Synthetic oil differences

I believe galleries is the correct term here.
Thank you! That's what I was looking for! (Getting old is for the birds!)
So you meant the oil galleries that deliver oil to the journal bearings and other parts? Did they give a specific reason why the oil gallery passages were reduce in size, and how that correlates to needing to use a thinner oil? I don't see how reducing the size of an oil feed gallery passage is going to dictate what oil is used. It might increase the oil pump's output pressure slightly if the passages are slightly more restrictive due to the oil pump still trying to deliver the same oil volume per revolution of the pump throughout the oiling system. If they designed the oiling system correctly the oil volume supplied to all pressure fed components in the system should still be well above adequate, even if the galleries are a little choked down.

The actual physical design of the journal bearings would be the main component in an engine design that may dictate what oil viscosity to use ... as when engines are specified to use 0W-16, the journal bearings may be physically wider to help maintain an adequate MOFT when under high loads. There is a reason that 0W-16 has it's own API designation, because it should only be used in engines specifying 0W-16 (ie, designed for 0W-16). You would not really want to use 0W-16 in any engine specifying xW-20 through xW-50.
 
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Oil galleys (term I learned in my Diesel mechanic days) are sized for volume. Oil pressure comes from resistance in bearings and their leakage rate.
 
Only the finest Pennsylvania crude oil for me!
- Sent from my iTypewriter 12
Yeah, I’m thinking of switching from my usual 5W20 Redline to the Pen-Ultra 5W30. I wish it came in one gal jugs like Redline; kind of a PIA to splice it up for an LS3 8-quart pan. 🤷‍♂️
 
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Yep. Although it's a bit confusing since he doesn't define GIII+)

Amsoil uses different bases and blends depending on product and grade.

I don't think M1 makes a product that contains no HVI GIII, GTL, PAO, AN or POE. But certainly they use all of these in at least some products.

Pennzoil makes some synthetics that may not contain GTL.

Quaker State may or may not contain GTL (likely grade and batch dependent).

Claiming that no Supertech contains anything but lower VI GIII is a stretch.
Yep.
 
Yes, the additive package is what determines the OCI length suitability, though base oil selection will also play a role. PAO has more oxidation resistance than Group III and lower baes for example.

Assuming we are just talking about synthetic lubes:
- AMSOIL uses a blend of bases. I don't know the specifics on what AMSOIL uses, but likely PAO, POE and some Group III in the SS series. The lower series (OE/XL) are Group III.

- The Mobil 1 product family varies significantly depending on the product. M1 EP 0w-20 is basically straight PAO, while some of the oils have next to none. They also use Shell's Group III GTL bases in varying quantities as well along with POE and AN's.

- Pennzoil/Quaker State use both the Shell GTL base oils and the XHVI Group III bases. They also use some of Mobil's EHC bases, but not sure if that's in their synthetics or not, I suspect it's reserved for their blend oils.

- Supertech is a Warren product that uses Group III in their synthetic lubricants, though we've seen MSDS sheets that seemed to imply they were using Mobil's EHC Group II+ bases as well.

Mobil has a clear advantage in base oil selection because they produce so many of them, while other companies buy them.
mobil 1 EP 0w20 as of 2022 SDS has reduced PAO content from 60 percent to 30 %; the highest PAO content motor oil that I have found from Mobil 1 has the name Mobil 1 Ow40 European car formula with a PAO content of 40%
 
mobil 1 EP 0w20 as of 2022 SDS has reduced PAO content from 60 percent to 30 %; the highest PAO content motor oil that I have found from Mobil 1 has the name Mobil 1 Ow40 European car formula with a PAO content of 40%
There have been several threads on the recent change to M1 EP 0w-20.
 
mobil 1 EP 0w20 as of 2022 SDS has reduced PAO content from 60 percent to 30 %; the highest PAO content motor oil that I have found from Mobil 1 has the name Mobil 1 Ow40 European car formula with a PAO content of 40%
Mobil 1 EP 0w20 still has up to 30% which I think is significant. It is listed at the same level as Mobil 1 ESP 0w20 X2, which I'm running right now. I'll do a UOA at the next oil change in a few thousand miles.
 
Mobil 1 EP 0w20 still has up to 30% which I think is significant. It is listed at the same level as Mobil 1 ESP 0w20 X2, which I'm running right now. I'll do a UOA at the next oil change in a few thousand miles.
correct, Mobil 1 esp x2 0w20 has 30 percent PAO and also 60 percent GTL base oil group 3 plus, nice oil composition; does it come in heavier viscosities and with seal sweller for older vehicles?
 
Mobil 1 EP 0w20 still has up to 30% which I think is significant. It is listed at the same level as Mobil 1 ESP 0w20 X2, which I'm running right now. I'll do a UOA at the next oil change in a few thousand miles.
Two questions...is 30% PAO good? And would “up to 30%” mean it could have 20%, or less?

Right now I’m on my second oil change using Mobil1 EP 0W20 (old formula/60% PAO). And I must say it did “very well”...meaning, for the first time ever I ran a 10,000 mile interval, and for the first time ever I didn’t have to add one single drop of oil along the way. I just sent a sample into Blackstone Laboratories (this morning actually), and I’m looking forward to the TBN and overall wear metals numbers.

Without the 60% PAO I’ll try something else next time, not sure why, but the whole PAO thing is the only reason why I bought the Mobil1 EP. Back to sales and rebate oil...and mostly likely back to 5,000 mile intervals.
 
Two questions...is 30% PAO good? And would “up to 30%” mean it could have 20%, or less?

Right now I’m on my second oil change using Mobil1 EP 0W20 (old formula/60% PAO). And I must say it did “very well”...meaning, for the first time ever I ran a 10,000 mile interval, and for the first time ever I didn’t have to add one single drop of oil along the way. I just sent a sample into Blackstone Laboratories (this morning actually), and I’m looking forward to the TBN and overall wear metals numbers.

Without the 60% PAO I’ll try something else next time, not sure why, but the whole PAO thing is the only reason why I bought the Mobil1 EP. Back to sales and rebate oil...and mostly likely back to 5,000 mile intervals.
does a change in msds indicate that on the day of the update of the MSDS the oil changed formulation at the plant also?
If hypothetically we knew which day Mobil 1 changed the PAO content from 60 percent to 30 percent of mobil 1 EP 0w20 in their manufacturing plants then we would know that a Mobil 1 EP 0w20 with a manufacture date on the bottle before said day would have the mobil 1 EP 0w20 with the 60 percent PAO. perhaps contacting Mobil 1 would get some clarification about this issue.
 
M1 0w-20 Truck & SUV seems to be the highest known PAO ( 30-40% ) oil in Mobil1 as of now.
 
M1 0w-20 Truck & SUV seems to be the highest known PAO ( 30-40% ) oil in Mobil1 as of now.
Wow! I don't remember it being anywhere close to that on the previous SDS. Good find!

But since the last revision was January, I wonder if we'll see another where it is reduced. However, since it is a lower volume than EP, maybe they can sustain that level of POA, even if there are supply issues.
 
But since the last revision was January, I wonder if we'll see another where it is reduced
I would not be surprised. With all the inflation going on, it’s difficult to keep the same amount of PAO without significant prices increases, which so far have not happened for Mobil1 products.
 
I would not be surprised. With all the inflation going on, it’s difficult to keep the same amount of PAO without significant prices increases, which so far have not happened for Mobil1 products.
If the price goes up at least keep the same PAO content.
 
I generally use Mobil 1, though I've been running Ravenol in the SRT. It's PAO-based and I was able to get it at a good price to Blauparts. I've had excellent service and very clean engines on tear-down using Mobil 1 products, though I've used both Castrol and Pennzoil synthetics a bit too, as well as Motul. Always end up back on M1 though.
I saw somewhere that you were an Amsoil dealer yet you don't use their oil ?
 
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