very true, water injection is the only real way to prevent carbon build up, I cant imagine the piston or rings being harmed from sucking water thru the vacuum lines unless you hydrolock. I dont think your cat is collapsed either. I am dying to know what caused the lack of power though.
Water Cylinder Decarbonizing... Should I?
- Thread starter BlazerLT
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Hey,
Ok I want to see if I get this straight. Say if your using FP & LC, overtime as both products cleans, you wouldn't need to use water am I correct?? Then again, it depends how picky you are about engine cleanliness.
For the same results it's a matter of time. Water cleans out the engines internals within minutes, FP and LC follow the same principle overtime(keyword)with less risk, if any. Am I following this right??
I'm only theorectically(sp?) thinking, so please feel free to correct me,,,,,,AR
Ok I want to see if I get this straight. Say if your using FP & LC, overtime as both products cleans, you wouldn't need to use water am I correct?? Then again, it depends how picky you are about engine cleanliness.
For the same results it's a matter of time. Water cleans out the engines internals within minutes, FP and LC follow the same principle overtime(keyword)with less risk, if any. Am I following this right??
I'm only theorectically(sp?) thinking, so please feel free to correct me,,,,,,AR
i have done the water injection thing on lots of 2cycle and 4cycle engines. it awalys seems to work good. you have to do it sparingly on a 2cycle though.
i have HEARD that supposedly back in ww1 or ww2 alot of the fighter aircraft used waterinjection to avoid burning up their engines when in combat and stressing the engines. is this true? i cannot say, its just what i heard. i have also heard that some of those engines often had nitrous installed.
the harrier uses water injection. no doubt a jet engine is quite different from an ice however.
i have HEARD that supposedly back in ww1 or ww2 alot of the fighter aircraft used waterinjection to avoid burning up their engines when in combat and stressing the engines. is this true? i cannot say, its just what i heard. i have also heard that some of those engines often had nitrous installed.
the harrier uses water injection. no doubt a jet engine is quite different from an ice however.
Yes many WW2 era piston aircraft used water, methanol, or nitrous injections. It raised the effective ocatne of the fuel and increased power (especially at high altitudes for some systems).
Same premise for car water injection. You inject some into the intake stream, then you can up to boost or advance the ignition timing and gain some power.
Same premise for car water injection. You inject some into the intake stream, then you can up to boost or advance the ignition timing and gain some power.
Water injection was used on supercharged and turbocharged military aircraft engines in WWII and into the 1960s. It was primarlily used to cool the intake air charge to control detonation. Sort of a short term extra intercooler.
It was also used in a lot of early military jet engines to cool the intake charge. A turbo jet runs a bunch of excess air through the engine to keep internal temps low enough to not damage the engine. You can use some of that extra air by adding more fuel, then also add some water spray to keep from melting the engine.
Alcohol water mixes were also used on some engines.
If you look at 1950s era military movies with jets taking off leaving a lot of black smoke, that was usually from extra fuel and water injection.
Patman
Staff member
Hey Blazer very cool of you to document the process throuhg video and pictures as well as words.
As soon as I heard you talking I had to come and see if you had posted your location---yup, you're a Canuck! LOL!
As soon as I heard you talking I had to come and see if you had posted your location---yup, you're a Canuck! LOL!
yes the Germans were the first to use Nitrous in WWII, I remember them interviewing an allied pilot on the history channel and he said the Mezzerschmidt (spell) could just PULL away HARD during dog fights. German engineering is always innovative and ahead of its time!
Water injection was used extensively on fighter planes in WWII.
This prevented piston damage, not caused it.
Won't clean your fuel system, though.
This prevented piston damage, not caused it.
Won't clean your fuel system, though.
Hello! I have heard about water cylinder decarbonizing for many years and was quite interested to read this thread - thanks!
I was thinking about the posted comments in regard to the difficulties of metering the correct water volume into the engine and had 2 ideas that I think would work for my cars. What do you think?
Note: All of my cars are FI and have an L-shaped gismo on the rubber air intake between the air filter and the throttle body. I think that it is for noise dampening - it provides me an easy access port to the engine's incoming air / throttle-body area without tearing everything apart and losing air filtration.
1) What about inserting a wallpaper steamer in that port? These things produce a good amount of continuous steam that would seem to be about the right volume. Also, being steam already, as it enters the engine then it would flow very efficiently into the cylinders and get even hotter.
2) I have a new pressurized garden sprayer with a really nice spray adjustment that can make mist. I can insert this in the port and easily regulate the water volume.
The advantage I see in these approaches is that it does not depend on engine vacuum to suck water out of a bottle, which can be highly variable and may overload the engine with water if you don't know what you are doing (that's me!). I control the amount of water entering the engine as an independent setting, and if things go bad somehow I can instantly remove the water source. It seems to me that one of these methods would allow me to "fog" the engine with a small, continuous, constant volume of water over a longer period of time, allowing me to change engine speeds, etc and soften-up a lot of carbon.
I would appreciate your comments! Thanks!
I was thinking about the posted comments in regard to the difficulties of metering the correct water volume into the engine and had 2 ideas that I think would work for my cars. What do you think?
Note: All of my cars are FI and have an L-shaped gismo on the rubber air intake between the air filter and the throttle body. I think that it is for noise dampening - it provides me an easy access port to the engine's incoming air / throttle-body area without tearing everything apart and losing air filtration.
1) What about inserting a wallpaper steamer in that port? These things produce a good amount of continuous steam that would seem to be about the right volume. Also, being steam already, as it enters the engine then it would flow very efficiently into the cylinders and get even hotter.
2) I have a new pressurized garden sprayer with a really nice spray adjustment that can make mist. I can insert this in the port and easily regulate the water volume.
The advantage I see in these approaches is that it does not depend on engine vacuum to suck water out of a bottle, which can be highly variable and may overload the engine with water if you don't know what you are doing (that's me!). I control the amount of water entering the engine as an independent setting, and if things go bad somehow I can instantly remove the water source. It seems to me that one of these methods would allow me to "fog" the engine with a small, continuous, constant volume of water over a longer period of time, allowing me to change engine speeds, etc and soften-up a lot of carbon.
I would appreciate your comments! Thanks!
Hey,
I'm going to attempt this on my Ranger. I have followed all of BlazerLT's instructions, though however If I'm going to put water in my engine, I would rather it be distilled. I'm going to go the local drug store here in town and buy a gallon of that distilled water. I'll let everyone know how it turns out,,,,AR
I'm going to attempt this on my Ranger. I have followed all of BlazerLT's instructions, though however If I'm going to put water in my engine, I would rather it be distilled. I'm going to go the local drug store here in town and buy a gallon of that distilled water. I'll let everyone know how it turns out,,,,AR
Here's some info on water injection kits if you want clean as you drive all the time.
http://www.racetep.com/wik.html
http://www.h20injection.com/forum/phpBB2
http://www.racetep.com/wik.html
http://www.h20injection.com/forum/phpBB2
I'm thinking of attaching a "tee" to the "PCV valve to intake" hose so PCV valve will not be disabled. One additional hose to be attached to the "tee" and I will sımply dip other end of it into the window washer tank. PCV only closes at higher or full throttle, so when it closes it'll automaticallly suck the water. This would be a "clean-as-you-drive" thing. Only sucks water (if works) at high throttle when fluid is most effective; when driving -everything is hot and while the engine is under load.
Problem is that the diameter of the hose dipped into the water tank. This can be adjusted with nozzles, but I have no idea how to calculate a reasonable dia. so I'm dependant on trial & error. To be safe I'll keep this at a minimum with a nozzle out from a medical shyringe(sp?).
Very simple, one thin hose "T"ed to the pcv hose. I wonder what do you think about this using the PCV valve's function? Any ideas to calculate the nozzle diameter?
Problem is that the diameter of the hose dipped into the water tank. This can be adjusted with nozzles, but I have no idea how to calculate a reasonable dia. so I'm dependant on trial & error. To be safe I'll keep this at a minimum with a nozzle out from a medical shyringe(sp?).
Very simple, one thin hose "T"ed to the pcv hose. I wonder what do you think about this using the PCV valve's function? Any ideas to calculate the nozzle diameter?
The Spearco system looks and sounds just like the Edlebrock system I had on my 1972 Dodge truck about 1978. It worked well except the nozzles plugged up frequently. They needed to be cleaned at least once a month.quote:
Originally posted by 427Z06:
Here's some info on water injection kits if you want clean as you drive all the time.
http://www.racetep.com/wik.html
http://www.h20injection.com/forum/phpBB2
I was able to tune an engine that wanted premium for max economy and run it on regular. No small thing when it was a gas guzzling camper carrying truck.
Isn't the PCV valve usually as the distal side of the hose (meaning at the valve cover vs. at the air cleaner)? If you teed into a vacuum line downstream of the PCV valve you would get full-time vacuum, the same as if you were using any other vacuum line. Ideally you would use a second PCV valve purchased at the store at the tee.
I thought it would only suck the gases if the water level maintained lower. When it closed only then it sucks up the water. But I know nothing about the flow dynamics... distal, proximal plus the diameters and water level... it willl cost some trial... Thanks for the point.
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