Snap-on pricing

[HangFire]

Which forum am I on, GJ? Oh, Bitog? Lol.

My understanding is the catalog prices are essentially MSRP and the truck driver can decide how much to discount. If financing, don't expect deals. Cash, make a deal. Also, promotions.

The Snap-on business model doesn't work for me. The online is too pricey, the truck doesn't come to my door, heck I couldn't even get a catalog when I asked for one. I wish them the best but the only S-O I own is decades old inheritance, or yard sale finds, and will likely stay that way.

 

[das_peikko]

Originally Posted by HangFire
The Snap-on business model doesn't work for me.


If I want something bad enough, their business model doesn't stop me.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by clinebarger
Originally Posted by billt460


So instead they pay obscene prices for tools from Snap On. And what's funny is many of Snap On's hand tools and wrench's do not have lifetime guarantees. While Harbor Freight's do.

What Snap-on hand tools??

We had a Snap On truck come to our place several years back. One of the guys had a Snap On combination open end / box wrench that had one of the ears break off. (He had purchased it over 20 years ago, and the only use it ever saw was on the draw bar of a Bridgeport). The wrench had a number on it, and when the driver checked it, he told him it was no longer under warranty.

They also require a ton of ridiculous, "proof of purchase". That same wrench would have been replaced by Craftsman or Harbor Freight immediately, and without any questions asked. The guy wanted $27.00 to sell him a new one. If you want to pay a premium for that, be my guest.

 

[billt460]

Getting warranty service is important regardless of brand. Any company can write a fabulous warranty on paper and stick it in the box. But if it becomes a PITA to get it honored, what good is it? If you compare Craftsman and Snap On to Harbor Freight hand tools, Harbor Freight has the distinct advantage. Both Craftsman and Harbor Freight come with a lifetime replacement warranty, no questions asked. As I mentioned, Snap On Requires all kinds of proof of purchase requirements, before they'll honor whatever their warranty is.

Harbor Freight remains far less expensive, even though both they and Craftsman are now made in China. Harbor Freight is expanding their business, and has been since they opened their doors in 1977. So they are well established with currently over 900 stores in 47 states, and growing.

This is important because when you need the warranty honored, you need it fast, and you want convenience doing it. I can drive to 4 different Harbor Freight stores within 20 minutes of my house. All have good hours, and are open 7 days a week. Craftsman? You tell me. Snap On? Even worse. That matters when it's Sunday afternoon, and you're in the middle of a job and something breaks. And let's face it, tools don't break while they're sitting in the box.

I'll take convenience, cost, and practicality, over "prestige", any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted by billt460
Getting warranty service is important regardless of brand. Any company can write a fabulous warranty on paper and stick it in the box. But if it becomes a PITA to get it honored, what good is it? If you compare Craftsman and Snap On to Harbor Freight hand tools, Harbor Freight has the distinct advantage. Both Craftsman and Harbor Freight come with a lifetime replacement warranty, no questions asked. As I mentioned, Snap On Requires all kinds of proof of purchase requirements, before they'll honor whatever their warranty is.

Harbor Freight remains far less expensive, even though both they and Craftsman are now made in China. Harbor Freight is expanding their business, and has been since they opened their doors in 1977. So they are well established with currently over 900 stores in 47 states, and growing.

This is important because when you need the warranty honored, you need it fast, and you want convenience doing it. I can drive to 4 different Harbor Freight stores within 20 minutes of my house. All have good hours, and are open 7 days a week. Craftsman? You tell me. Snap On? Even worse. That matters when it's Sunday afternoon, and you're in the middle of a job and something breaks. And let's face it, tools don't break while they're sitting in the box.

I'll take convenience, cost, and practicality, over "prestige", any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.


Ha. Reminds me of the faulty brake line wrench I bought.

I contacted the company and was told I should have bought directly through them.. They made it right by sending me another, but buying direct is normally pretty expensive, which I told them. If buying direct is what gives me good CS then I probably won't be buying their products anymore.

 

[hatt]

Sears had a bazillion stores too. All but out of business. Your beloved HF could change at any moment and you'll be sitting on a pile of potmetal.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by hatt
Your beloved HF could change at any moment and you'll be sitting on a pile of potmetal.

And the others can't? No one can accurately predict the future of any economy, let alone the businesses that operate in it. But you can say much the same about Snap On and Craftsman. Even more so because of their much higher pricing. But as we sit today Harbor Freight has the best track record, and offers the best warranty, lowest cost, and easiest convenience to get something replaced of the three.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted by billt460
Getting warranty service is important regardless of brand. Any company can write a fabulous warranty on paper and stick it in the box. But if it becomes a PITA to get it honored, what good is it? If you compare Craftsman and Snap On to Harbor Freight hand tools, Harbor Freight has the distinct advantage. Both Craftsman and Harbor Freight come with a lifetime replacement warranty, no questions asked. As I mentioned, Snap On Requires all kinds of proof of purchase requirements, before they'll honor whatever their warranty is.

Harbor Freight remains far less expensive, even though both they and Craftsman are now made in China. Harbor Freight is expanding their business, and has been since they opened their doors in 1977. So they are well established with currently over 900 stores in 47 states, and growing.

This is important because when you need the warranty honored, you need it fast, and you want convenience doing it. I can drive to 4 different Harbor Freight stores within 20 minutes of my house. All have good hours, and are open 7 days a week. Craftsman? You tell me. Snap On? Even worse. That matters when it's Sunday afternoon, and you're in the middle of a job and something breaks. And let's face it, tools don't break while they're sitting in the box.

I'll take convenience, cost, and practicality, over "prestige", any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.


I have some Snap on but I am not married to the brand only quality tools but I must say when I did buy Snap on I never had any trouble exchanging a couple of deep sockets that cracked (my fault using them on white hot exhaust manifold bolts), the Snap on guy was great.
I broke my inspection mirror and caught the truck at my friends garage and bought another, I told him I broke it he gave me the mirror no cost and told me to leave the broken one with my friend so he could get it next time.

You can talk about the price of premium tools all you want and you are correct they are high priced when compared to entry level tools but please don't compare them to crap tools or embellish warranty issues (they do stand behind their warranty that's a fact and do not care about proof of purchase if it has the brand stamp). Buy a Snap on or other premium ratchet use it for 10 years and tell us how that crap compares.

Anyone reading this thread needs to ask a simple question. Why would a guy who makes his living selling tools from a truck be a ball buster about warrantying a tool and risk loosing his rep and bread and butter or would it be better for his business for him to bend over backwards to keep his customers satisfied?
I cant think of any tool that if it broke I couldn't finish the job, most of my tools are redundant as is the case with most mechanics.

 

[NYEngineer]

I love Snap On's stuff but now that I no longer wrench professionally on a daily basis I only buy something from them if it's something I must have.

About twenty years ago, my service van got broken into and my hand box got taken. We got on the Snap On truck and duplicated the box. I almost fell over when the bill came to five grand. I remember picking up the set of chrome combination wrenches and saying how much is this? (3/8 to 1" set). The Snap on guy's answer was 414.10. That number has never stopped ringing in my head.
I added big American padlocks to my van doors that day and it never happened again.

 

[billt460]

Harbor Freight Hand Tool Warranty:

https://struggleville.net/harbor-freight-tool-warranty-return-information/

"Hand tools sold by Harbor Freight are guaranteed to be free from defects in material and workmanship for the life of the product. This warranty only applies to the original purchaser of the product. Harbor Freight will replace any broken hand tools with the same item, if the same item is no longer available they will replace it with the most similar item available. If you need to take advantage of this warranty all you have to do is bring the broken tool into any Harbor Freight store."

Snap On Hand Tool Warranty:

"Warranty - Professional Use for Products. Snap-on warrants to Customers who purchase Product from authorized Snap-on distribution channels for use in their profession that Snap-on® brand Products and Blue-Point® brand Products will be free from defects in workmanship and materials for a duration described in each Product's warranty code. The warranty duration depends upon the nature of the Product....Snap-on does NOT provide any warranty for (1) products labeled other than Snap-on or Blue-Point or (2) products subjected to "abnormal use". Products that are not labeled Snap-on or Blue-Point are subject to the warranty provided by the manufacturers of those products and Snap-on will pass along any such warranties. "Abnormal use" includes misuse, accident, modification, unreasonable use, abuse, neglect, lack of maintenance, use in product-related service, or use after the product is significantly worn."

https://www.snapon.com/industrial/utility/Warranty.nws

Craftsman Hand Tool Warranty:

"If the product fails to perform for any reason, we will replace it. Return damaged product to a stocking Retail Partner or call 1-888-331-4569 for details. No proof of purchase required."

https://www.craftsman.com/customer-care/warranty-information

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted by billt460
Harbor Freight Hand Tool Warranty:

https://struggleville.net/harbor-freight-tool-warranty-return-information/

Hand tools sold by Harbor Freight are guaranteed to be free from defects in material and workmanship for the life of the product.
Snap On Hand Tool Warranty:

Snap-on® brand Products and Blue-Point® brand Products will be free from defects in workmanship and materials for a duration described in each Product's warranty code. The warranty duration depends upon the nature of the Product....Snap-on does NOT provide any warranty for (1) products labeled other than Snap-on or Blue-Point

https://www.snapon.com/industrial/utility/Warranty.nws

Craftsman Hand Tool Warranty:

"If the product fails to perform for any reason, we will replace it. Return damaged product to a stocking Retail Partner or call 1-888-331-4569 for details. No proof of purchase required."

https://www.craftsman.com/customer-care/warranty-information


What is the life of the product as far as HF is concerned? Its not your lifetime. Its easy to warranty and replace a $1 tool sold for $10 a few times.
Its a pretty shabby tool if you have to worry about it breaking and being replaced every time you use it.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by Trav
What is the life of the product as far as HF is concerned? Its not your lifetime. Its easy to warranty and replace........

Then why doesn't Snap On do it unconditionally like Craftsman and Harbor Freight does? I mean come on, do you honestly think they could have written any more wiggle room into that warranty if they tried?....... Sorry but you didn't, "properly maintain" it........ Sorry but you, "abused" it....... Sorry but you, "misused" it....... Sorry but you, "neglected" it....... Sorry but you used it, "unreasonably"........ Sorry but it is, "significantly worn".

(By the way, real cute how you conveniently edited out that part of Snap On's warranty in your quote of my post. What's the matter, are you afraid someone will actually read it?)

For the well over double they are charging for their stuff, (triple or more compared to Harbor Freight), then to come at their customers with a song and dance, B.S. warranty like that, I would be embarrassed.

 

[doitmyself]

Yikes. Arguing Snap-on vs. Harbor Freight really brings out the bigoted views of some looking through extremely narrow goggles . Both models have a place and can work well for the intended audience. It's really that simple. Arguing one over the other is extreme apples and oranges.

30+ years ago Sears Craftsman was the perfect solution for home mechanics and even serious enthusiasts. Heck, I saw some professionals with a good selection of Craftsman in their tool chests. They were good enough tools that were inexpensive, easy to obtain, and easy to warranty. This model, decent US made tools cheap and easy, is probably history. I was hoping that SK might be able to take over the Craftsman position, but I don't think that will happen.

Harbor Freight is positioning itself to take advantage of Sears's demise. For the past five years they have been upping their game with better quality tools and effective (sometimes sleazy) marketing. This year they are introducing their Icon line of tools: https://toolguyd.com/harbor-freight-icon-tools-storage-2019/ .

Que sera sera.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by doitmyself
30+ years ago Sears Craftsman was the perfect solution for home mechanics and even serious enthusiasts.

They still are. What's changed? Their warranty has not faltered one bit. It can't be any simpler, better, or more easy to understand. "If the product fails to perform for any reason, we will replace it." How could they make a better product, or warranty it any better?

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by doitmyself
Harbor Freight is positioning itself to take advantage of Sears's demise.

Sears has nothing to do with Craftsman any longer. And they haven't since Sears sold the entire Craftsman name and line to Stanley / Black and Decker in March of 2017. If Sears goes belly up tomorrow , it won't effect either Harbor Freight, or Craftsman in the least.

 

[doitmyself]

Nothing?? Then why is Sears still selling Craftsman? They DO have something to do with Craftsman, even if SBD now owns the name. What's changed?? Sears sent their manufacturing to China, lowered their tool quality a lot, and kept the same pricing. Your logic suggests buying a Chinese water pump with lifetime warranty and exchange it every year vs. buying an OEM one and replace it once.

Sometimes, excellent products have mediocre warranties. You don't dismiss use of that superior product based on just the warranty. Case in point, look at Akebono brake pads: "Akebono warrants that its Products will be free from defects in material and workmanship for 12 months or 12,000 miles (brake calipers), or 90 days after shipment from Akebono's plant or 30 days from the date of installation (brake pads). "

I don't understand how your warranty logic holds water, especially for a professional that depends on his tools to make a living. Isn't that what this argument should be about - what works for the homeowner vs. what works for professionals?

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by doitmyself
Nothing?? Then why is Sears still selling Craftsman? They DO have something to do with Craftsman, even if SBD now owns the name. Sears sent their manufacturing to China, lowered their tool quality a lot, and kept the same pricing. You can buy a Chinese water pump with lifetime warranty and exchange it every year or buy an OEM one and replace it once.

Sometimes, excellent products have mediocre warranties. You don't dismiss use of that superior product based on just the warranty. Case in point, look at Akebono brake pads: "Akebono warrants that its Products will be free from defects in material and workmanship for 12 months or 12,000 miles (brake calipers), or 90 days after shipment from Akebono's plant or 30 days from the date of installation (brake pads). "

I don't understand how your warranty logic holds water, especially for a professional that depends on his tools to make a living. Isn't that what this argument should be about - what works for the homeowner vs. what works for professionals?

Sears does not own the line any longer. They no longer have anything to do with production, distribution, or sales. They simply sell the product just like Home Depot does. Do you think they have anything to do with Craftsman production? And what the heck do brake calipers and water pumps have to do with anything?

All I did was post and link the warranties of all 3 tools that have been mentioned in this thread, and everyone went nuts! So Craftsman is being manufactured in China? So what? How can you prove the quality of their product has been lowered because of it? You can't, period. So why make the claim?

And it's not, "my warranty logic". I didn't write them, I simply posted them. Make of it what you will. I didn't think posting them would induce a coronary for God's sake. I guess it struck a painful nerve with Snap On lovers, that's for sure. Going as far as to have someone edit their warranty restrictions out of my post when they quoted it. Seriously? You would think I peed on the Pope during Christmas Mass.

And what's the difference if the guy using these tools is a, "professional" or a, "homeowner"? Don't "professionals" own homes? The warranty is no different. If it breaks both Harbor Freight and Craftsman will replace it with no questions asked. Snap On..... Good luck. Besides, I have a few homeowner friends I would trust under the hood of my car far more than some of these supposed, "professionals".

If you still think Snap On is the way to go, in spite of their "mediocre warranty", then by all means buy them. They'll be more than happy to take your money. And you'll be the coolest guy in the garage.

 

[ArrestMeRedZ]

I have no dog in the fight with the Snap On vs. Craftsman discussion, only with the comparison of US and Chinese made Craftsman hand tools.
I have a pretty complete set of American made Craftsman tools. I have purchased some of the newer Chinese made Craftsman tools. As far as I'm concerned, the Chinese tools I have are complete junk. I am done with Craftsman unless I can find the older American stuff.

One specific example is the newer top of the line "Diamond tip" screwdriver set. I did not see it was made in China until i got the set home. The tip wore out of a medium sized phillips after putting in a dozen screws. I can cite other observations if necessary. I would say the Chinese Craftsman tools are Harbor Freight quality at Craftsman prices, but I believe that would be demeaning to Harbor Freight.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by ArrestMeRedZ
I have no dog in the fight with the Snap On vs. Craftsman discussion, only with the comparison of US and Chinese made Craftsman hand tools.
I have a pretty complete set of American made Craftsman tools. I have purchased some of the newer Chinese made Craftsman tools. As far as I'm concerned, the Chinese tools I have are complete junk. I am done with Craftsman unless I can find the older American stuff.

One specific example is the newer top of the line "Diamond tip" screwdriver set. I did not see it was made in China until i got the set home. The tip wore out of a medium sized phillips after putting in a dozen screws. I can cite other observations if necessary. I would say the Chinese Craftsman tools are Harbor Freight quality at Craftsman prices, but I believe that would be demeaning to Harbor Freight.

I can't comment on Craftsman tool quality of late, simply because I have not bought or used any. That said, I wouldn't hesitate to. What irritates me, is as soon as someone hears the word China, immediately they insinuate it automatically means poor quality. That is not always the case. Honda has moved their small engine production to China. As have many companies. More are going to. Like it or not. Accept it or not, that's the global market we now live in.

I have no dog in this fight either. I own Craftsman, and Harbor freight tools. I've come to acquire a few Snap On wrenches and sockets at flea markets, gun shows, garage sales and such over the years. But I've never bought and paid for one off a Snap On truck. I just think they are too overpriced. Actually, I was a bit surprised myself when I looked up their warranty. To find it so full of petty holes. I expected more.

I have never had to return a Harbor Freight wrench. Or any power tool for that matter. And I have abused a few of them. Especially when I was working. So I will continue to buy them as I find the need. But as I get older, I'll most likely be using them less and less. And I've never had any brand loyalty to any of them.

 

[doitmyself]

People disagree with you because:

- There are lots of facts showing Chinese Craftsman having lower attributes than even the declining US Craftsman of recent past: https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=craftsman+wrench+quality+china+vs.+US
- You don't acknowledge a difference between homeowner use of tools and professional use of tools.
- You emphasize the importance of Snap-on ownership as a status symbol.
- You don't understand my analogy of Akebono pads with only a 30 day warranty or Chinese water pump with a lifetime warranty.
- You don't accept that Sears still has a hand in Craftsman production. Here's an example: The Sears line of Craftsman 20V drills is different and not compatible with the Lowes Craftsman 20V drill. This means that Sears requested to SBD to produce a drill for them that is different than what SBD is producing for Lowes. https://toolguyd.com/craftsman-v20-sears-craftsman-20v-compatibility/ . This seems to indicate they DO have something to do with production and sales.
- You state it's not your warranty logic and them back it up with "If you still think Snap On is they way to go, in spite of their "mediocre warranty", then by all means buy them. They'll be more than happy to take your money. And you'll be the coolest guy in the garage." Your entire argument seems to be about warranty.

I don't own any Snap-on, so why throw out comments like "painful nerve with Snap-on owners and coolest guy in the garage"? That's an example of attacking the person vs. supporting your debate. The difference is that I can understand why some people choose Snap-on and you won't.