The New Fram Ultra......

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I may change the name again.
May I suggest P. Edward Nicknack this time 'round? lol
I like the poly fibers over glass. Never liked glass being part of media. What if it sheds off? As for cellulose, It's like wearing a cotton shirt in summer versus polyester. Which one absorbs?
Yes, I do too, but everybody that did the synthetic media dance did it with glass initially. The glass fibres are bonded, which results in the same risk as with cellulose: the bonding agent failing, though I suspect service would have to be extreme for that to ever take place.

The Stratapore media is some of the best in the business, FRAM hasn't really given us any insight into how their synthetic media is made. Donaldson is also using a synthetic melt-blown process for their Synteq media (now on its third generation) just like Fleetguard, FWIW. So those are what I consider the industry benchmark.

I don't think the shirt analogy really works here, it's not desirable for a filter to absorb water, you want it to evaporate when the oil is up to temperature, versus compromise the performance of the media.
 
You said "to maintain efficiency rating." If the efficiency rating stays the same, then they will function the same, for me. I don't run them 20k miles.
Yes, once you are seeing frequent bypass events, the rating on the box doesn't really matter.

You don't have to run 20,000 miles, you just have to experience enough surface loading (see Wayne's pics in the UOA section) to result in this stuff falling off and sitting on the bottom of the can, potentially swept-through the engine on a bypass event. That's why they've put on the synthetic "topper", to prevent that from happening and increase holding capacity, but it won't be as good as multiple layers of synthetic media that get progressively more efficient.
If the oil comes out the same in terms of particulates after a 5k or even 10k OCI for me, then the filter performs the same, rendering all that fancy talk as just noise. If it doesn't, then you are right, it is a lesser filter.

So we need to see some real world data.
Real world data will of course vary based on application. Different applications produce different volumes of material. The point is simply that a hybrid media filter is a compromise in several areas to achieve reduced cost and production line efficiency.

The consumer, which in the context of this text, means everybody reading and responding in this thread, can acknowledge that these changes have been made but that it is still an excellent filter, though no longer one that exclusively leverages synthetic media, and continue to purchase it, or, if they are not satisfied with the direction the company has taken with the product, they are free to seek out and purchase other filters that continue to utilize a synthetic or glass fibre media, some of which will be significantly less efficient like the WIX XP.

Personally, I'll be switching to the AMSOIL filters, since I believe they are still using the Donaldson Synteq media. Others appear to be going with Royal Purple, I have no idea whose media that filter uses, it may be a Champ proprietary product.

Anyways, I think this has been an interesting discussion, I'm likely just as curious as you are to see how these hold-up in the diverse applications we have on this board.
 
May I suggest P. Edward Nicknack this time 'round? lol

Yes, I do too, but everybody that did the synthetic media dance did it with glass initially. The glass fibres are bonded, which results in the same risk as with cellulose: the bonding agent failing, though I suspect service would have to be extreme for that to ever take place.

The Stratapore media is some of the best in the business, FRAM hasn't really given us any insight into how their synthetic media is made. Donaldson is also using a synthetic melt-blown process for their Synteq media (now on its third generation) just like Fleetguard, FWIW. So those are what I consider the industry benchmark.

I don't think the shirt analogy really works here, it's not desirable for a filter to absorb water, you want it to evaporate when the oil is up to temperature, versus compromise the performance of the media.
Wouldn’t the temp be high enough in the media too? I was thinking more on the lines of oil being micro filtered. I better not talk more in detail as someone may steal my idea to get the credit and fame.
 
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Checked local WM tonight for 7317 and 10060s and all of them on the shelf had the new boxes. I didn’t open any to look inside though.
:(
 
Checked local WM tonight for 7317 and 10060s and all of them on the shelf had the new boxes. I didn’t open any to look inside though.
:(

The 2 XG2 oil filters I picked up have the new box but with the wire backed media. I had picked up another XG2 back in the spring and that had a new box with an oil filter that was wire backed.
 
I ordered 6 XG2s from Amazon and 6 FS2s from AAP last week. All 12 have boxes that promote the seal and do not mention the wire backing on the filter media. After opening and inspecting each filter, all 12 filters clearly have the wire backing on the media.

I also ordered 6 XG10575s from Amazon. 3 came in new boxes that promote the seal and 3 came in the older boxes that promote the wire backing. The new boxes contained filters w/o wire backing on the media, the old boxes contained filters that did have the wire backing on the media.
 
I ordered 6 XG2s from Amazon and 6 FS2s from AAP last week. All 12 have boxes that promote the seal and do not mention the wire backing on the filter media. After opening and inspecting each filter, all 12 filters clearly have the wire backing on the media.

I also ordered 6 XG10575s from Amazon. 3 came in new boxes that promote the seal and 3 came in the older boxes that promote the wire backing. The new boxes contained filters w/o wire backing on the media, the old boxes contained filters that did have the wire backing on the media.

I don't have a Fram Titanium box on hand but I am not for sure that they have ever promoted the wire backing on their box. I do know that they promote the gasket as it is different from the normal Ultra gasket and it is one of the things that makes the Titanium filter unique as compared to the Ultra.
 
As proven in post #50 here, First Brands was prepping Ultra boxes by removing mention of the metal screen, however it still contained the authentic original authentic Ultra. I'd imagine some slower selling applications in WM might have some available, but not likely on popular applications like say on 7317 and 3614. Other stores or online places might have some left, hit or miss.

Out of curiosity checked 7317 at WM recently, all had new box. Didn't open any as don't feel right about opening seal to check. That application, most likely not the original anyway.

Afaik, the AAP Titanium never mentioned the metal screen. Perhaps that too was a sign of things to come.
 
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The original Ultra had two distinctly separate layers of synthetic media (probably not as complex as the Stratapore, but these are passenger car applications) providing true progressive depth filtration.

The "new" Ultra has a dusting of synthetic media as an outer layer, to capture and hold the larger particulate (increasing holding capacity) but the 2nd layer is a cellulose or cellulose blend media, meaning it lacks the advantages in flow and holding capacity that its predecessor had. They've worked to try and mitigate this by using more media, making the back layer more similar to that found in the PureONE.
I think you are making some large jumps in logic to make the conclusion that it is a bad filter.
You have no way of knowing how much is synthetic media vs. cellulose. The notion that its only a "topper" is silly.
The fact that it maintains/improves filtration efficiency and mileage rating seems to imply that it is still significantly synthetic media.

0.74mm = 740micron. So, 37x the depth of a 20 micron particle. There is depth, plenty of depth.

Real data has shown the that old Fram ultra outperformed all other comparable filters from RP, etc.
Just because they don't share specific literature on media doesn't mean its bad. It clearly was the best. So, they must know something - just choose to keep it proprietary.
Until there is data to suggest that its performance has significantly changed I'm chosing to believe their claim that performance was maintained or improved.
I would be happy to see data one way or the other.

Amsoil oil filters claim 99% (no "+") at 20 micron and 15,000mile service life for EA line (~$20+shipping), and 25,000 mile service life for EAO line ($20++) which are generally truck/high performance application (IE: not available for any of my passenger cars).
There is no guarantee what media they are currently using, and their own claims make me doubt that it is as stout as the Ultra. But again I welcome data and/or facts to the contrary.
 
I’m
I bet the supplier of the steel raised the price and it all started from there. Don’t blame them at all.
Very possible. And if they had to raise the price we would see bunch of people complaining that fram is more expensive blah blah. They should have raised the price and keep the same quality given all the inflation, I think for 10 years or more they had the same price. It reminds me of restaurants keeping the same price but making smaller servings 🙁
 
I think you are making some large jumps in logic to make the conclusion that it is a bad filter.
Take a step back big boy and stand-down from the defence angle and process the information presented. Have you read my posts? I never once claimed it was a BAD filter. I said they've cheapened it. I also remarked that they've retained the efficiency. Neither of those things make it bad.
You have no way of knowing how much is synthetic media vs. cellulose. The notion that its only a "topper" is silly.
Did you watch the tear-down video?
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It's predominantly cellulose with a thin layer of synthetic to add holding capacity to maintain the extended OCI rating. A "topper".
The fact that it maintains/improves filtration efficiency and mileage rating seems to imply that it is still significantly synthetic media.
No it doesn't. You can have insanely efficient cellulose, but it will come with a significant flow penalty over a synthetic media with the same surface area. That's why they've put more media in the can.
0.74mm = 740micron. So, 37x the depth of a 20 micron particle. There is depth, plenty of depth.
Again, if you read my posts and the material I took the time to post from both Donaldson and Cummins, you'd understand the difference between how cellulose operates (pore block, with some depth for the finer particles) versus a layered, and increasingly efficient true depth filtration media like what Cummins produces, or the old FRAM Ultra, which had two distinct layers of synthetic depth filtration.
Real data has shown the that old Fram ultra outperformed all other comparable filters from RP, etc.
Yes, which I noted. And they've retained that efficiency by continuing to use a very high efficiency cellulose or hybrid (blend) media.
Just because they don't share specific literature on media doesn't mean its bad. It clearly was the best. So, they must know something - just choose to keep it proprietary.
OK, and who was saying it was bad? It was probably the most highly regarded filter on the market for passenger car applications, offering true multi-layer depth filtration media in basically all part numbers at an extremely attractive price.
Until there is data to suggest that its performance has significantly changed I'm chosing to believe their claim that performance was maintained or improved.
I would be happy to see data one way or the other.
I've stated, multiple times now, that the efficiency has been kept the same. That has nothing to do with the fact that the media has been cheapened or that the flow and holding capacity have likely been reduced. The filter was already overkill, the PureONE, which has always been very efficient cellulose, has proven to flow just fine for consumer applications, the synthetic media filters are just better on several metrics, that doesn't make the cellulose ones bad.
Amsoil oil filters claim 99% (no "+") at 20 micron and 15,000mile service life for EA line (~$20+shipping), and 25,000 mile service life for EAO line ($20++) which are generally truck/high performance application (IE: not available for any of my passenger cars).
There is no guarantee what media they are currently using, and their own claims make me doubt that it is as stout as the Ultra. But again I welcome data and/or facts to the contrary.
I flagged @Pablo in a previous post on this, with respect to the continued use of the Donaldson Synteq media, and he confirmed that this is still what they are using. It's one of the best medias on the market and unlike FRAM, both Donaldson and Cummins Filtration are very up-front about their media technology, how it performs, how it is constructed...etc.

And yes, the AMSOIL filters certainly don't cover every part number and they are considerably more expensive, that's one of the reasons this change is so unfortunate. The Ultra, with multi-layered synthetic media was a huge bargain and everybody's application was covered for the most part. Now, it's a bit like a tarted-up PureONE with better efficiency. Still a great filter, just less than it was before.
 
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