Two HPL EC30 tests

[ZZman]

Not really. The Legend is up to around 700 miles since adding EC30 and the lifter tick still hasn't been eliminated, but it ticks for significantly less time than it used to. I'm planning on pulling the front valve cover this weekend just to see how a reduction in lifter tick translates to visible valvetrain cleaning.

I had to order a second quart of EC30 for the Legend because I have added about 2.5-3 quarts of oil since adding the first quart of EC30 and need to maintain approximately the recommended ratio.

My friend with the CRV is about 500 miles into the EC30 experiment and the it has used about half a quart, so the rate of consumption hasn't changed yet.

Yes, that isn't a lot of miles and use for it to work yet I would think.

 

[OilStainedNapkin]

Not really. The Legend is up to around 700 miles since adding EC30 and the lifter tick still hasn't been eliminated, but it ticks for significantly less time than it used to. I'm planning on pulling the front valve cover this weekend just to see how a reduction in lifter tick translates to visible valvetrain cleaning.

I had to order a second quart of EC30 for the Legend because I have added about 2.5-3 quarts of oil since adding the first quart of EC30 and need to maintain approximately the recommended ratio.

My friend with the CRV is about 500 miles into the EC30 experiment and the it has used about half a quart, so the rate of consumption hasn't changed yet.

Not to get your hopes up but I haven’t seen a single case where ec30 helped oil consumption when used alone.

 

[Avery4]

Haven't drove the Legend much in the last couple weeks because the oil leaks have gotten so bad I was adding a quart every 50-75 miles. It definitely did not leak like that before adding the EC30. Not sure if the EC30 uncovered leaks by cleaning, accelerated the degradation of the already old (and maybe incompatible) rubber, or had nothing to do with it, but I'd be curious to hear your theories.

Anyways, since I'd like to keep this experiment going for a while longer before pulling the engine for a refresh and manual cleaning, I ordered several new seals/gaskets to fix the worst of the leaks and it will be back on the road once those are changed. I also ordered a new oil filter so I can cut open the old one for inspection.

 

[Bill7]

Not really. The Legend is up to around 700 miles since adding EC30 and the lifter tick still hasn't been eliminated, but it ticks for significantly less time than it used to. I'm planning on pulling the front valve cover this weekend just to see how a reduction in lifter tick translates to visible valvetrain cleaning.

I had to order a second quart of EC30 for the Legend because I have added about 2.5-3 quarts of oil since adding the first quart of EC30 and need to maintain approximately the recommended ratio.

My friend with the CRV is about 500 miles into the EC30 experiment and the it has used about half a quart, so the rate of consumption hasn't changed yet.

Please keep us posted on how the HPL EC30 does on both the lifter tick on the Acura Legend and the oil consumption on the Honda CRV.

 

[Avery4]

Please keep us posted on how the HPL EC30 does on both the lifter tick on the Acura Legend and the oil consumption on the Honda CRV.

Unfortunately, I don't have any major updates. A new oil cooler seal kit took care of the worst of the Legend's leaks, but I haven't been able to drive it lately because all the roads are salty here and will be for at least the next couple of weeks and my only car that gets driven in salt is the 04 Civic since it's quite rusty anyways.

My friend with the CRV said he got about another 150 miles out of the last quart he added with the same driving conditions, so maybe there was a slight improvement there, but time will tell.

Unlike me, he hasn't noticed any new or more severe leaks, but his CRV is also 20 years newer than my Legend, so its seals/gaskets were in much better condition to begin with and are likely made from better materials, so no surprises there.

 

[Avery4]

Finally had a chance to work on the Legend. I fixed the worst of the leaks with new oil cooler O rings, a new oil pan gasket, and a new oil filter housing gasket, but I haven't been able to drive it due to salty roads.

I did change the oil filter and cut the old one open though. Looks like quite a bit of carbon for just ~800 miles, but judging by that and the oil still being fairly clean, it doesn't seem to be an overly aggressive cleaner.

As a comparison, this is the last filter after 2000 miles on straight R&P. Hard to draw any conclusions with that filter being in use for 2.5X longer, the carbon being a different consistency, etc.

 

[Sequoiasoon]

Less dissolved? Was that before you started changing all the gaskets/seals? I'm thinking possibly on the "junk got loose from edges type thing" when gasket came off and was circulated into filter.

If not then it is definitely working at getting some crusty stuff off which as long as captured, all good. Are they hard specks or softer?

 

[Spring Break '92]

I did change the oil filter and cut the old one open though. Looks like quite a bit of carbon for just ~800 miles, but judging by that and the oil still being fairly clean, it doesn't seem to be an overly aggressive cleaner.

I ran EC30 for two 5K mile intervals with QSFS and PP 5W20 over last fall into the end of December. I did not cut open the first filter, but I my dad got me an oil filter cutting tool for Christmas and I just got around to cutting open the second filter with it last weekend. It is a Purolator Boss, and while the media was dark, there was nothing else at all. I had read that people find a brown sludge after using the EC30, and this is what the filters catch from the cleaning.

The Honda K24 that I have was very clean before using it even the first time. I was just hoping to see a change in the VTC actuator rattle, since there is an oil passage that provides the timing chain tensioner with oil on startup (from the oil filter adapter housing) that gets blocked with time. So without going in and removing the tensioner I thought that the EC30 would clean the passage if it were the case that it was blocked. In my case however, my engine is clean-clean and this was not the case. Worth doing at 270K+ miles though!

 

[Avery4]

Less dissolved? Was that before you started changing all the gaskets/seals? I'm thinking possibly on the "junk got loose from edges type thing" when gasket came off and was circulated into filter.

If not then it is definitely working at getting some crusty stuff off which as long as captured, all good. Are they hard specks or softer?

I changed the filter before I disassembled anything to avoid that possibility.

The little chunks in the filter are moderately hard, but they break down easily when rubbed between my fingers.

 

[Hohn]

I appreciate your posting this. I tried EC30 in one vehicle and VRP in the other. I never really new how well the EC30 worked, (4gr-fse in IS250) because just peeking through the fill hole you only saw a super clean engine to begin with. I can't say I really saw or felt any evidence of major change. While this engine is generally considered to be one of the worst Toyota ever made (early GDI only; had a massive recall for top end carbon), it made it to well over 180k for me with no measurable consumption and no top end carboning.

I've posted my VRP experience elsewhere.

I'm using HPL PCMO in another vehicle-- another Lexus that won't show you much at all through the filler hole. I do feel like the HPL PCMO is doing some cleaning and probably pretty good cleaning. I have no oil consumption problem to solve nor any evidence of deposits, but with 168K on it, it stands to reason it's not super new looking inside.

I might scope the GX's 1UR-FE just form morbid curiosity to see what that HPL PCMO has been up to. I can see it darken a bit in the ~6mo since it's been in, but we don't drive the GX a ton because it's thirsty, so it only has about 2k on this OCI.

 

[Avery4]

Small update on my friend's CRV- He went ~1100 miles on the last quart he added- not dramatically different enough from the baseline average of 1 quart per 1K miles on 30 grade to draw any conclusions, but at least seems to not be trending in a bad direction since the start of these experiments.

The roads are finally clear of salt and the Legend no longer leaks enough oil to visibly drop the level on the stick at least in the couple hundred miles I have been able to drive it. I'm planning a couple more trips out of town in the near future, so I should be able to put more miles on it soon.

The cold lifter tick doesn't seem to have improved further, but I found a couple reports of improper lifter preload causing lifter noises on these engines. Unlike most Hondas, the V6 in these 1st gen Legends has hydraulic lifters, but there's oddly still an adjustment on the exhaust side only. Anyways, I just ordered a set of side cover gaskets and will be checking the lifter preload just to make sure that's not an issue. I don't think that's my issue (or at least the only issue) since there only seems to be a few lifters ticking since I can hear them stop one at a time, but can't hurt to check.

Regardless of the outcome, I'll definitely still keep taking pictures under the front valve cover to document the progress. Although removing the front valve cover isn't a large amount of work, judging by the seemingly pretty slow progress, unless something changes, I'm thinking the next update will probably be next time I change the oil and filter.