The high-mileage versus low-mileage argument

[dparm]

Am I crazy for actually preferring a used car to have a decent amount of mileage? In my mind, a car with lots of highway miles has probably seen far less abuse than one used one day a week for going to the grocery store.

Friend of mine is still car shopping and found a 2011 with 45k on the clock. The in-service date was actually February of 2011, meaning that the previous owner did about 2k per month. Cause for concern? Car is good mechnically and the service records look fine; it had no-cost maintenance so there was no excuse to neglect it. The warranty expires in just 5k (or early 2015).

I told her to get an extended warranty just in case, but she seems to think that an identical 2011 with only 3k on the clock (yes, 3000 miles) is somehow worth the huge price premium (30%). A car with that little mileage makes me nervous.

 

[redhat]

Nope not at all. I agree with the same.

Me and my GF are looking at a 2011 Impala LT with about 100k on the clock for her. Doesn't scare me in the least.

I plan to do a coolant swap, trans fluid and filter, check out the ball joints and tie rods, brakes and watch it go another 100k.

 

[TheBig2003]

I do not mind vehicles with all highway mileage. They are excellent value and because they are on the road so often, they are usually maintained better than those that see major Canadian winters/summers in the city: potholes, severe salt, parking lots, dents, dings, etc. If you have a full service record for the vehicle, that's even better, go for it.

 

[dparm]

Wow, a 2011 with 100k?! Did they drive across the country every week?

 

[Donald]

i do not think its that simple.

If a person took a 100 mile trip every other week to go to the nearest store, that would be fine car for the vehicle. But only 2600 miles/year.

But short around town trips will cause fuel dilution and rusting of the exhaust.

I am not sure short trips have a real detrimental effect on the engine if it had reasonable OCIs.

 

[dparm]

Said car is a BMW so it has long OCIs, but a big sump. I don't know if it's a smart OLM, but the oil changes are free.

 

[S65AMG]

It all depends on the usage pattern.

When I buy used, I don't mind high mileage but I want to be within warranty, say 1 to 2 years, and to not have such high mileage that the warranty will expire on a mileage basis.

Has paid off a couple of times. My electric seat failed literally days before 3 years and 36k miles were put on a Ford. It ended up being a computer replacement. I purchased that car at 1 year / 24k.

On a previous car, I've had the suspension and the cabriolet mechanism fixed under warranty. Again on a vehicle I purchased with 2 years left on warranty and with 24k on the clock.

Being in warranty also lets you get some tsb's addressed.

If the buyer in the opening post is interested in a younger car and is not looking for long term ownership, then she should probably lease or buy new as it is probably cheaper than a car with 3k on it.

I would also be suspicious of a 2011 vehicle with just 3k on it. Is there a good reason for the low mileage?

 

[SLCraig]

Agree with it.
I've been looking for a Civic SI sedan and I found one with 26KM on it, ultra low miles. Same year as mine, 2011.

It is in far worse shape than mine.... 95KM on mine.

If you asked someone which car they thought had higher miles, and you parked mine beside the SI, they would say the SI every time.

Sad really.. I passed on the car.

 

[eljefino]

Yes, I don't care the least about mileage. I bought a volvo with 272k and shrugged about it.


On the flip side my 68k jeep liberty is not attracting the buyers I'd have expected with its low mileage. Must be the wrong time of year.

 

[Chris142]

Originally Posted By: eljefino


On the flip side my 68k jeep liberty is not attracting the buyers I'd have expected with its low mileage. Must be the wrong time of year.
it has a stickshift and few people want that.

 

[Swissdieselfan]

I avoid any used car for sale in or near to a city, because getting stuck in traffic is a main block, clutch and box killer. Then you just have to figure out where the owner worked or went shopping to make sure they were not short tripping.
It helps if the car was not parked on a fast road where the owner could jump in and floor it when cold, if it's in a garage with a drive or side road that's not possible.
Total miles don't mean much if they are good miles!

 

[147_Grain]

Freeway miles don't hurt a vehicle. Suggest you change all the fluids in your new purchase for best results longterm.

 

[JHZR2]

Id generally agree with the concept that higher mileage is better... There may be something to say about the little old lady car that was used once a week for groceries and church (my 81 MB is like that and is like new), but most late model low mileage specimens will not be that. They will be the short trippers because people are too lazy to walk, so they drive it, drive hard, and dont care kind of cars.

But youll also need to amortize known costs for services. What comes up at 60k? 90k? 100k? 120k? If expensive stuff like cooling system work, timing belts, and known weakspots like injectors, water pumps need to get work done on them, the per mile cost starts to skyrocket because of the short term and distance before you incur those major bills... And the "discount" if they arent done may nt be that great.

A higher mileage car may have a better chance of having new rubber in a matched set, but then again, may not - high quality tires can be very telling about the owner.

I only buy used cars (actually I only buy used w123 MB diesels, because they dont make them any more - all my other cars are new becauce I dont personally believe most used cars are truly a good value) with a complete set of receipts, as I dont trust others otherwise.

 

[Doog]

With used cars I want one that is certified, 2 years old and has 35-45,000 miles. That kills the re-sale value and I can get the best deals. Then you have the CPO warranty for another 60k which easily handles any real problems with the drivetrain. These will be cars that will get driven to about 200k then traded in on the next one. Example: 2009 Civic. $19,800 new...I got it for $12,800 with 40,000 miles. Run to 200k and sell for $3-4,000 so cost of ownership is $8800-9800 for 160,000 miles. So the cost is around $.06 per mile for the car. Then add another $.04 for maintenance and repairs and you have a car for $.10/mile barring any major malfunctions.

 

[Quest]

I typically buy cars (OBD-II type) that are less than 4 yrs old, so that I can still take advantage of the typical 5yr powertrain warranty(or whatever the balance of factory warranty comes to)to deal with any minor issue(s) previous owner may have not had, or never dealt with.

I don't buy banged-up OBD-II cars, citing that many times they are not fixed properly (in our area, so YMMV), and ended up throwing CEL afterwards.

Q.

 

[S65AMG]

Originally Posted By: Doog
With used cars I want one that is certified, 2 years old and has 35-45,000 miles. That kills the re-sale value and I can get the best deals. Then you have the CPO warranty for another 60k which easily handles any real problems with the drivetrain. These will be cars that will get driven to about 200k then traded in on the next one. Example: 2009 Civic. $19,800 new...I got it for $12,800 with 40,000 miles. Run to 200k and sell for $3-4,000 so cost of ownership is $8800-9800 for 160,000 miles. So the cost is around $.06 per mile for the car. Then add another $.04 for maintenance and repairs and you have a car for $.10/mile barring any major malfunctions.


This is sound logic on the initial buying decision but with that much mileage you also need to think about fuel economy and what it means for your ownership period / replacement decision.

$4 gallon and 30 mpg is $.13/mile on fuel.
$4 gallon and 40 mpg is $.10/mile on fuel.

So if you keep the car for the long term and the available technology improves with respect to fuel economy, you're potentially not saving as much as you think.

 

[dparm]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Id generally agree with the concept that higher mileage is better... There may be something to say about the little old lady car that was used once a week for groceries and church (my 81 MB is like that and is like new), but most late model low mileage specimens will not be that. They will be the short trippers because people are too lazy to walk, so they drive it, drive hard, and dont care kind of cars.

But youll also need to amortize known costs for services. What comes up at 60k? 90k? 100k? 120k? If expensive stuff like cooling system work, timing belts, and known weakspots like injectors, water pumps need to get work done on them, the per mile cost starts to skyrocket because of the short term and distance before you incur those major bills... And the "discount" if they arent done may nt be that great.

A higher mileage car may have a better chance of having new rubber in a matched set, but then again, may not - high quality tires can be very telling about the owner.

I only buy used cars (actually I only buy used w123 MB diesels, because they dont make them any more - all my other cars are new becauce I dont personally believe most used cars are truly a good value) with a complete set of receipts, as I dont trust others otherwise.



It has matching OEM summer performance tires at 5/32". Expensive tires.

I should call a dealer and ask about the services. Good idea.

Overall the car is almost flawless. The leather is barely even worn on the bolsters.

 

[eljefino]

Originally Posted By: Chris142
Originally Posted By: eljefino


On the flip side my 68k jeep liberty is not attracting the buyers I'd have expected with its low mileage. Must be the wrong time of year.
it has a stickshift and few people want that.


That's true and the wierdos who evaluate cars by looking at numbers on the odometer (then use carfax to "double check" those numbers) are the types stymied by three pedals.

 

[rjundi]

I purchased a 2007 Acura MDX 4 years old with 83k out warranty and out of ability to be certified by Acura. Owner sold at trade in offered of $17k. The new price was sticker $47k and paid $44k. Usually they are $25k certified but 82k killed that.

No warranty . All service records on carfax since exclusive service at dealership. Scary 6k-9k OCI likely on Acura dealer likely dino 5w20. Owner followed what it told him.

Acura thankfully has so many TSB and free things it fixed all the problems including vibrating torque convertor, difficult power steering and failed cat convertor(stated it threw a code while in never say it). All known 2007 (first issues) that I never really encountered but dealer did them.

Downsides are just did a 100k service for close to $1000 for timing belt, plugs, water pump. Have not fathomed a valve adjustment check for $300-$500 dependent on who does it.

Hoping it continues trouble free for another 50k.

 

[JHZR2]

Originally Posted By: Doog
With used cars I want one that is certified, 2 years old and has 35-45,000 miles. That kills the re-sale value and I can get the best deals. ... So the cost is around $.06 per mile for the car. Then add another $.04 for maintenance and repairs and you have a car for $.10/mile barring any major malfunctions.


Your numbers assume that someone wants to/can (given child seats, a family, luggage, towing, etc. drive a civic or equivalent appliance. The reality of the situation manifests itself as is evidenced below...

Originally Posted By: rjundi
I purchased a 2007 Acura MDX 4 years old with 83k out warranty and out of ability to be certified by Acura. Owner sold at trade in offered of $17k. ...

Downsides are just did a 100k service for close to $1000 for timing belt, plugs, water pump. Have not fathomed a valve adjustment check for $300-$500 dependent on who does it.



So right now his per mile purchase cost is $1/mile on the vehicle. Of course that will drop as time goes on. But also dont forget the maintenance cost, $1300/17k miles of ownership is 7.6c/mile.

Of course if he had bought new for $43k, the cost including the same maintenance cost would have only been 44.3c/mile as opposed to $1.076

And now youre over 100k miles, so who knows what will go... but you can probably count on tires, brakes, alternator, radiator, none of which were mentioned to be done... Sure, keep it another 100k miles and put another $2500 (very conservative) into it over that time on the stuff, and the purchase cost per mile drops nicely... 14.5c/mi, but with maintenance overall it is 17.7c/mile.

Meanwhile had he bouht new, it would have been 23.4c/mile, not a particularly compelling savings IMO. Especially considering that newer, fancier and more powerful cars will be more trouble prone. Fancy nav/stereo/electric gadgets? How much will that cost when they break in the second 100k miles?

Id much rather have a car that I know the history and treatment from the start, get the enjoyment of it from the start, and then pull enough miles out of it that when/if something major comes up and I want to unload it, my per mile cost isnt through the roof.

The savings going used IMO isnt sufficient to account for the risk and added maintenance coming far sooner on the vehicle.



So back to the OP, the benefit of a higher mileage used car, is that if it was well kept and maintained, you may have already gotten past the point of needing to replace many items, at which point the seller doenst get a huge valuation increase, but you save a lot of out of pocket due to needing to cover those costs...