Potentially neglected Toyota 1NR-FE -- 0w20? Motul 8100 Eco-Lite?

[geetar]

Picked up a 2012 Yaris with the 1NR-FE 1.33L engine with no service history at 80k miles - took a gamble at a low price, its probably had some maintenance throughout its life, but it was a recovered vehicle so the paperwork was lost at some point.

I've done an initial oc using Shell Helix Ultra 5w30 AF which meets API SL, ACEA A5/B5, Ford WSS-M2C913-C & WSS-M2C913-D which leads me to believe that this is a "thin" 5w30 - though forgive me I am still quite the noob at this (this is a readily available cheap oil in the UK)

The car feels a little bit sluggish to accelerate and doesn't rev as freely as I think it should, and I found this post:

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/oil-for-toyota-1nr-fe-stop-start.161867/

and this comment by the same user:

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/who-is-buying-toyota-0w-20.173635/post-2590823

Trying to decide how to go about a reduced OCI...

Toyota dealers in the UK seem to universally stick Toyota branded 5w30 in anything that comes through the door (may not be the case for the newer hybrids), but I've just ordered a service kit for my Lexus GS450H and they've given me 5w30 for that as well so that probably isn't an option.

I have also read elsewhere that the 1NR engine is prone to piston rings getting gummed up and thus causing oil consumption, its too early to tell, but my oil level may have dropped slightly since I changed it (could be I just didn't set the level as high as I thought I did), but if that's the case, I plan to soak the cylinders in engine oil flush (seen good results with LiquiMoly - despite what people say on this forum), remove the flush and also do a crankcase flush and drain, removing the sump if necessary. Then continue to do a short OCI for a few k miles.

Question is, what oil to use, considering that Toyota OEM oil is sometimes Mobil1, Eneos, Idemitsu etc. and the genuine bottles don't give anything away, I have got the impression that their oil is a fairly average oil sold at a premium.

I've come across Motul 8100 Eco-Lite 0w20 which is available at a relatively reasonable price, compared to OEM at least, I've also used Millers and Comma 0w20 oils in our Suzuki which are well regarded by professionals, but don't really have many approvals or independent testing.

I'm also finding a lot of ACEA C5 low viscosity oils that have lots of Volvo approvals and some of them say that they are ONLY for use in Volvos lol.

Wondering if anyone has any thoughts on insight into this situation?
I'm still not at a level where I am able to fully interpret PDS and the numbers of different oils, sorry.

 

[doublebase]

I mean, at least here in the US 0W20 oils are plentiful and there are a ton of options. And the Toyota Genuine Motor Oil 0W20 is considered a quality setup.

Where it’s only a short interval you plan to run, I’d just go with whatever was the cheapest oil you could find.

But if you were in the states and plan on running that thing on a 0W20, there would be a ton of options.

Mobil1 and Castrol now offer their 20,000 mile 0W20’s extended performance oils.

Valvoline has an extended performance oil

There’s Pennzoil Platinum Ultra and regular. Both I believe are gas to liquid, and supposedly are known for being able to “clean” an engine.

There are at least three house brand oils that meet modern specifications put out by Walmart, Costco and Amazon. Amalie is making oil for some parts stores now, carrying the latest certifications in their 0W20 synthetic.

We have the Redlines, Amsoils, Royal Purple of the world.

Lots of choices here for 0W20 that would treat that Yaris just fine.

 

[Bailes1992]

There is absolutley no way you can tell the difference between a 0w20 and a thin 5w30. I've swapped and changed between oils and visocisites in loads of engines and have never been able to feel a difference. More recently I've gone from a 5w20 Dexos D oil to Castrol Vecton 10w40 E9 in my Vauxhall Insignia with a tiddly little 1.5 3 cylinder diesel and I haven't noticed an ounce of change. I would suggest it's all a placebo.

I've always been skepitcal of Millers Oils and Comma Oils because of the lack of approvals. But they do have some approvals and both oil manafacturers generally have a good following in the UK so certainly nothing to be scared of. I may try some Millers products next actually.

All the oils you mention are all quality oils that would serve you well. Personally, I'd probably go to Costco and pick up a 5l jug of M1 0w40 for £30 and throw that in there.

 

[geetar]

I mean, at least here in the US 0W20 oils are plentiful and there are a ton of options. And the Toyota Genuine Motor Oil 0W20 is considered a quality setup.

Where it’s only a short interval you plan to run, I’d just go with whatever was the cheapest oil you could find.

But if you were in the states and plan on running that thing on a 0W20, there would be a ton of options.

Mobil1 and Castrol now offer their 20,000 mile 0W20’s extended performance oils.

Valvoline has an extended performance oil

There’s Pennzoil Platinum Ultra and regular. Both I believe are gas to liquid, and supposedly are known for being able to “clean” an engine.

There are at least three house brand oils that meet modern specifications put out by Walmart, Costco and Amazon. Amalie is making oil for some parts stores now, carrying the latest certifications in their 0W20 synthetic.

We have the Redlines, Amsoils, Royal Purple of the world.

Lots of choices here for 0W20 that would treat that Yaris just fine.

I am in the UK, 0w20 is becoming more common, certainly was a struggle when I first got the Suzuki some years ago, but the options aren't as vast, and a lot of the locally blended stuff carry no approvals whatsoever. Looking at Comma and Millers in particular. Castrol only does Edge 0w20 which is ACEA C5.

We don't have Pennzoil, Royal Pruple, or Amsoil at standard motor factors - certain online specialists may have some but its expensive and not the entire range.

There is absolutley no way you can tell the difference between a 0w20 and a thin 5w30. I've swapped and changed between oils and visocisites in loads of engines and have never been able to feel a difference. More recently I've gone from a 5w20 Dexos D oil to Castrol Vecton 10w40 E9 in my Vauxhall Insignia with a tiddly little 1.5 3 cylinder diesel and I haven't noticed an ounce of change. I would suggest it's all a placebo.

I've always been skepitcal of Millers Oils and Comma Oils because of the lack of approvals. But they do have some approvals and both oil manafacturers generally have a good following in the UK so certainly nothing to be scared of. I may try some Millers products next actually.

All the oils you mention are all quality oils that would serve you well. Personally, I'd probably go to Costco and pick up a 5l jug of M1 0w40 for £30 and throw that in there.

I would disagree, I recently put Magnatec 5w30 A5 in the Suzuki Swift and the cold start is definitely more noticeable than when it was on any of the 0w20s that I have previously used - including Comma and Millers. I'll still leave it in there for 5k miles, but next time its going back to 0w20.

For the Yaris, I may well go for the Millers or Comma stuff, at least whilst going through a flushing / short OCI process, and to see how it reacts to 0w20 before settling on something that can stay in there for 6-7k miles.

 

[ka9mnx]

API SL in a 2012? I would look for an A3/B4 5w-30 or 10w-30 or 0w40 as was suggested. A 1.33L isn't going to be peppy.

 

[geetar]

In case someone else is interested:

Source: https://mag.toyota.co.uk/find-the-right-oil-for-your-toyota/

 

[geetar]

API SL in a 2012? I would look for an A3/B4 5w-30 or 10w-30 or 0w40 as was suggested. A 1.33L isn't going to be peppy.

The 1.33L isn't a performance motor of course, but at the moment it feels slower than what it is on paper, the reason I bring this up is the comment from another user in the second post I referenced:

"At a recent service of my Auris, I changed from Motul Eco-clean C2 0W30, to Toyota Genuine Formula XS 0W20. The difference was actually shocking. Free revving, less need to downshift and the consumption improved at least 5mpg. This was a great surprise given that the Motul is an extremely thin 0W30. This engine (1NR-FE) clearly needs thin oil and perhaps a dose of moly? It even seems to prefer the Formula XS over the Eneos 0W20 I had in previously. I think the Formula XS in europe/UK is XOM. Unfortunately, it cost $16-18/L. I try and pick it up cheap on eBay if possible. My other option in Honda Genuine 0W20 which i believe is Total made and substantially cheaper."

The Auris is a bigger and heavier class of car than the Yaris and its fitted with the same engine and same state of tune so it should be more than capable in the Yaris. Don't forget that the Yaris is also offered with the 1.0L 3-cyl 1KR-FE engine, which itself is actually a peach, though very slow.

 

[Gene K]

API SL in a 2012? I would look for an A3/B4 5w-30 or 10w-30 or 0w40 as was suggested. A 1.33L isn't going to be peppy.

It meets STJLR.03.5003 so I suspect it's SL because it's to robust an oil to meet newer API requirements. It meets ACEA A5 which is what matters. I believe 0W-20 is preferred with 5W-30 A5 as an alternative but I'm sure that varies with market. I doubt much difference will be felt between a 5W-30 A5 and a 0W-20.

 

[PimTac]

A 30 grade is a 30 grade. The Shell oil you are running is very good. I wouldn’t over think this.

 

[geetar]

Bit of an update...

After 1k miles on the Shell 5w30 AF and what appears to be considerable oil consumption, I pulled the spark plugs out (to find a piece of porcelain missing from the cylinder 1 plug).
I filled the combustion chambers with Mannol engine flush and turned the engine over by hand a few times. I left it soak overnight.

The next day I bought new spark plugs (Denso SC16HR11 which supersedes the SC20HR11 that I removed). Toyota/Denso have updated the spark plug requirements for this engine.

I used a hand pump to remove most of the engine flush from the chambers, and then cranked the engine using the starter motor, sans EFI fuses. Any remaining flush product shot out of the spark plug holes.

The new plugs were fitted, and I ran the engine up to operating temperature - lots of white exhaust smoke from the flush residue. Once the white smoke cleared, I added another can of Mannol engine flush to the crank case, idled for 10 minutes, and drained the oil.

This time I have done a cheap oil change, using a Blueprint filter and a mixture of Shell 5w30 AF, Castrol 5w30 and Fuchs 5w40 I had leftover. It would've been more useful to use the same oil again, to see if the consumption was reduced, but hey ho.

I will run it for another 1-2k miles, and add LiquiMoly Oil Sludge Flush, which is meant to stay in for 200km (~120 miles), before doing another oil change. If it continues to consume oil at that point, I will change to 5w40. I have noticed that on cold start ups, the oil pressure light doesn't stay on as long as it used to prior to flushing - so I do think that something has improved.

It could be that the broken spark plug caused some damage to cylinder 1, not sure what happened, but the spark plugs are due every 60k miles on these. Perhaps this plug design was defective and that's why it was superseded. The car had no issues running with a bit of porcelain missing, but I am glad I changed them.

 

[PimTac]

That may have been the problem all along. Those may have been the original plugs for all we know.

Run it for a while and see if things improve.

 

[elone]

I will run it for another 1-2k miles, and add LiquiMoly Oil Sludge Flush, which is meant to stay in for 200km (~120 miles), before doing another oil change. If it continues to consume oil at that point, I will change to 5w40. I have noticed that on cold start ups, the oil pressure light doesn't stay on as long as it used to prior to flushing - so I do think that something has improved.

It could be that the broken spark plug caused some damage to cylinder 1, not sure what happened, but the spark plugs are due every 60k miles on these. Perhaps this plug design was defective and that's why it was superseded. The car had no issues running with a bit of porcelain missing, but I am glad I changed them.

Any update on change in oil consumption after the engine flush? I have the same engine and it consumes 0.5L/1000km with Toyota AFE 0w20. Previously I had Toyota FE 5w30 in the engine and 0.2L/1000km consumption. I am thinking of doing an engine flush and going back to 5w30.

 

[geetar]

Any update on change in oil consumption after the engine flush? I have the same engine and it consumes 0.5L/1000km with Toyota AFE 0w20. Previously I had Toyota FE 5w30 in the engine and 0.2L/1000km consumption. I am thinking of doing an engine flush and going back to 5w30.

Hi, here's an update. I was following the car being driven by a family member and I noticed it was letting out a very small puff of blue smoke on hard acceleration. Essentially I think the engine is very worn out with some kind of significant damage to one of the cylinders.

Having said, I did a quick "spill and fill" on the engine the oil using some bulk bought Mannol 5w40 and stuck a bottle of CataClean in the petrol tank just before the MOT, which includes an emission test using an exhaust probe. It past with flying colours.

Essentially, there is no smoke when the oil is clean, but once it becomes contaminated after 3k or 4k miles, it reveals some smoke from the exhaust.

Obviously no amount of flushing is able to save this engine, but I will still use it at the next proper oil change. I will be using any bulk bought 5w40 from now on and probably flush with SeaFoam. We still intend to keep the car for some time, as we've spent some money on it with new tyres, alignment, new AC condenser, etc. and it is still useable as long as the smoking doesn't get worse. The added cost of oil top ups can be mitigated by using cheap bulk oil...

I think your plan to use a flush, and switch to 5w30 is a good idea.

 

[sphinxgr]

Hello from Greece. We've made a huge research for the 1 NR FE in order to find a solution the past 6 years. We have writen everything in this forum https://forum.4troxoi.gr/topic/90795/node-90795

Also this guy explains very well the problem.



TOYOTA also has a tsb that informs for the problem solution.

We have done a lot of tests. Only one solutions is working. To clean the pistons from the upper side in order to clean from carbon the top 2 rings.

With engine flush you only clean the third ring and there is no results. Also with different oil viscocity, you create greater problems, and the engine is rattling. The only correct viscocity is 0-20 for this engine.

The cleaning procedure that worked and from oil consumption of 7,5l per 5000km gone to 600ml per 5000km, was spraying from sparks holes cleaning fluid (very lube - xado anti-carbon engine cleaner). This should be done with a specific procedure.

Do your own research, there are solutions for 1 NR FE.

 

[elone]

Hello from Greece. We've made a huge research for the 1 NR FE in order to find a solution the past 6 years. We have writen everything in this forum https://forum.4troxoi.gr/topic/90795/node-90795

Also this guy explains very well the problem.



TOYOTA also has a tsb that informs for the problem solution.

We have done a lot of tests. Only one solutions is working. To clean the pistons from the upper side in order to clean from carbon the top 2 rings.

With engine flush you only clean the third ring and there is no results. Also with different oil viscocity, you create greater problems, and the engine is rattling. The only correct viscocity is 0-20 for this engine.

The cleaning procedure that worked and from oil consumption of 7,5l per 5000km gone to 600ml per 5000km, was spraying from sparks holes cleaning fluid (very lube - xado anti-carbon engine cleaner). This should be done with a specific procedure.

Do your own research, there are solutions for 1 NR FE.

Thank you @geetar for the update and thank you so much @sphinxgr for adding some detail and a recommended solution. I have watched the video and it is telling the same thing as a Totalcar blog where they disassembled the engine.
I would like to try the Xado Anticarbon spray on my engine, but I can only find the tube version, not the spray version. I hope that it is the same. I am waiting for the next oil change, and after applying Xado I will probably still keep using the same 0w20 oil to see if there is any difference. I do confirm that with the 0w20 I seem to have less engine "clicking" noise when accelerating in 2nd or 3rd gear.

 

[sphinxgr]

Thank you @geetar for the update and thank you so much @sphinxgr for adding some detail and a recommended solution. I have watched the video and it is telling the same thing as a Totalcar blog where they disassembled the engine.
I would like to try the Xado Anticarbon spray on my engine, but I can only find the tube version, not the spray version. I hope that it is the same. I am waiting for the next oil change, and after applying Xado I will probably still keep using the same 0w20 oil to see if there is any difference. I do confirm that with the 0w20 I seem to have less engine "clicking" noise when accelerating in 2nd or 3rd gear.

Unfortunately due to the war in Ukraine, the factory (xado) is not working and there is limited availability.

If you search more (ebay?), maybe you can find a spray. Tubes are the same, but it is difficult for the 1nr fe to use them because of the length of the hole for the sparks.

 

[elone]

Hello @sphinxgr! I was able to get an anticarbon spray and did the cleaning through the spark plug holes according to the instructions. In my case nothing came out of the spark plug holes while I was cranking the engine for 2x 10 seconds (the engine is 1.33 1NR-FE with 175 000 kms). After putting back the spark plugs, and revving the engine for about 15 minutes between 1000-2300 rpms, water like substance came out of the exhaust (I assume this was the liquid from the spray). During this time, also white smoke came out, but only at the higher revolutions. The smoke had an almond/soapy smell. After this we changed the oil to 0w20, but the check engine light came on together with the slip indicator. The service guy cleared the errors and I went home.

Two days later I went to work, and there were no issues. But when I wanted to go home, the check engine light came on again together with the slip indicator. I did 500 meters, and I stopped the engine for a minute, when I restarted it, the signals were gone and I went home. The next day the car worked fine, but sometimes in the traffic the idle speed increased up to 1600 rpm all by itself. The third day the check engine light came on again with the slip indicator, and it went away only after I stopped the engine and restarted it again. I asked the sevice guy to check the error and it was a P0016 error regarding crankshaft/camshaft position, so it might not be related. He cleared the error and it did not come back again.

Regarding the oil consumption, I did make a 300 km trip since then, but the consumption is there at about the same amount as before. Did I do something wrong? Do you recommend another cleaning with the xado spray? I am thinking of replacing the spark plugs, the cover gasket of the motor, and the PCV valve, so see if any of those would help, but If none of that helps, I guess I will go back to using 5W30.

 

[sphinxgr]

Hello @sphinxgr! I was able to get an anticarbon spray and did the cleaning through the spark plug holes according to the instructions. In my case nothing came out of the spark plug holes while I was cranking the engine for 2x 10 seconds (the engine is 1.33 1NR-FE with 175 000 kms). After putting back the spark plugs, and revving the engine for about 15 minutes between 1000-2300 rpms, water like substance came out of the exhaust (I assume this was the liquid from the spray). During this time, also white smoke came out, but only at the higher revolutions. The smoke had an almond/soapy smell. After this we changed the oil to 0w20, but the check engine light came on together with the slip indicator. The service guy cleared the errors and I went home.

Two days later I went to work, and there were no issues. But when I wanted to go home, the check engine light came on again together with the slip indicator. I did 500 meters, and I stopped the engine for a minute, when I restarted it, the signals were gone and I went home. The next day the car worked fine, but sometimes in the traffic the idle speed increased up to 1600 rpm all by itself. The third day the check engine light came on again with the slip indicator, and it went away only after I stopped the engine and restarted it again. I asked the sevice guy to check the error and it was a P0016 error regarding crankshaft/camshaft position, so it might not be related. He cleared the error and it did not come back again.

Regarding the oil consumption, I did make a 300 km trip since then, but the consumption is there at about the same amount as before. Did I do something wrong? Do you recommend another cleaning with the xado spray? I am thinking of replacing the spark plugs, the cover gasket of the motor, and the PCV valve, so see if any of those would help, but If none of that helps, I guess I will go back to using 5W30.

Let me explain quick the cleaning process @elone
• We need the engine cold. Then we turn it on until 1-2 dots of temperature rise
• We disconnect the fuses related to injection in order not to inject any fuel to the cylinders (disconnect ignition timing sensor, Hall device and commutator)
• We spray in each cylinder for 5 seconds
• We put the sparks
• We wait 15 minutes
• Remove Sparks and put a clean towel to the spark holes
• For 5-10 secs we rev the engine
• Final we put back the sparks and the fuses, start the engine and run it at moderate rpm for up to 15 minutes. During this period softened remains of carbon will be removed through the exhaust system.

Have you done all of the above in this order?

 

[elone]

Let me explain quick the cleaning process @elone
• We need the engine cold. Then we turn it on until 1-2 dots of temperature rise
• We disconnect the fuses related to injection in order not to inject any fuel to the cylinders (disconnect ignition timing sensor, Hall device and commutator)
• We spray in each cylinder for 5 seconds
• We put the sparks
• We wait 15 minutes
• Remove Sparks and put a clean towel to the spark holes
• For 5-10 secs we rev the engine
• Final we put back the sparks and the fuses, start the engine and run it at moderate rpm for up to 15 minutes. During this period softened remains of carbon will be removed through the exhaust system.

Have you done all of the above in this order?

Yes, this is exactly the order in which we did all the steps. The difference was minimal: the engine was not cold in the beginning, but I waited the engine temperature to drop to about 60 C as mentioned in the instructions. We also did an extra step by changing the oil completely afterwards.

Now I have made 530 km since the cleaning, and I can confirm that the oil consumption is the same, so it seems that it did not help.

 

[elone]

@sphinxgr I have done 2200 km since the cleaning with Xado Anticarbon and the consumed oil is 1.1 L, which means that the consumption did drop from 0.6 to 0.5 L/1000 km. I could not see the change until now, because it is only an improvement of about 17%. It is not much, but it is better than before, so I might use it again in the future. Thank you again for the recommendation!