Volvo dealer used abrasive wheel to clean engine sump

[Astro14]

Fabulous car.

Thanks. They seem to be going up in value. I watch them on BaT, this one for example. Same miles as mine but an auto, where mine is a six speed, which tends to bring a bit more.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2006-volvo-v70r-54/

Here is a six speed with 208,000, bringing about the same money.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2006-volvo-v70r-55/

 

[wemay]

Thanks. They seem to be going up in value. I watch them on BaT, this one for example. Same miles as mine but an auto, where mine is a six speed, which tends to bring a bit more.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2006-volvo-v70r-54/

Here is a six speed with 208,000, bringing about the same money.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/2006-volvo-v70r-55/

Two beautiful examples at more than reasonable prices. Also appear well cared for.

 

[Oillover]

We need more pics!

 

[MattPersman]

@Astro14 This is what I imagine @2EHA is referring too the “white” roloc



Not saying it’s right or wrong but it is an approved item for use from an OEM

 

[Astro14]

@Astro14 This is what I imagine @2EHA is referring too the “white” roloc



Not saying it’s right or wrong but it is an approved item for use from an OEM

I knew what he was referring to. It is no different than a Scotchbrite pad, which is made by 3M as well.

Abrasive is abrasive.

You don’t use any kind of abrasive on an open engine block because the abrasive particles get IN the engine.

The Roloc is specifically mentioned, specifically pictured, by GM in their bulletin on this. It is just as bad as any other abrasive product.

Take a look at the actual bulletin:
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2016/MC-10082814-5448.pdf

See anything familiar?

 

[thescreensavers]

bits of old sealant in the there? Yeah…

Next oil change if its possible, it would probably be a good idea to use an inspection camera to look at the oil pickup screen. Make sure they didn't "Subaru" your pickup.

 

[Astro14]

Next oil change if it’s possible, it would probably be a good idea to use an inspection camera to look at the oil pickup screen. Make sure they didn't "Subaru" your pickup.

Good suggestion. We tried, using Wayne’s steerable endoscope, but the screen was too close to bottom of the sump, so we couldn’t get the camera in to see anything. I was hoping to verify exactly what you suggest.

 

[TiGeo]

I'm sure your car is just fine based on your quick flushes with fresh oil. There is zero recourse here for a 19 year old car. If that engine goes, well, it's 19 years old in the eyes of an arbitrator, the time/effort isn't worth what a used engine costs (to me at least). Best to take a Zanax and move on with some more oil changes/UOAs. Correct though, nobody should use a high speed wheel (or any abrasive) on the engine side but that's how you get this done quickly and quick is what a dealer tech on flat rate is there to do. Most techs aren't receiving any training, they get a car in and learn on the fly. My son is a tech-in-training....and the stories he tells me...yeah...don't take you car to a dealer.

 

[cb_13]

My neighbor Lets call him Joe, has a 90,000 GMC Denali pick up. He loves it but told me an interesting story.
Within a short time after Joe took delivery of the vehicle, it developed a lifter tap and after futile attempts to quite he thing the dealer finally decided that it needed the lifters replaced at some 11,000 miles. His Response was "I just spent 90,000 Dollars on this truck I want a new engine". The Shop called and said it was done. He quickly asked if they replaced the engine. To his disappointment they did not. GMC Only approved the new lifters. When Joe went to the Dealer and spoke with the service manager, he reiterated his original objection. When they refuse Joe stated he would be back to hold a picket sign out front tomorrow. They thought he was joking. However he wasn't. After seeing him hanging out in front of the dealership a few hours and talking with numerous people about his experience, while watching person after person turn around and leave they decided he was serous. At some point a tall man in a fancy suit came walking out and met him on the sidewalk. He asked Joe how he could make it right, he offered and extended warrantee, cash settlement. My neighbor said you know what I want. The man asked Joe to please come back into the service department and they will get him a ETA on a new engine. Within a month Joe had the new engine installed. My point, sometimes we have to be taken seriously. Spend days in court or spend a few dollars and picket your point. a few hours can sour the ideals of people. Especially if you mention the local paper or tv news channel. If it doesn't work out you have a choice. Just a few sales would be the cost of a new engine. It would cost the dealer nothing to cover a warrantee for 50,000 miles say. or $6.000 for an engine job. It would cost twice that in court. If they are so certain no harm was done (which we ALL know there was some) an extended warrantee is their best option. IMO

You gotta be careful with stuff like that. Especially when you’re taking money out of every employee in that business’ pocket.

10 coworkers get together and give a couple of homeless guys $300 and an 18 pack of Keystone they will be willing to lay one hell of a beating on someone. Joe could just as easily have ended up in the ICU on feeding tube.

I’d think calling the local news station or newspaper to see if they’re interested in a story would be a safer choice.

 

[xmanjeff]

lets face facts, no one with a lick of sense would want to be a mechanic at a car dealership... flat rate, tight warranty labor rates, supply your own tools, spend your life bent over... get second guessed by everyone.... so nah... so the dealer will train the guy that used to wash cars to change oil, and if the guy who used to wash cars and now changes oil can do that without too many problems, they try to turn him into a technician... ,

just the way it is.

that is the truth in every ocupation and trade

 

[TiGeo]

lets face facts, no one with a lick of sense would want to be a mechanic at a car dealership... flat rate, tight warranty labor rates, supply your own tools, spend your life bent over... get second guessed by everyone.... so nah... so the dealer will train the guy that used to wash cars to change oil, and if the guy who used to wash cars and now changes oil can do that without too many problems, they try to turn him into a technician... ,

just the way it is.

I'd say my 19 year old son has "a lick of sense" and did the tech center in HS to be a tech...learning the ropes at a dealership currently - what a jerky comment.

 

[TiGeo]

My neighbor Lets call him Joe, has a 90,000 GMC Denali pick up. He loves it but told me an interesting story.
Within a short time after Joe took delivery of the vehicle, it developed a lifter tap and after futile attempts to quite he thing the dealer finally decided that it needed the lifters replaced at some 11,000 miles. His Response was "I just spent 90,000 Dollars on this truck I want a new engine". The Shop called and said it was done. He quickly asked if they replaced the engine. To his disappointment they did not. GMC Only approved the new lifters. When Joe went to the Dealer and spoke with the service manager, he reiterated his original objection. When they refuse Joe stated he would be back to hold a picket sign out front tomorrow. They thought he was joking. However he wasn't. After seeing him hanging out in front of the dealership a few hours and talking with numerous people about his experience, while watching person after person turn around and leave they decided he was serous. At some point a tall man in a fancy suit came walking out and met him on the sidewalk. He asked Joe how he could make it right, he offered and extended warrantee, cash settlement. My neighbor said you know what I want. The man asked Joe to please come back into the service department and they will get him a ETA on a new engine. Within a month Joe had the new engine installed. My point, sometimes we have to be taken seriously. Spend days in court or spend a few dollars and picket your point. a few hours can sour the ideals of people. Especially if you mention the local paper or tv news channel. If it doesn't work out you have a choice. Just a few sales would be the cost of a new engine. It would cost the dealer nothing to cover a warrantee for 50,000 miles say. or $6.000 for an engine job. It would cost twice that in court. If they are so certain no harm was done (which we ALL know there was some) an extended warrantee is their best option. IMO

This stuff is so funny. They owe him nothing but the repair - that's the warranty, that's what's written by GM. The dealer is an independently owned franchise and has nothing to do with what GM agrees to cover. Based on the stories my son (who works at a GMC dealer) tells me, people have "lost their minds" on what they want covered. They actually installed a camera system that photos the vehiclkes as they go into the service lane to prevent the "you scratched my car" issues - that's b/c that happens all the time.

Your recomendations here are ridiculous - it's a 19 year old car, nobody in the public gives a flying fig about this but the folks here in this convo. Unless it's damaged, "it is what it is" here, not "it's probably damaged and probably will have a shorter life now"...that means zero here or in court. I would 100% be upset that it wasn't done correcly and I think he handled it well but but no way would I go through all of that here. The car is going to be fine. Your time has a value and without a cut/dry damage, you lose this no matter how angry you are. Life does that sometimes.

 

[OVERKILL]

This stuff is so funny. They owe him nothing but the repair - that's the warranty, that's what's written by GM. The dealer is an independently owned franchise and has nothing to do with what GM agrees to cover. Based on the stories my son (who works at a GMC dealer) tells me, people have "lost their minds" on what they want covered. They actually installed a camera system that photos the vehiclkes as they go into the service lane to prevent the "you scratched my car" issues - that's b/c that happens all the time.

Your recomendations here are ridiculous - it's a 19 year old car, nobody in the public gives a flying fig about this but the folks here in this convo. Unless it's damaged, "it is what it is" here, not "it's probably damaged and probably will have a shorter life now"...that means zero here or in court. I would 100% be upset that it wasn't done correcly and I think he handled it well but but no way would I go through all of that here. The car is going to be fine. Your time has a value and without a cut/dry damage, you lose this no matter how angry you are. Life does that sometimes.

Eh. The SM at my dealership (who obviously didn't know me well enough) and I had a bit of an issue when he took it upon himself to opt for repairing the wiring harness in my SRT rather than replace it, and this is despite the owner and I already agreeing that it was getting a new wiring harness, and it was on the shelf, waiting to be installed.

We had words.

I got my new wiring harness, but I had to get the owner involved, who was gobsmacked that this was the route the SM took. The reason was of course that FCA's rules were "replace or repair at your discretion" and he felt a repair was satisfactory. I did not share that opinion and neither did the owner, who was on the same page as me.

 

[TiGeo]

Eh. The SM at my dealership (who obviously didn't know me well enough) and I had a bit of an issue when he took it upon himself to opt for repairing the wiring harness in my SRT rather than replace it, and this is despite the owner and I already agreeing that it was getting a new wiring harness, and it was on the shelf, waiting to be installed.

We had words.

I got my new wiring harness, but I had to get the owner involved, who was gobsmacked that this was the route the SM took. The reason was of course that FCA's rules were "replace or repair at your discretion" and he felt a repair was satisfactory. I did not share that opinion and neither did the owner, who was on the same page as me.

I doubt the story told above included dealer discretion for either replace engine or just lifters. If given the choice sure take the full harness vs. repair.

 

[MattPersman]

I doubt the story told above included dealer discretion for either replace engine or just lifters. If given the choice sure take the full harness vs. repair.

I’m not sure what the exact repair was but very likely could have been one wire or pin or connector that the tech got 2 hours or so paid on for a couple mins of work compared to 2 or 3 hours to put a harness in and get paid less than

 

[TiGeo]

I’m not sure what the exact repair was but very likely could have been one wire or pin or connector that the tech got 2 hours or so paid on for a couple mins of work compared to 2 or 3 hours to put a harness in and get paid less than

Again and again in this thread....the flat rate system causes lots of issues...but without it everyone would complain as well...a true double-edged sword.

 

[Audiman]

A better system would be the dealership pays technicians based on skill level a set wage plus overtime. It is then down to the workshop controller to ensure this technician meets the expected work output.

But we can all dream

 

[TiGeo]

A better system would be the dealership pays technicians based on skill level a set wage plus overtime. It is then down to the workshop controller to ensure this technician meets the expected work output.

But we can all dream

That's what some smaller shops do - but dealers seem to be mainly on the flat rate system. Even if they pay the techs hourly, they are charging the customer based on the hours from say alldata or similar.

 

[OVERKILL]

I’m not sure what the exact repair was but very likely could have been one wire or pin or connector that the tech got 2 hours or so paid on for a couple mins of work compared to 2 or 3 hours to put a harness in and get paid less than

The harness was damaged by a capacitor that caught fire. Since that never should have been able to happen, both the owner and I agreed that the only reasonable solution was a whole new harness with a forensic analysis performed on the original harness. Unfortunately, very little in the way of investigative work was performed because apparently this was the only known occurrence of this ever happening (the harness was sent to FCA for analysis, we heard nothing back).

 

[OVERKILL]

I doubt the story told above included dealer discretion for either replace engine or just lifters. If given the choice sure take the full harness vs. repair.

I agree, but I can certainly understand why somebody who just dropped 90 grand might want a new engine rather than a repair that might not even solve the issue.