Wheel comes off vehicle while driving, Honda Fit

[urchin]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


BTW, have you actually ever DRIVEN an ///M-series car or are you just running your lips because you like to hear yourself talk and think that there are people on this board stupid enough to believe you?


You sure protest ...too much.

Yes, I have driven quite a number of M series cars all the way back to the late 80s.

I'm telling you that it is a FACT that as time goes by BMWs even the M series are becoming bloated luxo barges that have even lost their handling edge as can be witnessed by the latest M series models demonstrate. If you don't believe me I tell folks here to go check out the reviews of the latest 5 series ...the handling is not as good as it has been and the controls are becoming numb as well. The cars are heavy as lead too.

The best M series ever were probably from the late 80s, because they were not just fast, they were really engaging drives too. Driver controls (steering, brakes, shift, clutch, ect) were precise and had excellent feedback. It cannot be said of the most recent BMW models. Heck even the "ordinary" 3 and 5 series from that time were just amazing handling cars and very engaging too. They were the epitome of a "drivers" car. and still are the standard. They didn't NEED huge wheels and brakes because they weren't bloated.

There are PLENTY of cars that go fast out there, but for a while BMW was among the few that had the driver interaction down to a T. They have LOST that, it is a fact.

 

[cchase]

Originally Posted By: urchin
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


BTW, have you actually ever DRIVEN an ///M-series car or are you just running your lips because you like to hear yourself talk and think that there are people on this board stupid enough to believe you?


You sure protest ...too much.

Yes, I have driven quite a number of M series cars all the way back to the late 80s.

I'm telling you that it is a FACT that as time goes by BMWs even the M series are becoming bloated luxo barges that have even lost their handling edge as can be witnessed by the latest M series models demonstrate. If you don't believe me I tell folks here to go check out the reviews of the latest 5 series ...the handling is not as good as it has been and the controls are becoming numb as well. The cars are heavy as lead too.

The best M series ever were probably from the late 80s, because they were not just fast, they were really engaging drives too. Driver controls (steering, brakes, shift, clutch, ect) were precise and had excellent feedback. It cannot be said of the most recent BMW models. Heck even the "ordinary" 3 and 5 series from that time were just amazing handling cars and very engaging too. They were the epitome of a "drivers" car. and still are the standard. They didn't NEED huge wheels and brakes because they weren't bloated.

There are PLENTY of cars that go fast out there, but for a while BMW was among the few that had the driver interaction down to a T. They have LOST that, it is a fact.


I'm inclined to agree with Overkill here but I can see where you are coming from too. Certainly BMW has lost some of its edge.

However, most cars are "bloated" because the gub'mint says they have to protect dopes who can't even be bothered to buckle up. If doing that mandates larger brakes, it mandates larger wheels to fit them.

Check the stopping distances, especially repeated emergency stops, of even your beloved 80's BMW's compared to a "bloated" new M5, or even an E39 like Overkill, and you'll see the point.

 

[Pop_Rivit]

It's amazing to see how far off the original topic that posters can pull a thread when they feel their toes have been stepped upon. It's turned from a thread about a wheel coming off a young girls vehicle to a "my car is better than your car" chest thumping contest.

 

[urchin]

OK, back on topic.

So does "Daddy" feel at least somewhat responsible for allowing the parts counter monkey to operate on his young daughter's brand new 25k car, just so he could save 30 or 40 bucks?

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: urchin
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


BTW, have you actually ever DRIVEN an ///M-series car or are you just running your lips because you like to hear yourself talk and think that there are people on this board stupid enough to believe you?


You sure protest ...too much.

Yes, I have driven quite a number of M series cars all the way back to the late 80s.

I'm telling you that it is a FACT that as time goes by BMWs even the M series are becoming bloated luxo barges that have even lost their handling edge as can be witnessed by the latest M series models demonstrate. If you don't believe me I tell folks here to go check out the reviews of the latest 5 series ...the handling is not as good as it has been and the controls are becoming numb as well. The cars are heavy as lead too.

The best M series ever were probably from the late 80s, because they were not just fast, they were really engaging drives too. Driver controls (steering, brakes, shift, clutch, ect) were precise and had excellent feedback. It cannot be said of the most recent BMW models. Heck even the "ordinary" 3 and 5 series from that time were just amazing handling cars and very engaging too. They were the epitome of a "drivers" car. and still are the standard. They didn't NEED huge wheels and brakes because they weren't bloated.

There are PLENTY of cars that go fast out there, but for a while BMW was among the few that had the driver interaction down to a T. They have LOST that, it is a fact.


While I can agree that BMW has had a "luxury slide" since the E39 cars (which is the general consensus), it in no way takes away from the fact that cars prior to this still had big brakes (and subsequently, larger wheels) and weren't that heavy. Again, I use the E39 as an example.

There is a point at which wheel size is excessive. It varies with the vehicle, its use, and its weight. A 6000lb SUV doesn't need the same brakes as a 3500lb Porsche. And there isn't a chance in [censored] that the SUV needs larger wheels. But of course we see plenty of that. The "dubs" fad is ridiculous.

You are skipping over most of my argument and instead cherry picking BMW as your point of focus. Skip BMW then, what about the Cobra? Corvette? Porsche? Ferrari? The list goes on and on. They all have larger wheels to accommodate their large brakes. Where that size of wheel doesn't belong is on a Civic, Camry, Accord, Fusion, Focus, Cruze, Escalade, Navigator, Explorer, F-150, Silverado.....etc.


In fact, to bring this a bit back OT:

How many of those dubbed-out cars or trucks cause accidents because they are horribly under-braked for the wheels, the wheels are cheap Chinese junk, or the offset is all wrong and they break crucial suspension components?

It ties into the parts store monkey who thought he knew what he was doing. These are the same guys telling Jimmy R-wing that the 22" Chie-wow rims cast in "whoknowswhatpart" of industrial China would be super-fly on his Civic, all he needs to do to complete the look is take a die grinder to those pesky stock springs!

 

[javacontour]

You assume the larger wheels are heavier. I went from the factory 16" wheels on my 1998 Ford Contour SVT to O.Z. Racing 17" wheels and got a lighter. stronger wheel, reducing un-sprung weight and rotating mass.

I believe the factory wheels were in the about 20#, and the replacements were just under 15#, IIRC. No more costly than a new wheel from Ford at $280/wheel.

You can make better choices than the factory wheels and end up with a better performing car.

You can also buy the $99 wheels that weigh 25 pounds each and do worse. But don't assume that larger wheels equals more mass and worse performance.

Originally Posted By: urchin
My question would be why would you want a huge wheel for a car like this heck the there is NO practical benefit at all in larger wheel sizes. It adds unsprung weight to the suspension (decreases handling ) and increases braking distances as well.

No ordinary passenger car has any need at all for anything over a 16" wheel. Even most performance cars actually have degraded handling with wheels over 16" not to mention the weight it adds.

The only positive thing about them is the huge extra profit they make for the manufacturers.

I still say that the girls father should have known better than to trust a parts store with touching the car. Firstly it is involving the safety of his daughter and secondly almost everybody knows about the incompetence of auto parts chain stores! Even this guy should have known.

I think they were being extremely cheap!

I bet that if the buyer would have simply gone back to the dealer and asked for locking lug nuts they would have installed them for free only charging for the parts. Sadly I bet the Honda Geniune locks would have only been a few bucks more than the junky autp parts store product.

 

[rpn453]

Originally Posted By: urchin
They didn't NEED huge wheels and brakes because they weren't bloated.


But mainly because they were extremely slow by modern standards!

I agree with most of what you're saying, but high performance cars are simply heavier and more powerful now, whether you like it or not, and some need the wheels to suit that.

I obviously misinterpreted your original wheel comment in the first half of my previous post. Sorry, I should have been sleeping by that point!

Anyway, it's almost hard to believe that anyone could thread on the wrong lugnuts without noticing. I've never come across two different threads that weren't obviously incompatible, especially not when they're that big. Everyone is lucky that there were no severe consequences. But it's still just an honest mistake. The parts store should apologize, pay all damages including a rental car, and offer a free set of winter tires and wheels or something like that for the inconvenience.

 

[hypervish]

Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: urchin
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL


BTW, have you actually ever DRIVEN an ///M-series car or are you just running your lips because you like to hear yourself talk and think that there are people on this board stupid enough to believe you?


You sure protest ...too much.

Yes, I have driven quite a number of M series cars all the way back to the late 80s.

I'm telling you that it is a FACT that as time goes by BMWs even the M series are becoming bloated luxo barges that have even lost their handling edge as can be witnessed by the latest M series models demonstrate. If you don't believe me I tell folks here to go check out the reviews of the latest 5 series ...the handling is not as good as it has been and the controls are becoming numb as well. The cars are heavy as lead too.

The best M series ever were probably from the late 80s, because they were not just fast, they were really engaging drives too. Driver controls (steering, brakes, shift, clutch, ect) were precise and had excellent feedback. It cannot be said of the most recent BMW models. Heck even the "ordinary" 3 and 5 series from that time were just amazing handling cars and very engaging too. They were the epitome of a "drivers" car. and still are the standard. They didn't NEED huge wheels and brakes because they weren't bloated.

There are PLENTY of cars that go fast out there, but for a while BMW was among the few that had the driver interaction down to a T. They have LOST that, it is a fact.


While I can agree that BMW has had a "luxury slide" since the E39 cars (which is the general consensus), it in no way takes away from the fact that cars prior to this still had big brakes (and subsequently, larger wheels) and weren't that heavy. Again, I use the E39 as an example.

There is a point at which wheel size is excessive. It varies with the vehicle, its use, and its weight. A 6000lb SUV doesn't need the same brakes as a 3500lb Porsche. And there isn't a chance in [censored] that the SUV needs larger wheels. But of course we see plenty of that. The "dubs" fad is ridiculous.

You are skipping over most of my argument and instead cherry picking BMW as your point of focus. Skip BMW then, what about the Cobra? Corvette? Porsche? Ferrari? The list goes on and on. They all have larger wheels to accommodate their large brakes. Where that size of wheel doesn't belong is on a Civic, Camry, Accord, Fusion, Focus, Cruze, Escalade, Navigator, Explorer, F-150, Silverado.....etc.


In fact, to bring this a bit back OT:

How many of those dubbed-out cars or trucks cause accidents because they are horribly under-braked for the wheels, the wheels are cheap Chinese junk, or the offset is all wrong and they break crucial suspension components?

It ties into the parts store monkey who thought he knew what he was doing. These are the same guys telling Jimmy R-wing that the 22" Chie-wow rims cast in "whoknowswhatpart" of industrial China would be super-fly on his Civic, all he needs to do to complete the look is take a die grinder to those pesky stock springs!

I have to agree with OverKill. There's a reason he has 18" wheels. < And, it's not to show off. Would you rather he have tiny brakes that can't stop him from plowing into your car at a redlight or "massive" brakes that will stop him in a matter of seconds?

 

[GMBoy]

My question a few pages ago remains unanswered:

Is this girl who had the wheel come off pretty?? If so, that explains why the parts store guy installed them for her.

 

[urchin]

Originally Posted By: hypervish


I have to agree with OverKill. There's a reason he has 18" wheels. < And, it's not to show off. Would you rather he have tiny brakes that can't stop him from plowing into your car at a redlight or "massive" brakes that will stop him in a matter of seconds?


Actually I'd rather have less bulk and luxo [censored] on that "performance/sporty car" so that I didn't need ugly expensive huge "dubs" to fit equally expensive brakes so that I can slow down as fast as my old 1985 5 series BMW did. Not to mention the prices for those huge tires as well.

 

[Papa Bear]

Originally Posted By: GMBoy
My question a few pages ago remains unanswered:

Is this girl who had the wheel come off pretty?? If so, that explains why the parts store guy installed them for her.




Good post, GMBoy, you seem to be the only one with his eye on the ball in this thread.

OP, PLEASE ANSWER THE QUESTION !!!.....

 

[morris]

time to spank a teen ager

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: urchin
Originally Posted By: hypervish


I have to agree with OverKill. There's a reason he has 18" wheels. < And, it's not to show off. Would you rather he have tiny brakes that can't stop him from plowing into your car at a redlight or "massive" brakes that will stop him in a matter of seconds?


Actually I'd rather have less bulk and luxo [censored] on that "performance/sporty car" so that I didn't need ugly expensive huge "dubs" to fit equally expensive brakes so that I can slow down as fast as my old 1985 5 series BMW did. Not to mention the prices for those huge tires as well.


What model did you own? Out of curiosity.

 

[bigmike]

Originally Posted By: Pop_Rivit
It's amazing to see how far off the original topic that posters can pull a thread when they feel their toes have been stepped upon. It's turned from a thread about a wheel coming off a young girls vehicle to a "my car is better than your car" chest thumping contest.


+1 It turned into a fail.

 

[sciphi]

It's also possible to get aftermarket lug nuts that fit a Honda wheel stud from somebody besides Honda. Our Honda has a whole second set of lug nuts for its winter wheels. We got them with the wheels. They work without an issue.

It's amazing how much leeway a pretty face can get in this world.

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: Papa Bear
Originally Posted By: GMBoy
My question a few pages ago remains unanswered:

Is this girl who had the wheel come off pretty?? If so, that explains why the parts store guy installed them for her.




Good post, GMBoy, you seem to be the only one with his eye on the ball in this thread.

OP, PLEASE ANSWER THE QUESTION !!!.....

Sure, she's a good looking young lady. *ahem* ...said the counter 'man'.

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: sciphi
It's also possible to get aftermarket lug nuts that fit a Honda wheel stud from somebody besides Honda. Our Honda has a whole second set of lug nuts for its winter wheels. We got them with the wheels. They work without an issue.

It's amazing how much leeway a pretty face can get in this world.


Interesting that another posted the Dorman would be rusted in no time...probably?

I figure they produce a more 'generic' offering, not really custom or specific; at least in this particular vehicle OBVIOUSLY.

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
Originally Posted By: sciphi
It's also possible to get aftermarket lug nuts that fit a Honda wheel stud from somebody besides Honda. Our Honda has a whole second set of lug nuts for its winter wheels. We got them with the wheels. They work without an issue.

It's amazing how much leeway a pretty face can get in this world.


Interesting that another posted the Dorman would be rusted in no time...probably?

I figure they produce a more 'generic' offering, not really custom or specific; at least in this particular vehicle OBVIOUSLY.


That would be me. Dorman may offer lugs with the proper fit but they are china junk that the finish comes off and will rust in no time. But there are aftermarket brands like McGard made in USA with the proper fit that are higher quality than even Honda OE and at a much better price. Of course most discount auto parts stores don't carry them.

 

[hypervish]

Pictures would do this thread wonders!

 

[cchase]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
Originally Posted By: sciphi
It's also possible to get aftermarket lug nuts that fit a Honda wheel stud from somebody besides Honda. Our Honda has a whole second set of lug nuts for its winter wheels. We got them with the wheels. They work without an issue.

It's amazing how much leeway a pretty face can get in this world.


Interesting that another posted the Dorman would be rusted in no time...probably?

I figure they produce a more 'generic' offering, not really custom or specific; at least in this particular vehicle OBVIOUSLY.


That would be me. Dorman may offer lugs with the proper fit but they are china junk that the finish comes off and will rust in no time. But there are aftermarket brands like McGard made in USA with the proper fit that are higher quality than even Honda OE and at a much better price. Of course most discount auto parts stores don't carry them.


I have found it amazing how the quality of aftermarket lug nuts varies. And, as you have found, McGard is worth every penny. The Chinese stuff can go either way but I haven't seen a Chinese chrome lug nut last more than a year without turning to rust.