Test Drive - 2014 Silverado LT Crew Cab

[95busa]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Coil suspension isn't anything new, Mercedes has used it on the G wagon for over 40 years. Fiat finally spent some money and figured it out. But it won't really do anything that leaf springs won't do, its just a different way of doing things. Coil springs also can crack if stressed to much off road. As Mercedes found out with G wagons running 18's which most modern trucks run. To much load and not enough sidewall to absorb the impacts equals cracked coils.

Sorry Fiat, rest of the truck is nice though.


The Ram coil suspension was designed prior to 2009... WAY prior to Fiat involvement in Chrysler. Leaf springs can crack if overstressed too. So will a solid steel I-beam. Your point?

Coils are used in uparmored hmmwvs, m1114 and m1151. Going out on a limb and saying those trucks are beat on way harder than any 1/2 ton pickup.

You said it best- "its just a different way of doing things" so why the unfounded bias against it? And it actually will do one thing better than 1800's technology leaf springs- reduce NVH when lightly loaded.

 

[95busa]

M1114 and m1151. Coil springs. Nuff said.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Then there's that extra 3-400 pounds you have to lug around in the Ford or Ram, that costs a LOT of money over a 5 year span of time and miles.


So where IS that weight? The aluminum block of the 5.3 relative to the iron block of a 4.7 probably only saves about 100 lbs AT MOST (probably less). I still just *like* iron engine blocks, personally. And if you're comparing to a Pentastar Ram, that's an all-aluminum engine too.

So where is the other 200-300 pounds, and is it costing something that will weaken the truck relative to Ford and Dodge? Just curious, since it looks like GM has found a way to get ahead of the others- something that's really hard to do in the light-truck market since the Big 3 have been just about deadlocked for 20 years, with one brand making a gain only to be countered by the others a model later.


It's been that way since around 06 when I started noticing it, it may even go farther back. My FIL always has a nice new Ford to compare, when I saw the curb weight on his 08 I could not believe it. The truck weighs over 300 pounds more than my 05 Silverado extended cab long bed with every conceivable option. His 5.4 can never overcome that difference, and my little 5.3 embarrasses him with better go, better stop, and better cornering as well. Plus I'll get better brake pad life and longer tire wear as well. Then there's the payload/towing.

I can't believe anyone cares one way or the other about coil springs. They don't magically crack, maybe on fragile imported stuff but not on American pickups. Our 3500 Vans have coil front ends and almost 56% of their 9000 pounds is on that front end. No cracks at 500k miles, all city pounding. Never even heard of such crazy stuff.

And who cares about sticker? I bought that same 05 with two pages of options with an original list in the low 40's for 26500 out the door. It had 200 miles on it then and it is still worth good money today.

 

[hattaresguy]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Coil suspension isn't anything new, Mercedes has used it on the G wagon for over 40 years. Fiat finally spent some money and figured it out. But it won't really do anything that leaf springs won't do, its just a different way of doing things. Coil springs also can crack if stressed to much off road. As Mercedes found out with G wagons running 18's which most modern trucks run. To much load and not enough sidewall to absorb the impacts equals cracked coils.

Sorry Fiat, rest of the truck is nice though.


The Ram coil suspension was designed prior to 2009... WAY prior to Fiat involvement in Chrysler. Leaf springs can crack if overstressed too. So will a solid steel I-beam. Your point?

You said it best- "its just a different way of doing things" so why the unfounded bias against it? And it actually will do one thing better than 1800's technology leaf springs- reduce NVH when lightly loaded.


I don't really care either way, I was just trying to have a technical discussion about truck suspension.

I forgot this is a Chrysler/Fiat board and they can do no wrong.

I'm out.

 

[UNC017]

It may have been pushed on Dodge by Daimler management, but its even less of a "Mercedes design" than the LX car suspension (which IS pretty much a copy of the E-class with some slight tweaks). It was a clean sheet for pickup trucks.

Interview with one of the Dodge engineers followed by a review by an independent engineer here:
http://www.allpar.com/model/ram/dodge/suspension.html

 

[UNC017]

Originally Posted By: hattaresguy

I forgot this is a Chrysler/Fiat board and they can do no wrong.



Uhhhhh... OhhhhKayyyyy....

Seems to me I'm about the only even moderately "hard core" Mopar guy here. And even I try to keep an open mind, personal preferences aside. Technical discussion is great. So bring something technical to discuss.

By the way, I agree they could have left the Airmatic parts of it on the drawing board. It would be just fine with conventional shocks and coils.

 

[dishdude]

Originally Posted By: hattaresguy


I forgot this is a Chrysler/Fiat board and they can do no wrong.

I'm out.


Now I've heard it all. Between Chrysler and GM, I'm not sure which company has more hatred spewed towards it on this board.

 

[mrsilv04]

Originally Posted By: hattaresguy

I forgot this is a Chrysler/Fiat board and they can do no wrong.

I'm out.


Wow. I've been around here for several years, and that's news to me.

 

[supton]

Originally Posted By: Trav
My brother and i went shopping for a car and truck a couple of weeks ago and looked at the domestic offerings. He was in the 35K class, not loaded but well equipped for a truck.

First we looked at the Tundra 4 door 6' bed 4WD 4.6 DOHC V8 fairly well equipped for 34K.
Next the Ram, not a lot of content in the same price class and it felt cheap inside so we walked away from that with no second looks.
Chevy was just white bread and over priced for the 4WD.
Ford was not in the running because of frame rust issues he, my father and myself all had with them not to mention the V6 power.

He bought the 2013 Tundra with a sticker of 34,800 for 28,550. That includes bed liner and OEM running boards, 4WD, towing package and decent equipment with a 2,500 rebate.
We debated them a few days and decided the Tundra was the best truck for the money despite what the biased US magazines were saying.
He likes the truck a lot, it runs as expected for a Toyota silk smooth and quiet, it shifts nice, rides well and has good braking power.

This was just an unemotional buy, no fan boy bias, no domestic or brand loyalty just value for money. I looked at them underneath and under the hood (except the Ford which we skipped)and found the Toyota was IMO well built and uses high quality materials.


I'm jealous. I paid nearly that much for older (bought used), same setup though. I never did learn how to negotiate... Still like the truck.

 

[mrsilv04]

Originally Posted By: supton

I'm jealous. I paid nearly that much for older (bought used), same setup though. I never did learn how to negotiate... Still like the truck.


The Tundra is the old man of the group... well, is Nissan still making the Titan? I don't know... the local dealer won't stock anything that doesn't sell...

But I'm not surprised to see a Tundra come that far off of sticker.

 

[MrHorspwer]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
It may have been pushed on Dodge by Daimler management, but its even less of a "Mercedes design" than the LX car suspension (which IS pretty much a copy of the E-class with some slight tweaks). It was a clean sheet for pickup trucks.

Interview with one of the Dodge engineers followed by a review by an independent engineer here:
http://www.allpar.com/model/ram/dodge/suspension.html



"Independent engineer" my behind.

Bob Sheaves was a design engineer at Chrysler (specifically, Jeep-Truck Engineering) for a number of years. If you dig around Allpar, you'll see his name thrown around when talking about the Ram front suspension design back in 1994 (which he was heavily involved in). You'll also see he and his new company catNET has sponsored Allpar meets and even paid for their attendance to an event at the Chrysler Museum.

I'm not commenting on what he said in the article, but Bob has a significant history with both Chrysler and Allpar. Certainly enough that I wouldn't call him an "independent" and unbiased source for comment.

 

[supton]

Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Originally Posted By: supton

I'm jealous. I paid nearly that much for older (bought used), same setup though. I never did learn how to negotiate... Still like the truck.


The Tundra is the old man of the group... well, is Nissan still making the Titan? I don't know... the local dealer won't stock anything that doesn't sell...

But I'm not surprised to see a Tundra come that far off of sticker.


2014 Tundra's either just came out or about to, so I guess they could be trying to move stock. When I bought my 2010 four months ago, different story... I knew I was paying a "fair" price but I wish it had been more fair.

 

[Trav]

Yes the 2014 will be in stock within a few weeks if it already isn't. This was one of the last 3 on the lot. The 2014 looks a little different but he wanted a truck to tow a boat once in a while, bring stuff to the dump and plow his driveway.

Yes i think he got a decent deal on the truck also, he is happy with it.

 

[supton]

Should be. I get mystified with some of the things on mine (transmission ATF that runs hot despite cooler, transmission gauge which isn't, and mpg's that aren't any better than the 5.7) but it's still a quiet riding truck, lots of space which will do basically the same job for me, minus the plowing.

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: wirelessF
Did the salesmen hound on you to buy the truck?


Nope, I made it clear to him upfront that I was not ready to buy tonight. He still offered a test drive though. This was a small-town dealer, so I think the service was a little different.

Originally Posted By: satinsilver
Did you have to sit on a phone book while driving it?

The beltline was on the high side...

Originally Posted By: stockrex
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Nice looking truck.

With that said...

$38k for what is listed on the lower right hand of the sticker and the past of the company will never have me spend my $$ for a new one.

Glad I'm not in the market for a new rig. I may pick something up used in the next year or so to replace the Corolla (I think its sold) but for now I'm just going to drive my truck.

Bill


$38k for a LT 2wd short bed, holy flipping mother of inflating product prices!
OP, you should wait till they have around $10 off sticker, and try to get the friends and family $2k


Don't worry - no plans to purchase until the prices come down drastically.

 

[01rangerxl]

Do it. Pickups are nice to have, especially since you already have a high MPG commuter to drive.

Now that I've seen a few in person, I like the looks of the new GMs much more than I thought I would from early doctored up pics. It's much better looking than the last generation, if a little Tonkaish (like all other pickups these days). It has some styling cues reminiscent of the '88-'93 models (headlights) and '73-'87 (wheel openings). I can't wait to see the reg cabs.

 

[dwcopple]

Why would you buy new (especially for 38 freakin' K!!!) when you can get lease turn in trucks for under $20K? Heck if you aren't an "enthusiast" like you say, buy an old F150 and put PLPD on it. You'll get more bang for your buck and the same MPG's without all the gizmo's to fail in typical GM fashion.

 

[FADEC]

Originally Posted By: Chris142
Just get this and save $36500.

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/ant/cto/3987932657.html


Here in Va I would buy that in a heartbeat. Probably doesn't have a bit of rust.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: dishdude
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy


I forgot this is a Chrysler/Fiat board and they can do no wrong.

I'm out.


Now I've heard it all. Between Chrysler and GM, I'm not sure which company has more hatred spewed towards it on this board.


Always entertaining, isn't it? Not very informative though.

C'mon Hatteras, show me an American truck with a broken coil spring. I have a whole driveway of HEAVILY loaded 3500 long wheelbase vans and a few more Silverado 1500's and we haven't had a broken spring in the history of our business! This is across three different brands as well!

Maybe this is more known in the Rust Belt states as the roads there were unbelievably rough when we were through there recently, but it just plain don't happen around here...

 

[supton]

Coworker snapped a coil on his Jetta. Apparently if the powder coating has a defect the rust will get in.