Switching from 5w30 to 0w30 for the winter months?

[KrisZ]

Yes fine oils, but they are very expensive (for me) and no rebate potential. Canadian Tire frequently has oil at 45% off plus if you time it right there are manufacturer rebates as well. A long long time ago (late 90's) I used to get Esso XD3 semi-syn in 0w30 at a good deal from the local farm supply store. Today, really Canadian Tire is my best choice for oil locally.

Could be region specific I guess. Around the Toronto area, Petro Canada distributors were usually cheaper than regular price at CT. But they don’t run specials like CT does and CT special would beat the Petro Canada price.

It’s a good alternative that people aren’t aware of, especially if you don’t stock up on oil when it goes on sale. They have a steady and consistent price throughout the year.

 

[RugopsOP]

I'd say knock yourself out. I personally run 10W in the hot summer months and then use 5W for all the other seasons. Although both weights can work for both temperatures.

 

[DMflash]

Mainly availability. There is almost always some brand-name 5w30 on sale at my local walmart or canadian tire. They both have 1-2 0w30 offerings but they are usually close to double the 5w30 sale price.

I usually run Motomaster oe plus european 0w30 in winter in my 4.2 vortec . starts like a charm in Ontario winters .

 

[stormgol]

Mobil 1™ 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy | Mobil™ Motor Oils

Mobil 1™ 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy synthetic motor oil provides excellent engine protection and helps improve fuel economy

www.mobil.ca

 

[userfriendly]

Stick with 5w30. No need to complicate things.

Not so sure about that. I had zero oil pressure one -42C morning in Hinton, Alberta using 5W30 in a 6.0L GMC 2500.
I shut the engine off after 15 seconds and tried again after a minute. On the third try I got oil pressure.
After a 12 hour shift at Hinton Pulp, I bought three 3x5qt boxes of M1 0W40 Euro on sale which went into two company trucks that day and again the next fall.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Not so sure about that. I had zero oil pressure one -42C morning in Hinton, Alberta using 5W30 in a 6.0L GMC 2500.
I shut the engine off after 15 seconds and tried again after a minute. On the third try I got oil pressure.

Borderline pumpability going on there.

 

[Sequoiasoon]

Not so sure about that. I had zero oil pressure one -42C morning in Hinton, Alberta using 5W30 in a 6.0L GMC 2500.
I shut the engine off after 15 seconds and tried again after a minute. On the third try I got oil pressure.
After a 12 hour shift at Hinton Pulp, I bought three 3x5qt boxes of M1 0W40 Euro on sale which went into two company trucks that day and again the next fall.

What is the HPL one that has some real crazy low pour point. Maybe Premium Plus?

 

[userfriendly]

What is the HPL one that has some real crazy low pour point. Maybe Premium Plus?

Most 0WXXs have a pour point lower than the temperature I’m getting out of bed to go outside.
It’s different when you have to of course. Your body better have an efficient fat burning metabolism because BTUs are leaving with every breath.
I remember my daughter saying that she hoped her truck wouldn’t start one northern Alberta oil patch morning, but it did and it ran without being shut off for a week. Esso XD3 0W40, now Mobil branded Delvac.
I think Delo 0w30 is the pour point winner, aimed at use on the Alaska north slope.

 

[ZeeOSix]

What is the HPL one that has some real crazy low pour point. Maybe Premium Plus?

Should be looking at the Cold Cranking (CCS) and Pumpability (MRV) viscosity for cold weather cranking and pumpability. What the "W" grade ratings are based on. Not so sure those two viscosity parameters directly follow the pour point ... I doubt they do because one is a kinematic and the other is a dynamic viscosity, two different flow mechanisms going on. The "W" ratings are not based on pour point for a reason.

 

[Sequoiasoon]

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/high-performance-lubricants-pcmo-series.344421

Post# 3 has the Premium Plus Acrobat information. 0W-40 is -58C, 5W-20 is -61C

 

[ZeeOSix]

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/high-performance-lubricants-pcmo-series.344421

Post# 3 has the Premium Plus Acrobat information. 0W-40 is -58C, 5W-20 is -61C

There's an example I was talking about. Note that the 0W-40 has a lower use "W" grade rating than the 5W-20, yet the pour point is lower on the 5W-20. You can't go by pour point to determine the cold weather cranking and pumpability of the oil.

 

[Sequoiasoon]

There's an example I was talking about. Note that the 0W-40 has a lower use "W" grade rating than the 5W-20, yet the pour point is lower on the 5W-20. You can't go by pour point to determine the cold weather cranking and pumpability of the oil.

For the average forum user (like me) that for some crazy reason moves to where it's -40C in the mornings what is easy to look at, block heater or not to get oil to my motor?

My brain says that if it pours at XXX temperature, it should be able to be pumped by a positive displacement pump.

M1 0W-40 lists -45C
PP euro 0W-40 lists -48C
HPL PPPCMO 0W-40 lists -58C

There are lots of others and maybe some with lower viscosity/pour point/pump point. I'm no where close to an expert. I come here to read and learn, maybe share if I think it will help. I understand and work with different viscosity materials and products daily but in totally different industry.

Maybe the OP didn't read on the HPL threads so just putting option out there. My vehicles barely see below 0F/-18C. Coldest I recall ever for me was -30F/-34C way back in 1988 at college. My 1.5L Honda Civic barely cranked and then started but had some version dino 10W30. If not for a battery made for a Chrysler 318 with a lot more CCA probably would not have. My car started, most other students in the parking lots didn't even crank. I used what dad bought and had me do oil changes with. We had a Ford LTD that he was running Mobil 1 for when we towed our trailer. That oil was a lot more money back then.

If I had known more then or if dad did, maybe the Civic would have had M1. He was the auto instructor that taught me so much. At least we switched from 10W40 to 10W30 for winter .

 

[Sequoiasoon]

There was so many other cold things that also could have use some synthetics but all worked eventually. Clutch pedal was like 300lbs on leg machine with only 1 leg pushing. Gear shifter needed 2 hands to move. Car started and died 4-5 times. Once started seemed to be running on 2 cyl. Tach needle was pegged past redline and dash stuff squealing away. Struts felt like I put in 2x4's in place BUT I didn't have to walk the mile plus to class and was able to go food and beer shopping when others couldn't.

Many had frozen fuel lines as they didn't use dry gas regularly either which dad had me do. Always filled up and 1 bottle of HEET in each tank back then.

 

[ZeeOSix]

For the average forum user (like me) that for some crazy reason moves to where it's -40C in the mornings what is easy to look at, block heater or not to get oil to my motor?

My brain says that if it pours at XXX temperature, it should be able to be pumped by a positive displacement pump.

M1 0W-40 lists -45C
PP euro 0W-40 lists -48C
HPL PPPCMO 0W-40 lists -58C

Those are all 0W rated oils. Compare the CCV, MRV and pour point of all three. You may find just like I mentioned in post 31 that the pour point is a poor indicator of cold start-up and pumpability performance. The CCS and MRV was invented and put into SAE J300 for a reason to define the W grade of motor oils.

At least we switched from 10W40 to 10W30 for winter .

Should have switched to a 0W or 5W, not another 10W oil.

 

[Snagglefoot]

FWIW the owners manuals for modern Chevrolet trucks with gasoline engines recommend 0w30 engine oil for temps below -29 C (-20 F).

You won’t find scientific reason for -29 C that relates to 0w30, since it obviously can handle -40. I would trust the Chevy engineers’ judgment on this one.

Come December I switch to Pennzoil Euro 0w30 and run it until June. I live near Cranbrook, BC with occasional trips to Calgary, Alberta in the winter. We have lows that hit -20 C routinely and -30 C occasionally in Cranbrook.
I don’t cringe when I come back from vacation and have to start my truck when it’s minus 30 C at the Canadian Rockies International airport (YXC).

Pick it up two 5 liter bottles of 0w30 on a sale from Canadian Tire then apply for the 20 gift card from Pennzoil. Enter through www.Pennzoil.ca.

 

[Sequoiasoon]

Should have switched to a 0W or 5W, not another 10W oil.

It was 35 years ago in 1988. I was 18. Dad bought the stuff and said use this.....

My car worked. Others didn't. I don't even recall if they had the 5W or 0W much less understand fully. I was using paper cans with the pointed puncture oil spout. Back then Mobil 1 was "causing leaks" in cars and "not compatible" with regular oil and my car was already high mileage.

Now I have learned a lot more.

Maybe share with the OP what you version/brand/weight you recommend and he can find on sale etc. to help with his original concerns. Add in the other fluids that may benefit him for differentials, tranny, coolant, windshield wash.

I often wonder about many of those when it gets really cold as well as all the house things like hot water baseboard, outside fuel oil tanks, plumbing to sinks etc. I have no clue what they do up there but often curious on how to save money with better insulating. All comes at a cost though.

 

[OVERKILL]

For the average forum user (like me) that for some crazy reason moves to where it's -40C in the mornings what is easy to look at, block heater or not to get oil to my motor?

My brain says that if it pours at XXX temperature, it should be able to be pumped by a positive displacement pump.

M1 0W-40 lists -45C
PP euro 0W-40 lists -48C
HPL PPPCMO 0W-40 lists -58C

There are lots of others and maybe some with lower viscosity/pour point/pump point. I'm no where close to an expert. I come here to read and learn, maybe share if I think it will help. I understand and work with different viscosity materials and products daily but in totally different industry.

Maybe the OP didn't read on the HPL threads so just putting option out there. My vehicles barely see below 0F/-18C. Coldest I recall ever for me was -30F/-34C way back in 1988 at college. My 1.5L Honda Civic barely cranked and then started but had some version dino 10W30. If not for a battery made for a Chrysler 318 with a lot more CCA probably would not have. My car started, most other students in the parking lots didn't even crank. I used what dad bought and had me do oil changes with. We had a Ford LTD that he was running Mobil 1 for when we towed our trailer. That oil was a lot more money back then.

If I had known more then or if dad did, maybe the Civic would have had M1. He was the auto instructor that taught me so much. At least we switched from 10W40 to 10W30 for winter .

The HPL Euro 0W-40 is -60C.

Pour Point was abandoned as part of the process for determining the Winter rating because it didn't properly capture how the oil performed. This is why we use CCS/MRV now.

IIRC, it was an oil that had a sufficiently low pour point, but, under a gradual freeze-thaw-freeze cycle formed significant wax crystals and was unable to pump. I think it was a SOPUS product, Quaker State I believe?

 

[Sequoiasoon]

The HPL Euro 0W-40 is -60C.

Pour Point was abandoned as part of the process for determining the Winter rating because it didn't properly capture how the oil performed. This is why we use CCS/MRV now.

IIRC, it was an oil that had a sufficiently low pour point, but, under a gradual freeze-thaw-freeze cycle formed significant wax crystals and was unable to pump. I think it was a SOPUS product, Quaker State I believe?

So as a general person looking to fill the "what should I buy to get oil flowing ASAP in really cold weather". What are the recommended CCS/MRV viscosities for what temp ranges? Is there a list of them easy to find without going to each brand/viscosity data sheet?

 

[kschachn]

So as a general person looking to fill the "what should I buy to get oil flowing ASAP in really cold weather". What are the recommended CCS/MRV viscosities for what temp ranges? Is there a list of them easy to find without going to each brand/viscosity data sheet?

That’s what the winter rating is for. Flow is irrelevant really, it’s about cranking and pumpability. If the oil can be pumped it will flow.

If you’re starting unaided below -35 or so then use an oil with a 0W rating. Above that a 5W rated oil will pump. The pump is what makes the oil flow.

Pumpability is a binary. If it can’t be pumped it won’t flow. But if it can be pumped then it will flow. Flow doesn’t lubricate the engine, the film thickness does.

 

[OVERKILL]

So as a general person looking to fill the "what should I buy to get oil flowing ASAP in really cold weather". What are the recommended CCS/MRV viscosities for what temp ranges? Is there a list of them easy to find without going to each brand/viscosity data sheet?

The purpose of the MRV test is to ensure that it will pump, ergo, as long as it carries the appropriate Winter grade for your anticipated ambient conditions, there's no real reason to try and sort out which MRV is the "best".

That said, an oil is allowed to slip a Winter grade in service due to PPD degradation. So, a 0W-40 could become a 5W-40, a 5W-30 could become a 10W-30. This is why, since I actually see -30C on occasion, I tend to look for PAO in the base oil blend, since it's not reliant on PPD's for its Winter grade performance, it's a function of the base oil itself, having no wax in it.