M1 or a cheap dino with 3 oz.of Auto-Rx?
Which would be better?
- Thread starter GROUCHO MARX
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If you have an old car/truck that is leaking and/or burning oil, conventional motor oil is better. Synthetic would be wastful in that situation. Auto-RX could be used to clean the engine and maybe stop the seals from leaking.
If you have a new car/truck with no leaks and not burning oil, either conventional or synthetic oil could be used. Mobil 1 can be used in a new car/truck.
I'm sorry buster, I was speaking hypothetically from a one size fits all perspective.
It seems that synthetic oil keeps an engine cleaner than conventional oil. Would A-Rx and 3 or 4k changes accomplish the same thing with dino juice?
Just putting it out there.
![[I dont know]](/forums/graemlins/dunno.gif)
GM,
You can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear ...Adding a few oz of AutoRX might give you some increased detergency - about like a HD diesel engine oil. However, you would still not get the extreme temp performance or long drain intervals of a top grade synthetic.
Tooslick
Synthetic oil. No doubt about it. I LOVE AutoRx for cleaning. Cleaning what? All the CRAP that petroleum (G1 and G2) based oils left behind.
I'm sure you can improve an oil with AutoRx.
I'm sure you can improve an oil with LC.
Don't know nothing about Nuetra, etc. It probably works well also.
Every other additive that springs to mind is garbage. But my choice of oils without that stuff perform fine.
Then people who run synthetic oil would bever need Auto-Rx because the synthetic oil is a metal cleaner?
Not quite. Generally speaking, people who run synthetic oils after thousands of miles and do a physical inspection of the engine find them to be very clean and it some cases spotless. However, if you extend drains out to 15k + miles or drive very hard under severe conditions, synthetic oils will leave behind deposits and sludge if left too long. An oil can only clean so much as it's main job is to lubricate. Rx is a good supplement to any oil. Running it every 10-20k miles is a safety blanket. Running a maintenance dose with each oil change is another good idea. So all in all, a synthetic will keep your engine very clean and has cleaning abilities but certain conditions do exist under which any synthetic oil will leave behind crud you don't want in your engine. Note though that what a good synthetic will leave behind is very minimal compared to dino oils. Redline in particular is a good oil that keeps your engine clean.
Here is the one-size-fits-all ![[Freak]](/forums/graemlins/freak2.gif)
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Buy a pail of SAE 10W.
Since winter has more or less arrived use just that for your oil and filter change.
When spring comes add a can of VI improver like STP or whatever, to make a 10W30.
When summer arrives, change the filter, add a quart of top up oil and another can of STP which should make your blend a 15W40.
Repeat the sequence next November 1st. ![[Roll Eyes]](images/icons/rolleyes.gif)
Auto RX in a synthetic that already has an ester? What for?
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Buy a pail of SAE 10W.
Since winter has more or less arrived use just that for your oil and filter change.
When spring comes add a can of VI improver like STP or whatever, to make a 10W30.
When summer arrives, change the filter, add a quart of top up oil and another can of STP which should make your blend a 15W40.
Repeat the sequence next November 1st.
Auto RX in a synthetic that already has an ester? What for?userfriendly, that pail sounds awfully messy ![[Eek!]](images/icons/shocked.gif)
I was wondering why I would want to use a synthetic oil with A-RX and create that competition for the metal?
Why would one need A-Rx if using a synthetic oil, it seems redundant?
I was wondering why I would want to use a synthetic oil with A-RX and create that competition for the metal?
Why would one need A-Rx if using a synthetic oil, it seems redundant?The 10W is in my 77 Chev 250 6, 3 on the tree as of yesterday along with the 31/10.50/15 studded Goodyear Workhorse X Grip radials.
Yes, the tires cost more than the truck, offset by free parking and plug-ins downtown at work. ![[Big Grin]](images/icons/grin.gif)
You don't hear 3 on the tree too much these days. Do they make any?
"Buy a pail of SAE 10W.
Since winter has more or less arrived use just that for your oil and filter change.
When spring comes add a can of VI improver like STP or whatever, to make a 10W30."
In the mid sixties I had an old flat head Mercury that ran 10 weight in the winter. A bottle of STP in the spring did exactly that. Made the engine shut right up.
Drove it from South Dakota to Denver, The car salesman (think I paid $150 for it) told me to keep it under 60. It was overheating in the Badlands on a day with 100+ temperatures, so I floored the thing and got it up to 90. Thanks to all that STP I was able to get it into Rapid City with nary a thrown piston.
Groucho all oils leave some deposits behind. Synthetics leave fewer deposits behind in most cases. If someone abuses synthetic it will sludge and varnish.
PAO's lack nautral solvency and rely on additives to make up for this. Luckily the combination of less volitile base stock and a much better additive package amounts to a cleaner engine. Esters based oils are a step up in terms of low volitility, low deposits and natural solvency. THe natural solvency also allows then to hold a much beefier additive package and the solvency keeps deeposits in check.
It is better to use a well formulated oil then to try to improve it with additives. I have not done a cost comparsion but I would imagine that adding LC and Oil extrem to cheap oil would bring the cost of the oil up to that of a better oil. THeir are so many good oils now that it almost seems silly to try to use additives to make up for a poor oil.
It is entirely different to help a good oil be a great oil with additives. Adding a little LC to M1 or Schaffers is a lot different then adding LC,132,and oil extreme to Walmart oil to try and make it perform better.
For my new car I chose to use an oil that has all the solvency and aditives I need. For my old car I am considering playing the additive game just to play around!
From my UOA's, I think a good dino with 3 oz of AutoRx will easily perform as well as a synthetic, *IF* you stick to a 4k interval. Anyone care to dispute this? I've not seen any benefit to synthetics for short intervals (I'm not talking about turbo cars here).
Patman
Staff member
quote:We've definitely seen some awesome UOAs on here from conventional oils and blends, which point to the fact that they can do well in shorter drains. However for extremely hard driving, or extremely cold weather, a full synthetic is going to give you better results, even in short drains.
Originally posted by novadude: From my UOA's, I think a good dino with 3 oz of AutoRx will easily perform as well as a synthetic, *IF* you stick to a 4k interval. Anyone care to dispute this? I've not seen any benefit to synthetics for short intervals (I'm not talking about turbo cars here).
OK... maybe, just maybe, synthetics would do better, but we are probably talking about 1 ppm wear over 3k miles, or something. 10% reduction in wear for 400% increase in oil price is hardly worth it to me.
Having said that, I have a new job, and I am putting 500 miles / week on the 5.0 stang. I am considering synthetics and running extended intervals, I do not need to crawl under the car every 6-8 weeks. So far, dinos have served me well, sticking to a 3k-4k interval.
I saw Molakule address this a while back and he can run circles around most of us with the math and Chemistry; Auto-RX esters are by design cleaners and dispersants, with a backup of naturallubricity and EP adds so the cleaning is SAFE.
Motor oils are by design lubricants and "give up" the DEEP cleaning that RX can do so they can properly lube. Buster you have been taking notes from my dribble !
Generally speaking a 10K to 20K mile cleaning with RX is all that is needed to keep the sealed areas in top form. The maintenance doseage of RX is more of a liquid filter than a cleaner because its just too little of the product to get down and clean like 10 to 12 ounces is.
I prefer to run LC as a antioxidant, RX as a periodic cleaner and if I ever test the two for compatibility MAY be able to use the 2 together at the maintenance dosage which would make a low cost motor oil into a great blend. This might be the low cost highly effective answer to the High mileage oils that are touted by the major brands.
I am currently testing LC and Citgo $1 a qt oil for that type durability in a well worn BMW 1.8L 4 cyl that has just been Auto-Rx'd.
Honestly the Schaeffers blends are very solvent and have excellent lubricity just like I am describing in the mix above.
Imagine if we could design a liquid lube that filters itself, with RX I think it is possible. I wish Frank and Auto-RX had the R&D monies to fund that as I have some great ideas to revolutionize the lubricant industry and save you the consumer alot of money and time under the car !
Thanks Terry.
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