Which engineering job should I take?

[Rick in PA]

Originally Posted By: Shannow
Going to post starting out biased, but even as a graduate, I was going to be sitting in front of CAD, I'd quickly find a way to strangle myself with a mouse cord...maybe that's why they invented mouse cords....


No... that's why they have cordless mice.

I like the second option. More varied work. Good exposure to the various equipment the company makes. Hands-on, always a plus. Whip their test area into shape and see where the job takes you.

 

[Cujet]

You are going to be incredibly valuable, due to your background.

Of course, you know I'm going to say Aviation, as that's my field. It captivated me in a way that was incredible. The "cool" components, the "neat" stuff, the incredible engineering were all factors to me. And, they clearly were not available "all in one place" in any other field I had an interest in. But, more than that, aviation is a very harsh environment, intolerant of error and the engineering must be superb. Head and shoulders above my previous job in turbocharged engine design.

Put another way, what works on a car fails miserably on aircraft.

To me, aviation closely meets the human dream of going somewhere instantly. Today, we complain about 4 or 5 hour flights across the country. 100 years ago, it was a week long train ride. 200 years back a long trip took seasons.

Wednesday, I flew our Pilatus PC-12 from one job site to another. I tried to keep the flight below 5 minutes, and came really close. The clock ticked over 5 minutes, seconds before I landed. Driving would have been at least 45 minutes. To me, that's "cool". And that's what good engineering is all about.

Here is me at work:

http://cujet.com/html/work.html

Some good engineering:

 

[onion]

Thanks everybody for the advice. There's a lot to chew on here.

Honestly, the test engineering position feels like the easy option for me. I think I nearly HAVE that job at this point (I easily meet all their listed criteria, and the interview went very well), and I know I could do well at it. But... it isn't as big a departure from what I've done in the past... and I AM ready for a change.

I find the aircraft/design position a bit intimidating. There are several things to like about what I've seen, but there are far more unknowns. The industry is less stable. I know NOTHING specifically about the equipment (although I am pretty familiar with their CAD software). And it's a totally different work environment than what I'm used to. All this sounds either exciting or intimidating depending on what mood I'm in.

And now Tom Slick has thrown a wrench in the works. A well-rounded engineering position with plenty of shop time? On the west coast? [censored] yes I'm interested.

 

[Rick in PA]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
...To me, aviation closely meets the human dream of going somewhere instantly. Today, we complain about 4 or 5 hour flights across the country. 100 years ago, it was a week long train ride. 200 years back a long trip took seasons....


Excellent perspective, I share those thoughts. For all of human history, mankind has wanted to fly. There are aspects of our time that are virtually magical.

BTW, be careful in there, don't get something cross-wired!

 

[Pablo]

It's what you want. Which firm is more stable and growing (as opposed to wobbly, headed in the wrong direction)? Can you find anyone who works for the places and chat with them?

I know of course design is higher on the food chain, but the test engineer position would be more up your shoot, and you would be able to hit the ground running vs. all the aero guys and their lingo. You would be adding to the team much much quicker and would be more valued. Just my .02$

 

[onion]

That's a good point, Pablo.


Well, the latest update is that I got an offer today from the construction equipment place. They're paying significantly more than I expected, and the benefits are awesome (by my rather low diesel-mechanic standards).

I'm not ruling out my other option(s) at this point. I'm a weasel, and even though I've accepted an offer- I will drop them in favor of a better offer if one comes along. But the bar has been raised.

 

[Kiwi_ME]

I wanted to be a motorcycle mechanic when I was 16 but my dad was having nothing of that. While studying for my ME degree I had a chance to work as a motorcycle mechanic for a summer (at $2 an hour) and was quickly bored as I could easily match the performance of the senior mechanic who had 20 years experience.

Having 30 years under my belt now the only advice I can give you is that just about any engineering job can be interesting and challenging IF you apply yourself fully. The aspects that make me like a job are often unrelated to the technical side. Having great people to work with, competent and respectful management for example, but almost never salary. For me the social aspect trumps just about anything else because so much of your life is spent at work. Nothing is worst than hating your job because the people or company sucks.

However, if I had to make your choice just based on the technical side I would go for the aircraft position because it is going to be a lot more educational on the full gamut of professional engineering. It also could be hard to get into that industry once you are "branded" in some other field. Any ME can do the test engineer position and you already have the hands-on experience so there's little to learn. The aircraft company will teach you all the stuff you need to know that you didn't learn in school or from your last career.

 

[crinkles]

Originally Posted By: Kiwi_ME
I wanted to be a motorcycle mechanic when I was 16 but my dad was having nothing of that. While studying for my ME degree I had a chance to work as a motorcycle mechanic for a summer (at $2 an hour) and was quickly bored as I could easily match the performance of the senior mechanic who had 20 years experience.

Having 30 years under my belt now the only advice I can give you is that just about any engineering job can be interesting and challenging IF you apply yourself fully. The aspects that make me like a job are often unrelated to the technical side. Having great people to work with, competent and respectful management for example, but almost never salary. For me the social aspect trumps just about anything else because so much of your life is spent at work. Nothing is worst than hating your job because the people or company sucks.

However, if I had to make your choice just based on the technical side I would go for the aircraft position because it is going to be a lot more educational on the full gamut of professional engineering. It also could be hard to get into that industry once you are "branded" in some other field. Any ME can do the test engineer position and you already have the hands-on experience so there's little to learn. The aircraft company will teach you all the stuff you need to know that you didn't learn in school or from your last career.


Well said. Good advice

 

[jaj]

Originally Posted By: onion
...I'm a weasel, and even though I've accepted an offer- I will drop them in favor of a better offer if one comes along...


You're kidding, right? Life is a long game so play it with care. "What goes around, comes around" is not just an expression, it's a statement of fact. For the rest of your career you'll keep crossing paths with the people you are meeting now, so if you've made a commitment, honor it. Choosing not to do so will poison your future in ways you'll never even know about - negative outcomes from not living up to your commitments are totally predictable and completely inescapable.

 

[onion]

I am absolutely NOT kidding. If I agree to work for a company, I'll do so (and do it well) for as long as it suits me. If/when it no longer suits me, I'll go elsewhere. And if that point comes before I even show up on the first day... well that's how things panned out.

Do you think I've signed up for a term of indenture or something?

If somebody is petty enough to hold a grudge over me taking the best deal I can find... then I don't particularly want to work with them anyway.

 

[Kiwi_ME]

I forgot to add that's useful to work in a company big enough to have multiple mechanical engineers. You learn off them, share ideas and have a way to continuously gauge your own performance.

 

[Cujet]

A slight variation on this topic:

At university, I took an aero engineering major, coupled with flight. (the plan was to fly, or design, or both, OR fighter pilot)

My major was eliminated after 2.5 years, and I was given a choice of other majors. I chose maintenance/management and flight. As it sure looked like I was going to be a pilot, with a mechanics license.

Well, the jobs were in MX and I ended up with heart A-fib. So here is how is how I considered my career.

1) Jets pay better than props, they are built better and cleaner.
2) Airlines are union and the new guy works nights in the tire shop.
3) Corporate jets are a growing field.
4) Bigger corporate jets pay far better than the small ones.
5) Gulfstream jets are at the top and command the highest pay.

I "went for it", it was Gulfstream or nothing. Wow did that work out well!

I'm not here to say I'm smarter than the next guy. But I did make a number "correct" career decisions. Put another way, "all jobs such (you understand my misspelling) so you might as well take the one that pays best".

I wish you the very best. Decide carefully.

 

[onion]

I don't have a strong preference in general between the aircraft industry and the construction equipment industry. Aircraft potentially pays more, but it's also less stable and I'm (far) less familiar with the industry. Construction equipment (particularly this place) is pretty stable, and I'm very knowledgeable on the equipment even before I walk in the door. Though it may pay less in the long-run.

But the fact is that I have an offer in hand with the construction equipment place. And it's as good an offer as I had dared to hope for- a BIG improvement over the pinnacle of my mechanicing career. And if this is what they pay somebody starting out, then that means there's a significant amount of room to go 'up' from here. So here I'm looking at good pay (by my low standards anyway), relatively easy work, and a pretty good (though not particularly sexy) career path. I could do a LOT worse.

I still think it's likely that I'll hear back from the aircraft place. I had two in-person interviews, and they both went very well. Both seemed impressed with my mechanical background- which IS my one selling-point over your average recent graduate.

So today I'm thinking that they'll have to offer me significantly more money take the aircraft job. I haven't decided exactly what that number would be- but I'm thinking at least 10% more to justify the increased risk and steeper learning curve. I honestly don't know if that's realistic or not... but it can't hurt to negotiate.

 

[volk06]

A bird in the hand is worth more than two in the bush. Meaning you have a job offer in hand, if it comes down to it don't be foolish and turn down a job offer in hope that you'll get the other one. If you turn the one down and don't end up getting the other position your back to square one.

 

[onion]

Originally Posted By: volk06
A bird in the hand is worth more than two in the bush. Meaning you have a job offer in hand, if it comes down to it don't be foolish and turn down a job offer in hope that you'll get the other one. If you turn the one down and don't end up getting the other position your back to square one.


Yes, I understand that- and that's why I fully intend to accept the offer that I already have. In this economy, I'm not ABOUT to turn down any reasonable offer unless/until I have another in-hand. I've already accepted verbally; I'll put it in writing on Monday.

But this is not a contract, and is in no way binding on either side of the deal. If a better deal comes along, I still intend to give it full consideration... just as I would if I had worked for any company for ANY length of time. Maybe things are different in Canada where Jaj lives- but here in the U.S. there is no such thing as employee or employer loyalty these days. That's a thing of the past.

No quarter asked nor given. Every man for himself. I don't particularly like it, but that's the world I find myself in.

 

[iskerbibel]

So just to give anyone who might be interested an update:

I initially accepted the offer with the construction equipment company- and it was a good offer. But soon after that, the aircraft company called with a nearly identical offer. So I stewed over it a few days, and ended up dropping the construction equipment company in favor of the aircraft company.

And several months later, I still feel like I've made the right decision. It's a fun and interesting job. I'm learning new stuff daily, working with interesting people and equipment, getting paid well, AND enjoying more time off than I've had since I was a kid. It isn't perfect, but overall I really can't complain.

Lemme tell you, the difference between working as a diesel mechanic vs. working as a mechanical design engineer is night & day. It's been quite an adjustment in some ways- I've had to learn how to multi-task, dress like a grown-up, and sit on my [censored] most of the day. I've put on a few pounds- need to work on that- but overall it's been an awesome upgrade.

 

[SteveSRT8]

An increasingly rare tale as 80+ percent of recent college grads are moving back in with parents over lack of work!

Glad you found something interesting and satisfying. It's a rare thing to find anyone who likes their work these days.

 

[Mr Nice]

80% ???
Are things really that bad

I'm happy that the OP landed (no pun intended) a great job with the airplane manufacturer.

 

[iskerbibel]

Originally Posted By: LT4 Vette
80% ???
Are things really that bad

I'm happy that the OP landed (no pun intended) a great job with the airplane manufacturer.



A little googling will reveal that that statistic isn't true at all. I dare not post a link as there might be (gasp!) profanity hidden somewhere in the comments. Just google "boomerang generation debunked". This 80% number is often repeated by sources who reckon it's in their interests to over-state just how bad the economy is- whether they're trying to sell sensational news stories or make a political point.

That said, the job market IS much tougher these days than it was in years past. If you majored in history, communications, art, or the like- you're gonna have a tough time finding gainful (and appropriate) employment. But the vast majority of recent engineering grads that I know have had no problem finding employment. Same goes for nurses, accountants, and in-demand (often somewhat vocational) majors like that.

Myself, I'm not your typical recent grad. I was a diesel mechanic for 16 years, and that experience counts to some extent. Both places that made me an offer specifically said that my mechanical experience was the deciding factor- although I work with plenty of 'green' kids fresh out of college at my current job. Lots of them have masters degrees, double majors, a pilot's license, etc. that helped get them in the door.

 

[SteveSRT8]

No overstating is needed when discussing our economy. None.

It stinks, period. There is no need to dress it up in anyone's spin. It just stinks.