VW at bottom again

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: cousincletus
Purely subjective. Absolutely no facts.

cousincletus, I think you've made your point and it's time to find something else to talk about. When you start making accusations that are just as true of yourself as of others, it's usually a sign that you're arguing out of passion more than anything else and it's going to be hard to maintain a level discussion.

 

[cousincletus]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: cousincletus
Purely subjective. Absolutely no facts.

cousincletus, I think you've made your point and it's time to find something else to talk about. When you start making accusations that are just as true of yourself as of others, it's usually a sign that you're arguing out of passion more than anything else and it's going to be hard to maintain a level discussion.


Right back at ya.

 

[d00df00d]

Almost there, cletus. Almost.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Yeah, I'm sure someone making $40+ bucks a hour doing something that they should have been making $17 a hour MAX had nothing to do with GM problems.

Or someone working less than 20 years and retiring under 50 years old and GM having to pay them 80% of their pay until they pass away PLUS their health care.... That would have nothing to do with their problems. (and getting cost of living increases all the time AFTER they retired)

And your comment of paying more for a inferior products just shows how valid any of your comments are.

Bill

PS: My import does not need a timing belt. Unlike my friends Ford.. Or Aunt's Caravan...

 

[javacontour]

Originally Posted By: cousincletus
We owe mainly because of the trade deficit. GM would have been profitable if it weren't for unreasonable health care costs. I still see no good reason to buy an import, unless I just want to pay more for an inferior product, participate in sending American jobs overseas and the trade deficit. Like I said before, the VW would have to perform perfectly to have the same service history as my 2004 Impala.


We would owe even if we bought it all domestically. Why? Because folks were spending money they didn't have and foreign investors were willing to loan us the money.

More to come, I've found Toyotas are cheaper for us to buy and operate than domestics.

 

[cousincletus]

Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Yeah, I'm sure someone making $40+ bucks a hour doing something that they should have been making $17 a hour MAX had nothing to do with GM problems.

Or someone working less than 20 years and retiring under 50 years old and GM having to pay them 80% of their pay until they pass away PLUS their health care.... That would have nothing to do with their problems. (and getting cost of living increases all the time AFTER they retired)

And your comment of paying more for a inferior products just shows how valid any of your comments are.

Bill

PS: My import does not need a timing belt. Unlike my friends Ford.. Or Aunt's Caravan...

VW is a so much better than Chevrolet? I think not. Toyota had a lot of defects this year if I remember correctly. You forgot to mention all the imports that use timing belts and the domestics that don't. I still fail to see how much better your imports really are. I think it's all in your head.

 

[Bill in Utah]

Thank you for accepting the real reason why GM is having problems. IE the cost labor and poor design for quite a few of their models.

You'll also notice if you read my posts on this board for many years, I've had both imports and domestics and taken both many miles many times.

But the one engine I had MAJOR issues with (and the ONLY engine with ANY problems) was a domestic engine. And requiring head gaskets @ 61k and 108k is not something I'd be proud of.

Take that with one engine that is still going with never a problem @ 340k. (a VW engine)

Or a Toyota with 130k and all it has even seen is oil and gas. I just replaced the spark plugs... Nothing else. Still runs like new, gets mid 40s MPG and will do the same 200k miles from now.

Yeah.. All in my head.

 

[rshaw125]

I bet a 10 year old Buick is much more reliable than a 10 year old Volvo. A 10 year old Buick is maybe more reliable than a new VW.

 

[Audi Junkie]

Check the crash tests on the Cavalier and get back to me.

Best? Try WORST OF THE WORST!

That and the Beretta seem to be the most wretched cars on the road. Steering feel amounts to a spring wound around the column.

Again, what Imports have you guys owned for comparison? I don't really love old Jetta II, but it's a far shot better than those things.

 

[Audi Junkie]

btw, new Jetta is pretty nice for the money and I hear it's doing quite well in reliability. Safety is tops in class.

 

[Norm Olt]

Originally Posted By: XS650
Originally Posted By: cousincletus

Because some think the domestics deserve to be at the bottom of the list.


How many new American cars have you bought in the past 10 years?


Well, I, for one, have "purchased" two new Pontiac vehicles (Aigghhh! The HATED General Motors!) in the last two years, both using the GM Mastercard Rewards Program...

A new Pontiac GTO 400hp/400lbs/ft (...you're Really lookin' fine!) for a net price of under $24K (sans trade but after the Program credit) and a 2009 Vibe (just last month) for a net price of $12,065 (also sans trade & after Program credit).

The latter has a 5yr/100K warranty, Stabilitrac, traction control, side airbags, 4 wheel disc anti-lock brakes and is EPA-rated 26/32 mpg.

The owners love their cars (an '09 G8 GT is knockin' on the $40K door real hard) and I have not heard of a single recall or warranty claim as of yet (knock, knock... knock on wood!).

That these both are unconventional GM products ( Holden & Toyota NUMMI are involved) doesn't seem to be any detriment to their quality: the Vibe actually has a better warranty than a Matrix.

Just some fuel for the fires raging above...

Cheers!

 

[brianl703]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Steering feel amounts to a spring wound around the column.


Speaking of steering feel, one of my co-workers had a loaner Prius. The steering feel on that is about what you'd expect from a mid 1980s coin-op Pole Position arcade game.

 

[cousincletus]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Check the crash tests on the Cavalier and get back to me.

Best? Try WORST OF THE WORST!

That and the Beretta seem to be the most wretched cars on the road. Steering feel amounts to a spring wound around the column.

Again, what Imports have you guys owned for comparison? I don't really love old Jetta II, but it's a far shot better than those things.



At least the Cavalier will be running so it will be able to get into a crash.

 

[Audi Junkie]

http://vwvortex.com

 

[Audi Junkie]

When people tell me that their this or that car is "great", I ask them what was their last car. (obvious question) It usually evokes a sour look. I'll stop right there, but you guys know what I mean.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: cousincletus
At least the Cavalier will be running so it will be able to get into a crash.

Originally Posted By: cousincletus
Purely subjective. Absolutely no facts.

 

[Win]

Whatever happened to those fukenbrÖken decals?

Hey, I sorta made an umlaut!

 

[PF52]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
That and the Beretta seem to be the most wretched cars on the road.


My Beretta was quite nice, thank you.

 

[rjundi]

Originally Posted By: css9450
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
That and the Beretta seem to be the most wretched cars on the road.


My Beretta was quite nice, thank you.


My old coworker who commuted far bought a slightly used Beretta of college. He thought American cars did not last and though after 150k done. No significant repairs at 200k, 300k and finally 400k something serious went and mechanic condemned it. The car was 14 years old.

He got a 2001 Honda Accord and sadly it grenaded the automatic transmission(known trouble spot now) at 40k but replaced under warranty.

Two opposing unique cases. Serious luck on one side and a bit of bad luck on the other.

 

[Audi Junkie]

Originally Posted By: css9450
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
That and the Beretta seem to be the most wretched cars on the road.


My Beretta was quite nice, thank you.


Compared to what? Did you review the actual crash data or are you a victim of "wishfull thinking".

It's an epidemic amongst GM owners.