VW to kill off petrol and diesel combustion cars from 2026

[double vanos]

A solid 400 mile range with 10 minute charge times would be ideal. I have great hope we can get there. The ICE has had over 100+ years of development time and tons of cash invested in it and it shows. Imagine going back in time to 1915 with a modern car. They couldn't handle it! Even the big 3 skunk works of that time would take years, maybe decades, to digest what's currently on sale today. Battery electric cars are in the beginning stages of development compared to fully matured ICE vehicles. Will it take time? Yes. Is it that far off? Maybe not as far off as you think. As long as capitalism exists, well you know what they say; " if there's money to be made, somebody will make it..."

 

[anndel]

Wait and see in 2025 if this becomes a reality. Perhaps they're doing this to ask the world for forgiveness from the diesel emissions scandal.

 

[Bjornviken]

Originally Posted by andyd

Will Germany have the generating and transmission capacity to support all these EVs? No country in the western hemisphere does. Do they?

Russia have. They buy from them

 

[Bjornviken]

How about heavy duty trucks?

 

[SonofJoe]

I'm as much a cynic as the next man but I'm convinced that this move is real and the mega-shift to EVs & autonomous vehicles IS coming. Unless you've been hiding under a rock, you must be aware now of respected, sober voices screaming about how climate change & global warming are already upon us & about to get a lot worse. VW's (& other major OEMs) are simly reacting to what they know is coming down the pipe, both in terms of government legislation & societal attitude change. No doubt this will all be decried, denied & resisted by the greedy, grasping, me-me-me, don't-you-dare-infringe-my-personal-rights, aging boomer generation but face it guys, another 10 - 20 years and we'll all be dead & no one will give a stuff what we think!

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted by PimTac

I would worry how this decision might affect VW sales of internal combustion vehicles between now and then?

I would suspect the VW/Audi dealers in this province would be shaking in their boots right now. I'm sure an electric VW would be an ideal car to take a road trip from Regina to Calgary on a -40 day. Sheesh.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

SonofJoe, since you seem to be fairly knowledgeable about several things, I want to ask you a question about the veracity of "climate change & global warming". If the US military has been doing it since the '60s, and China admits that they have been "modifying" weather, especially for the Olympics, how much of Al Gore's world do you think is contrived and manipulated onto us vs. what is naturally occurring? This is not a political question, it's asking to step back and look at things scientifically. As Linctex's signature says, the evidence demands a verdict, and I'm willing to bet it's not the same spiel we hear on the news everyday.

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted by philipp10

Like many others, your missing the story here. No one is saying we will be 100% electric soon. However, most families have 2 or 3 cars. Only one needs long range. I drive only 6 miles to work. But even if I drove 50 miles, an electric car would be great....as long as my other half have "the more capable" vehicle. 99 % of trips are within an electric cars range. Secondly, your missing the part where batteries improve. It's not a static world, 15 years ago a battery car seemed a pipe dream, yet here we are.

I get it, clear as day. Don't assume that because I did not articulate those points, I don't understand them. EV's can and do work (and I want one) I just don't look forward to driving today's affordable EV from FL to PA in the one day I have off. Cause it can't be done. I do a TON of interstate driving and I look around. Americans are flocking to SUV's and Pickup Trucks like never before. Big, comfortable, capable. It may be that the multi vehicle model is required for EV's to work. It also may be that current regulations pushing car safety and fuel economy have reduced the size and capability of the car to the point where the only viable option is a truck that is not subject to the same regulations. Something automotive experts saw coming for decades. The European model is the micro car, with many families owning multiple small cars. Family vacations include dad driving the Fiat Punto, mom the Seat Leon and the oldest child driving the Smart car.

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted by philipp10

Originally Posted by Cujet

Either these manufacturers know something we don't or they are betting on shaky future technology. Claims that people only need 150-300 mile range (the range of batteries available today from cheap to expensive) are not only false, but incredibly disingenuous. One look at our crowded American interstates clearly indicates that electric cars with 300 mile range are impractical on vacations, long interstate trips, sudden travel needs and so on. Stories abound about highway trips with EV's. Long charge times, slower cruise speeds to stretch range, poor heat, early charge stops due to charger locations, struggles when plans change and so on. I love the EV's, but without 600 mile range and 5 minutes charges, there will be problems. Furthermore, the argument that "you can just rent" falls flat too. Good luck finding a rental during season around here. A great quote from a Chevy Bolt owner: "Like other electric vehicle owners, we are more likely to go for lunch, stay overnight, or take in local attractions while we charge up, electric-car tourism should clearly be viewed as "dollars coming into a community." down the freeway at an average of 80 mph, we got nowhere near the 238-mile rated range. After 103 miles, we showed only 70 miles of remaining range"

Like many others, your missing the story here. No one is saying we will be 100% electric soon. However, most families have 2 or 3 cars. Only one needs long range. I drive only 6 miles to work. But even if I drove 50 miles, an electric car would be great....as long as my other half have "the more capable" vehicle. 99 % of trips are within an electric cars range. Secondly, your missing the part where batteries improve. It's not a static world, 15 years ago a battery car seemed a pipe dream, yet here we are.

Well... Apparently, VW is saying that. And I, for one, will believe it when I see it.

 

[PimTac]

Originally Posted by SonofJoe

I'm as much a cynic as the next man but I'm convinced that this move is real and the mega-shift to EVs & autonomous vehicles IS coming. Unless you've been hiding under a rock, you must be aware now of respected, sober voices screaming about how climate change & global warming are already upon us & about to get a lot worse. VW's (& other major OEMs) are simly reacting to what they know is coming down the pipe, both in terms of government legislation & societal attitude change. No doubt this will all be decried, denied & resisted by the greedy, grasping, me-me-me, don't-you-dare-infringe-my-personal-rights, aging boomer generation but face it guys, another 10 - 20 years and we'll all be dead & no one will give a stuff what we think!

I heard that UN speech too. I believe they gave us ten years before civilization is wiped out. I'm still waiting for the Ice Age that was the prediction for the year 2000 way back when. It's all Hong Kong Phooey.

 

[SonofJoe]

Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo

SonofJoe, since you seem to be fairly knowledgeable about several things, I want to ask you a question about the veracity of "climate change & global warming". If the US military has been doing it since the '60s, and China admits that they have been "modifying" weather, especially for the Olympics, how much of Al Gore's world do you think is contrived and manipulated onto us vs. what is naturally occurring? This is not a political question, it's asking to step back and look at things scientifically. As Linctex's signature says, the evidence demands a verdict, and I'm willing to bet it's not the same spiel we hear on the news everyday.

Okay, while I'm waiting for wifey to do her Xmas shopping, I'll have a go at answering your question... Yes, I read about the US military seeding clouds. I didn't hear about the Chinese playing with the weather for their Olympics but yes, I could believe they used cloud seeding as a way of getting rain clouds to dump their rain away from the sports arenas. However IMO it's a bit of a waste of expensive silver iodide when nature does essentially the same thing for free. Whilst this is 'interesting', it's not something that's ever going to be widely used. Also it's really a form of 'local weather change' as opposed to 'global climate change' which is what Brother Gore was prophesying all those years ago. I think most folks understand about 'the greenhouse effect'. Greenhouses 'trap' heat by letting light through the glass one way but not out again. If you're not a gardener, then you'll know the phenomenon by the act of getting in your car or truck. Always wondered why the inside is always so bloody hot? Greenhouse effect! Now just scale up your car to the size of the Earth and imagine instead of glass windows, a layer of carbon dioxide. Light from the Sun passes through the layer to get in but carbon dioxide (and other stuff like methane) restricts it's passage back out to space. The more CO2 you have, the greater level of energy retention. This bit is really simple schoolboy physics. The complicated bit is what all that trapped energy does to the climate? If we all got a uniform bit of extra energy, uniformly all the time, I for one would be v happy as it might improve The UK's damp & dismal climate! But that's not how it works. Weather systems are inherently chaotic. Just like boiling a kettle, adding more energy, drives the chaos with and increased risk of extreme weather events like hurricanes, heatwaves, snow storms, etc. One of the things that genuinely puzzles folks like me is given that Americans coined the terms global warming & climate change (50 years ago as I recall) and you see terribly destructive fires in California, massively powerful hurricanes hitting the southern states & massive dumps of snow storms on the Eastern Seaboard, why so many of you don't believe in GW/CC? Given that you are an advanced country blessed with so many brilliant scientists, why don't you believe what they're telling you?? Why are you so readily accepting of 'alternative theories' which reek of skullduggery & conspiracy? If you were seriously ill & needed an operation, would you really question the competence & motives of your brain surgeon because if it was me going under the knife, I might think this guy knows a lot more about this than me so I'll trust what he says! Sorry for the long winded reply but can I say one last thing. IMO opinion, the evidence DOES NOT demand a verdict! This clever but glib phrase might play well in a court of law but in my experience, science doesn't work this way. With science, you generally don't know more than you know but you still have to try and make sense if it. Developing engine oils is EXACTLY like this and unless you can live with masses of uncertainty & contradiction, you better not try and be an oil formulator because you will be expected to deliver some kind of end product, even if it's performance is uncertain. Climate change scientists face exactly the same challenge. Hope that helps.

 

[Trav]

We will see in 2025. I have a feeling that when the reality of lack of infrastructure sets it their plan will go right out the window. I would bet money on it, crack smoking seems to have taken root in all of Europe over the last few years.

 

[SonofJoe]

Originally Posted by Trav

We will see in 2025. I have a feeling that when the reality of lack of infrastructure sets it their plan will go right out the window. I would bet money on it, crack smoking seems to have taken root in all of Europe over the last few years.

Shouldn't you be just a teensy weensy bit more concerned about the truly apocalytic palls of smoke hovering over vast swathes of California than a few imagined wisps of crack smoke emanating from Wolfsburg? Also, should you really be betting money when the cost of the latest US hurricane season is estimated at a record high of $US 385 billion? Even in the US, this isn't exactly chump change.

 

[SonofJoe]

Getting back on topic, it looks like VW is initiating a 'significant cost cutting' move to pay for future investment. That's usually code for factory closures & lay-offs. https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/industry/volkswagen-plans-"significant"-cost-savings-invest-future

 

[SonofJoe]

Seems to be a day for interesting statistics... https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-n...record-number-of-miles-in-the-uk-in-2017 Just shows what you can do when you have some long-term, joined-up government thinking.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted by SonofJoe

Originally Posted by Trav

We will see in 2025. I have a feeling that when the reality of lack of infrastructure sets it their plan will go right out the window. I would bet money on it, crack smoking seems to have taken root in all of Europe over the last few years.

Shouldn't you be just a teensy weensy bit more concerned about the truly apocalytic palls of smoke hovering over vast swathes of California than a few imagined wisps of crack smoke emanating from Wolfsburg? Also, should you really be betting money when the cost of the latest US hurricane season is estimated at a record high of $US 385 billion? Even in the US, this isn't exactly chump change.

Not even the slightest bit concerned. Don't get the thread locked with this friggin stupidity. Stay on topic man and it aint global warming, climate change or whatever else.

 

[PimTac]

My guess is that VW is counting on the complete support and backing of the German govt in this decision. Frau Merkel is leading the change.

 

[wemay]

Originally Posted by SonofJoe

I'm as much a cynic as the next man but I'm convinced that this move is real and the mega-shift to EVs & autonomous vehicles IS coming. Unless you've been hiding under a rock, you must be aware now of respected, sober voices screaming about how climate change & global warming are already upon us & about to get a lot worse. VW's (& other major OEMs) are simly reacting to what they know is coming down the pipe, both in terms of government legislation & societal attitude change. No doubt this will all be decried, denied & resisted by the greedy, grasping, me-me-me, don't-you-dare-infringe-my-personal-rights, aging boomer generation but face it guys, another 10 - 20 years and we'll all be dead & no one will give a stuff what we think!

Agreed.

 

[HemiHawk]

What interests me the most about electric vehicles is the *hopefully* higher ease of maintenance. No more oil, no more gas, no more filters. Just charge it, make sure the tires are good, and good. Those motors must be easier to manufacture and troubleshoot compared to ICEs right? The other thing is that ranges have gotten very good. I think it was Musk/Tesla that claimed most American's don't drive more than 50 miles a day. Not sure if true, but even if its double that... an EV can do that no problem.

 

[philipp10]

Originally Posted by Astro14

Originally Posted by philipp10

Originally Posted by Cujet

Either these manufacturers know something we don't or they are betting on shaky future technology. Claims that people only need 150-300 mile range (the range of batteries available today from cheap to expensive) are not only false, but incredibly disingenuous. One look at our crowded American interstates clearly indicates that electric cars with 300 mile range are impractical on vacations, long interstate trips, sudden travel needs and so on. Stories abound about highway trips with EV's. Long charge times, slower cruise speeds to stretch range, poor heat, early charge stops due to charger locations, struggles when plans change and so on. I love the EV's, but without 600 mile range and 5 minutes charges, there will be problems. Furthermore, the argument that "you can just rent" falls flat too. Good luck finding a rental during season around here. A great quote from a Chevy Bolt owner: "Like other electric vehicle owners, we are more likely to go for lunch, stay overnight, or take in local attractions while we charge up, electric-car tourism should clearly be viewed as "dollars coming into a community." down the freeway at an average of 80 mph, we got nowhere near the 238-mile rated range. After 103 miles, we showed only 70 miles of remaining range"

Like many others, your missing the story here. No one is saying we will be 100% electric soon. However, most families have 2 or 3 cars. Only one needs long range. I drive only 6 miles to work. But even if I drove 50 miles, an electric car would be great....as long as my other half have "the more capable" vehicle. 99 % of trips are within an electric cars range. Secondly, your missing the part where batteries improve. It's not a static world, 15 years ago a battery car seemed a pipe dream, yet here we are.

Well... Apparently, VW is saying that. And I, for one, will believe it when I see it.

but 2025 is a ways off....they can always reverse that decision.