is simply a dying industry in our country.

some kinds of manufacturing is gone, but some are thriving
heres a good one
they got the whole global thing figured out: engineering/manufacturing in the US, finishing/packaging in mexico, sales in Asia and Europe, financed by Israelis!
 
Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
For the record: I have owned stock in WMT for the past 15 years and I think its a great company. I worked retail when I was 14 years old ($3.25 an hour back then) and theres nothing wrong with that type of job. If you don't like it get some schooling and go onto a better job with better pay. Don't complain that you are at a dead end job with low pay and high stress.

What gets my blood boiling is that all these Pro Union folks are now blaming other countries for the loss of jobs and industries here in the USA but will not take any blame for slowing destroying our country over the past 40 years.

Labor Unions accomplished exactly what the Communists couldn't do..... destroy our great nation.



As a Union member I am offended
grin.gif
. Seriously, It is comments like this why unions still need to be around. Not everybody can afford the luxury of going to college. Then what happens there. If everyone went to college then you would have a nation of college grads getting 3.25/hr because there are only so many well paying educated jobs. Punishing the working middle class is getting to be an old song and dance. Bring back the middle class and you will see the economy pick up. After all, it was the middle class that supported our communities, not the wealthy.


Now I know that the end is near!!

We actually agree on something for once, say hallelujah! (and I'm a non-believer.
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The Indy situation was a rather unique one.

The JD Norman offer would have saved a small number of jobs, but the biggest problem for many of the local members was the fact that voting for the new ownership would have:

1 Lowered their wages substantially
2 Made the local members employees of JD Norman, in effect relinquishing any rights the employees might have in the future to transfer to another GM plant or facility as jobs opened up.

I believe that reason number 2 was by far the biggest reason they defeated the offer on the local level. Many of the members felt as if they could be able to transfer to another GM plant as GM started to re-hire from the layoff rolls. And that has started to happen, and these people will retain the seniority to fill those positions as they become available. If they had accepted the offer and become JD Norman employees, all their seniority and rights to transfer would have been lost.

And also, please note, the national office, supported this deal. They were behind it and supported the local members accepting the offer. The locals saw it differently.

This article brushes on the topic of the "gypsies" and the effect they had on this vote...

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/arch...workers/62606/#
 
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Our country needs people trying to do everything possible to keep jobs here in the USA and not some idiot clown talking about us havings another “Sputnik Moment”

Please take the time and read Daily Job Cuts if you think I am lying about whats going on.

GM Begins Stamping Plant Layoffs
http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/newsitem.asp?ID=45891

Thses Union folks just put themselves out of a job.



No I'd say all the foreign car sales and loss of domestic sales is what fundamental put them out of a job or lowered their wages. The real solution is to buy American but even when given a viable choice to do so most people aren't going to do it. Your line of reasoning leads to if American workers could work for less than the lowest cost country they wouldn't be out of a job. Even if that were possible that's no real solution. Besides some industries have been known to outsource even though the labor cost savings overall produced no net cost decrease.
 
I swear I'm not being hateful or political with this but I will never own a Mitsu for one reason. They tried to kill my Grandpa when he was on a Navy boat in WWII. Mitsubishi manufactured the engines for Japanese aircraft and I refuse to send a dollar to them. I have owned either a Dodge, Ford, or Chevy since 1998.
 
"12 hour days, 6 days a week, no sick leave, no vacation, no PTO. No pay increases, $2-3 a week. No like $2-3 a week? The guy behind you will. If you get sick, too bad, no job" This is pretty much the way the trucking industry operates. Some things never change.
 
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
Our country needs people trying to do everything possible to keep jobs here in the USA and not some idiot clown talking about us havings another “Sputnik Moment”

Please take the time and read Daily Job Cuts if you think I am lying about whats going on.

GM Begins Stamping Plant Layoffs
http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/newsitem.asp?ID=45891

Thses Union folks just put themselves out of a job.



No I'd say all the foreign car sales and loss of domestic sales is what fundamental put them out of a job or lowered their wages. The real solution is to buy American but even when given a viable choice to do so most people aren't going to do it. Your line of reasoning leads to if American workers could work for less than the lowest cost country they wouldn't be out of a job. Even if that were possible that's no real solution. Besides some industries have been known to outsource even though the labor cost savings overall produced no net cost decrease.


YES, and all of the "idiot clowns" in power with certain idealogies (and in the national CofC) who help, support, promote, and actually reward our country's manufacturers for outsourcing, as well as all of the foreign corporations (as well as greedy shareholders) who literally forced U.S. manufacturers to outsource (even if they themselves were unwilling) in order to just stay in business, let alone be competitive.
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I wonder how many of the "BUY AMERICAN!" crowd has a $50 Chinese-made floor jack. You could have bought a Milwaukee 2-ton model (made in USA)... but they're $600.

People are "BUY AMERICAN!" typically only until they have to open their wallets, then economic reality hits.

How many practice what they preach even if there's a 3-fold or 8-fold price differential?
 
Originally Posted By: Barkleymut
I swear I'm not being hateful or political with this but I will never own a Mitsu for one reason. They tried to kill my Grandpa when he was on a Navy boat in WWII. Mitsubishi manufactured the engines for Japanese aircraft and I refuse to send a dollar to them. I have owned either a Dodge, Ford, or Chevy since 1998.


There are probably a lot of companies with a nefarious history. Who knows what Mercedes, Nikon, VW, etc, did 70 years ago?

I think you need to let things go when they happened 7 decades earlier. The people who worked at Mitsubishi then aren't still around anymore, so your protest is basically against a company logo.
 
Originally Posted By: tonycarguy

I wonder how many of the "BUY AMERICAN!" crowd has a $50 Chinese-made floor jack. You could have bought a Milwaukee 2-ton model (made in USA)... but they're $600.

People are "BUY AMERICAN!" typically only until they have to open their wallets, then economic reality hits.

How many practice what they preach even if there's a 3-fold or 8-fold price differential?


As always it comes down to what you made of yourself as a Citizen. Study hard, Work hard, Do not be lazy and pay your dues.

Being able to afford American Products is all about your own success.

People that are unwilling to better themselves will never achieve anything.
 
Originally Posted By: tonycarguy

I wonder how many of the "BUY AMERICAN!" crowd has a $50 Chinese-made floor jack. You could have bought a Milwaukee 2-ton model (made in USA)... but they're $600.

People are "BUY AMERICAN!" typically only until they have to open their wallets, then economic reality hits.

How many practice what they preach even if there's a 3-fold or 8-fold price differential?


I buy American and Canadian as often as I can. I recently bought two new Snap-On ratchets. I could have bought two huge Chinese tool sets for the price of each ratchet, LOL!

ATI video cards (before they stopped producing whole cards in-house and before the merger with AMD) used to produced in Markham, about an hour away from me. Made them an easy choice!

My Blackberry is made in Ontario. RIM has a couple of facilities here. Others are in Mexico, and places around the world. The location of where it was made is stamped on the box, so it is easy to get one from here.

Western Digital is American, but they produce most (all?) of their drives overseas now.

EVGA is American, but their PCB's are assembled in China.

Cisco is American, but again, a lot of their stuff is made in China. Really depressing.

My Expedition was made in Chicago. The Michelin tires that are on it were made in the USA. The Motorcraft brakes that are on it were made in Mexico, as were the Motorcraft plugs I put in it. The coil packs were made in the USA though, IIRC.

My Motorcraft oil filters are made in the USA.

My Yorkville bass guitar amp was made in Toronto.

My Cerwin-Vega speakers (these are old) were made in the USA.

My floor jack is a million years old and was made in Canada.

Some of us really DO try sir!
 
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