Propflux01
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That is what I used, yes. I didn't think it performed any different than the older formula. If you think it's the oil, then drain it and replace it. Come back with the results.
Rotella t4 causing clutch to drag?
- Thread starter jimbocarrey
- Start date
Go to Walmart and get some Valvoline 10W-40 motorcycle oil (conventional). It works well in every bike I've used it in.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Valvoline-4-Stroke-Motorcycle-10W-40-Conventional-Motor-Oil-1-QT/16879749
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Valvoline-4-Stroke-Motorcycle-10W-40-Conventional-Motor-Oil-1-QT/16879749
An 82 bike, stuck together clutch plates are the likely cause.
Except he said in post #1 that the clutch worked normally until he changed the oil.
It also worked right after the oil change. My guess would be some stuff got loose, or something, the bike sat for 10 days and now there is a problem.
It’s an old bike, so these things do happen. Also, even if we assume the clutch is in good working order, I don’t know how an oil would keep it engaged. Even gear oil wouldn’t be able to do that.
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You know what? That's exactly what I'm going to do. I just went to Walmart and got four quarts of this and will be replacing the Rotella with it tonight and letting it run a bit. I'll report back with what happens
Could be the fiber clutch plates swelled up. It sounds like there isn't enough space between the clutch plates (for some reason) when the clutch is fully disengaged.
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I know the question wasn't directed at me, but I'll answer it anyway... lol
I have used the T4 15w40 for many years in my Shadow 750, and before that in my Nighthawk 750 when it was just call6 Rotella T 15W40.
I tried the T6 15W40 for one year in a Shadow 750 and I went back to the T4. The T6 made the gears feel slushy, too loose. I was worried I might need new clutch springs... Went back to the T4 and everything went back to normal.
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Ok! So I let the Rotella drain out for about 12 hours lol, and replaced it with the valvoline 10w-40 that ZeeOSix suggested. It definitely helped! The clutch is still dragging but not as much and once it's warmed up it will actually shift into first without stalling, which it wouldn't do at all with the Rotella. It still drags when cold enough to lurch forward and stall out though, so I still have a problem. Not sure what to make of it...
I think you're going to have to pull the clutch plates out and clean them.
I suspect the old oil was sheared down to nothing and it was so thin it was allowing you to shift.
When you went from something like a 0w15 (the old oil) to 15w40, that's when the problem became pronounced.
The Valvoline 10w40 isn't as thick, but it's still thicker than the old, sheared down oil.
Lots of folks seem to like Rotella T6 5w40, but at this point, I think it's clear that your problem isn't the brand of oil or the weight...
You just need to fix the clutch.
I suspect the old oil was sheared down to nothing and it was so thin it was allowing you to shift.
When you went from something like a 0w15 (the old oil) to 15w40, that's when the problem became pronounced.
The Valvoline 10w40 isn't as thick, but it's still thicker than the old, sheared down oil.
Lots of folks seem to like Rotella T6 5w40, but at this point, I think it's clear that your problem isn't the brand of oil or the weight...
You just need to fix the clutch.
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That makes a lot of sense. And I wouldn't put it past the previous owner to have literally put some lightweight oil in there to make sure it would shift long enough to sell it since he lied about other things.
Regardless, if I understand you right are you saying that the clutch plates probably have gunk build up from sitting for years in old oil? So essentially making the plates thicker than they should be and not allowing them clearance to slip past each other, right ? And what would be the process of cleaning them once I take them out? Is there any chance that the plates are ruined and it will need new ones or is it fairly certain that these can be restored? Sorry for the 20 Questions LOL thanks in advance!
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Yep I rode it around town tonight for about an hour and about 20 miles. Now we'll see if anything has changed after it's cooled down tomorrow.
When I got home I put it on the center stand and the wheel would lightly spin and come to a stop in 1st with the clutch pulled. It was still clunking pretty loudly into 1st from neutral though
Most bikes I've owned will barely spin the rear wheel when off the ground and the clutch fully disengaged and engine hot ... that's just the viscous coupling between the plates going on.
The transmission "clunking" when going from neutral into first gear can just be a characteristic of the bike. Some of my bikes "clunk" more than others when going from neutral to 1st gear.
Keep riding it and see how it goes.
When you suspect that the oil was not the culprit a savoy owner would invest in some good old sweat equity...
Under scrutiny you may find that your clutch problems are due to normal glazing and contaminates...
Deglazing clutch plates...
Inspect the friction plates for glazing... make sure you have plenty
of material to work with... your shop manual states clutch thickness
in thousands of an inch or mm...
First removed the contaminants with Acetone... pick a hard surface to lay
over a 600 grit black dry emery paper... rotate the clutch plate in a
circle... you're just busting the glaze... don't get carried away
remove too much material... You should end up with a friction plate
looks dull like a new one as opposed to a shinny glazed one... recheck
thickness...
Next check the pressure plates for bluing caused by localized heat...
make sure they are not warped... consult the manual for a thickness
range... now removed the contaminants with Acetone and wire wheeled
them to erased the blue and also to generally scuff up the surface...
you should end up with a dull surface free of Blue marks...
When you suspect that the oil was not the culprit a savoy owner would invest in some good old sweat equity...
Under scrutiny you may find that your clutch problems are due to normal glazing and contaminates...
Deglazing clutch plates...
Inspect the friction plates for glazing... make sure you have plenty
of material to work with... your shop manual states clutch thickness
in thousands of an inch or mm...
First removed the contaminants with Acetone... pick a hard surface to lay
over a 600 grit black dry emery paper... rotate the clutch plate in a
circle... you're just busting the glaze... don't get carried away
remove too much material... You should end up with a friction plate
looks dull like a new one as opposed to a shinny glazed one... recheck
thickness...
Next check the pressure plates for bluing caused by localized heat...
make sure they are not warped... consult the manual for a thickness
range... now removed the contaminants with Acetone and wire wheeled
them to erased the blue and also to generally scuff up the surface...
you should end up with a dull surface free of Blue marks...
After cleaning the steel plates thoroughly and checking for scoring or discoloration I also lay them on a clean piece of glass plate and tap the edges with gentle finger pressure, flip the plate over, do it again, repeat for every plate. If the steel plates are warped this will show it up.
I've seen warped steel plates create disengagement trouble, anything that takes up too much space in the pack can create drag.
Clutch plate glazing isn't going to cause a clutch to not fully disengage and drag. What causes a clutch to not fully disengage is the lack of proper air space between all the clutch plates (steel and fiber). As CCI mentioned, if the steel plates got real hot an warped, that could cause full disengagement problems. But the OP changed the oil to Valvoline M/C oil and seems to have helped out enough to be able to ride the bike, whereas before that it wasn't really ridable.
It's not so much that they are thicker, it's that the goo we're all referring to here is simply making the plates stick together.
It's highly unlikely that the plates are permanently damaged. I've seen this happen, but more often from the wrong oil and the clutch is slipping rather than dragging. In this case (dragging) it's highly unlikely that there is any permanent damage.
I've never used acetone as BusyLittleShop suggests, but I like the idea, I probably will in the future. It makes sense. I usually use brake cleaner, it works on friction pads and doesn't leave residue.
When you scuff the friction plates, go easy. I like to lay a full sheet of new sandpaper on a very flat surface (like that glass plate I mentioned) and just barely rub the plates on it. You don't have to take much off, as soon as the surface changes color it's time to stop.
This really is a common problem with bikes that have sat a long time. Not a big deal. You'll do fine.
Mercy Zee... you ought to offer to pay for that oil that did not return the OPs clutch back to 100% serviceable...
Guess you missed where he said the bike is actually ridable now, when it was not with the Rotella. You think it was just a "coincidence" that the clutch operation changed when he went to the Valvoline? Use some logic, lol.