Next size larger than the Pure one pl14610?

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: JGmazda
Nice post! Soooo....assuming you can fit the larger filter, why would you go with the smaller filter? I've used both the NAPA GOLD and the P1. I think I'll go with the larger filter next time.

Also... Does anyone know if the NAPA GOLD 1356 has a larger equivalent?


I'm running the PureONE 14459 which is the larger diameter of the 14610, which is same as NAPA Gold 1356 (see my photos above). So if you cross the Purolator 14459 to the equivalent NAPA Gold you should have it.

Looks like a 1334 (NAPA Gold) or 51334 (WIX) = Purolator 14459.

http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/results.asp?PartNo=14459&Submit=Search

http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/PartDetail.asp?Part=51334

The Beta Ratio on the WIX 51334 isn't great IMO. 95% efficient at 40 microns.
Beta Ratio: 2/20=22/40

Purolator Classic in this size is 97.5% @ 20 microns. PureONE in this size is 99.9% @ 20 microns.

 

[JGmazda]

Thanks for the links and the info! I guess it does not make sense then to run the bigger NAPA?

Beta ratio isn't as good. Even though capacity is larger.

I wonder why the PL14610 isn't just equated to the better filter-
(The 14459)? Aside from clearance issues...???

Thanks again.

 

[JGmazda]

Must be a reason the manufacturer selects it? I did notice a lower "Burst pressure" on the larger NAPA Gold filter...

 

[Sayjac]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
I'm running the PureONE 14459 which is the larger diameter of the 14610, which is same as NAPA Gold 1356 (see my photos above). So if you cross the Purolator 14459 to the equivalent NAPA Gold you should have it.

Looks like a 1334 (NAPA Gold) or 51334 (WIX) = Purolator 14459.

http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/results.asp?PartNo=14459&Submit=Search

http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/PartDetail.asp?Part=51334

The Beta Ratio on the WIX 51334 isn't great IMO. 95% efficient at 40 microns.
Beta Ratio: 2/20=22/40

Purolator Classic in this size is 97.5% @ 20 microns. PureONE in this size is 99.9% @ 20 microns.

What's interesting is the Wix equivalent of the 14610, the 51356, the beta ratio is 2/20=6/19 or 95% @ 19mu. Which means in the Wix, the smaller of the two applications (51356) has a higher rated efficiency than the larger application (51334). That is the opposite of the Purolator scenario. It also means the smaller L14610 Classic is rated more efficient then the larger Wix app, but not the smaller Wix (51356), strange.

http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/results.asp?PartNo=14610&Submit=Search

http://www.wixfilters.com/filterlookup/PartDetail.asp?Part=51356

 

[Asterix]

A while ago I made a list of all filters with M20x1.5 thread and the small base looking for a larger one for my '04 350Z with the VQ35DE engine.

The L14610 I cut open had 102.7 sq.in. of media, meaning the can was stuffed quite full. The Wix 51344 has 167.1 sq.in. of media, and the can is not quite as full. It's a good second choice to me at about twice the price.

The largest I found was the Wix 51318 with 313.6 sq.in. of media. Now, the 51318 is big (3.7"ODx4.8"L), but expensive at like $14 each. It does fit my 350Z, but just. If you can't stand any start-up rattle from the timing chain, don't use this filter. I don't think it's bad but some people may.

You can see photos here: http://members.cox.net/bwhaley/OilFilter.htm The rubber band around the L14610 media is because I had already cut it out to measure it before I took the photo.

For comparison, the widely-used Purolator L30001 has 316 sq.in. of media, and the Wix 51515 has 349 sq.in. of media. Too bad the thread is wrong...

Asterix

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: Asterix
A while ago I made a list of all filters with M20x1.5 thread and the small base looking for a larger one for my '04 350Z with the VQ35DE engine.

The L14610 I cut open had 102.7 sq.in. of media, meaning the can was stuffed quite full. The Wix 51344 has 167.1 sq.in. of media, and the can is not quite as full.


The Purolator 14459 is about the same can size as the WIX 51334, but the 51334 is 0.2" longer. The WIX uses the base end bypass valve and big coil spring on the dome end, which eats up some media length, so I'm thinking the media area is probably close between these two filters. The advertised Beta Ratio (2/20=22/40) of the 51334 (and 51344) isn't as good as the PureONE. The WIX 51356 shows a better Beta Ratio than both the 51334 & 51344.

Next time I change oil I'll cut open the 14459 and see how the meida area measures out. Maybe someone already knows the media area of the 14459? ... is so, please post it.

 

[chevys10]

Good info. My wife drives a 2000 Mazda 626 that uses the PL14610. I alternate between that and the Mobil 1 M1-110. Was going to purchase a few Napa Golds before the 40% off sale ends but I think I will get some PL14459's when they have another rebate....

Thanks!!

 

[JGmazda]

I think the bottom line is this: A better filter. I'm wondering now if I should buy a few of the NAPA Golds as they are on sale.

Either way... The P1 or NAPA is going to be a great choice. It's too bad each manufacturer couldn't maximize their lineup better by by doing some better research into what fits different makes.

Then again.... that's what this site is known for!

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: JGmazda

I wonder why the PL14610 isn't just equated to the better filter-
(The 14459)? Aside from clearance issues...???


I was going to comment on this, but I guess I really don't quite get what you are asking.

 

[JGmazda]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: JGmazda

I wonder why the PL14610 isn't just equated to the better filter-
(The 14459)? Aside from clearance issues...???


I was going to comment on this, but I guess I really don't quite get what you are asking.


I guess what I'm saying is this; When I look up the filter for my car at the parts store, why not have the 14459 show vs. the 14610? I don't understand why Purolator assigns that filter?

 

[Sayjac]

Originally Posted By: JGmazda
I guess what I'm saying is this; When I look up the filter for my car at the parts store, why not have the 14459 show vs. the 14610? I don't understand why Purolator assigns that filter?


Well, the aftermarkets like Purolator and others generally try and follow what the OEM specs. Example, the 2001 Honda Civic started specing the 14610 size. Now, early on when using the 14610 size was new and I was buying Honda filter(s), the parts counter was still using/selling the larger 14459 size which was used on some 90's model Hondas like the Accord. Eventually they started selling the smaller 14610 which the 01 Civic was spec'd for.

Again, the aftermarket just try to keep the recommended filter within the OEM spec size.

 

[Gary Allan]

Well, a x'ref isn't going to not conform to the OEM spec. It's just not done. Some quicklube outfit with some renegade el cheapo filter supplier would probably go the other way to assure more fitment with fewer numbers.

Purolator assigns that filter because that's what your engine calls for.

The only time I've seen that be any different is if there was some superseding of an older filter with a newer one to allow more units to share the same assembly line part, while keeping the older filter in production aftermarket.

 

[ThirdeYe]

I don't understand the 14610 vs. 14459 recommendation. They're interchangeable filters, it seems like they'd want to just produce one to save costs. My car recommends the 14459 but I've used the 14610 size a number of times without issue. It's actually closer to what the OEM specs for this car... I'm sure they have their reasons...

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: ThirdeYe
I don't understand the 14610 vs. 14459 recommendation. They're interchangeable filters, it seems like they'd want to just produce one to save costs. My car recommends the 14459 but I've used the 14610 size a number of times without issue. It's actually closer to what the OEM specs for this car... I'm sure they have their reasons...


There might be some cars out there that don't have enough room around the mounting base for the 14459, but do for the 14610. My V6 Altima has the oil cooler base that is pretty wide, and the 14459 fits well even though it's closer to the main crank pulley.

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
They're interchangeable filters


Not by my reasoning. That is, unless a PH3614 and a PH8A are also considered interchangeable. The length is different and the diameter is different. The only thing those two filters share (in Wix, anyway) is the thread and the gasket size. Why would any x'ref spec both or either (whatever)??

Part Number: 51356
UPC Number: 765809513563
Principal Application: Acura (02-10), Chrysler Imports (92-06), Ford Probe (93-97), Honda (01-10), Infiniti/Nissan (96-10), Mazda (71-00), Mercury Villager (99-00), Mitsubishi (90-10), Saturn (04-07), Outboard Marine Engines, Various HD Equip.
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 3.402
Outer Diameter Top: 2.685
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 20X1.5 MM
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=6/19
Burst Pressure-PSI: 363
Max Flow Rate: 9-11 GPM
Nominal Micron Rating: 21

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.475 2.173 0.233

Part Number: 51334
UPC Number: 765809513341
Principal Application: Acura (88-05), Chevrolet (85-88), Dodge (91-96), Ford (88-96), Honda (72-09), Hyundai (89-10), Isuzu (85-04), Kia (01-10), Mercury (87-91), Mitsubishi (89-98), Subaru (87-10) Atlas-Copco, Case, John Deere, Kobelco, Komatsu, Kubota, Onan, Toro & Yanmar Diesel, Other
All Applications
Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
Service: Lube
Type: Full Flow
Media: Paper
Height: 3.194
Outer Diameter Top: 3.252
Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
Thread Size: 20X1.5 MM
By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 8-11
Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes
Beta Ratio: 2/20=22/40
Burst Pressure-PSI: 280
Max Flow Rate: 9-11 GPM
Nominal Micron Rating: 19

Gasket Diameters
Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
Attached 2.475 2.173 0.233

 

[JGmazda]

Good answers guys. Thanks for the explanations. I'm now running the PL14610 for about 9k.... just changed the oil again but not the filter. First time I've done that. I've used the NAPA Golds and Mobil 1 filters too. I must say the Mobil 1 & NAPA filters seem to be thicker in the canister area. Gaskets also.

The P1 is doing well though. I can't think of any good reasons to choose one over the others at this point. They all seem to be excellent.

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: ThirdeYe
I don't understand the 14610 vs. 14459 recommendation. They're interchangeable filters, it seems like they'd want to just produce one to save costs.


They are interchangeable filters due to the research of the "filter freaks" on BITOG, but not to the filter manufactures.

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: ThirdeYe
I don't understand the 14610 vs. 14459 recommendation. They're interchangeable filters, it seems like they'd want to just produce one to save costs.


They are interchangeable filters due to the research of the "filter freaks" on BITOG, but not to the filter manufactures.

Has anyone successfully ran P1 14459 in place of the 14610 on the 2.4 Accord engine?

 

[barlowc]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Ive never taken the side cover off on my 2.5L for my DIY filter change, but I'm fairly certain it doesn't have that design.

I think the 4 cylinder also has one.

No, 4-cylinder Altima's QR25DE engine doesn't have the same design. The pictures below show: 1) A Mobil 1 M1-108 which has the same diameter as the PL14610, only shorter. 2) No filter installed. 3) A DENSO 150-1010 which has an OD a few millimeters wider and is essentially the perfect fit. From the pictures you can see that the PL14459 probably won't fit.

 

[Sayjac]

From this thread. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1976351#Post1976351
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Originally Posted By: barlowc
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Checkout this thread ... some Altima stuff.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1832936

Good thread. Thanks for pointing us to it.

From the pictures, I'm guessing the PL14459 won't fit the 4-cylinder Altima's QR25DE engine. I'd love to hear someone tell me otherwise though.
No, not enough clearance (diameter wise) to fit on the 2.5L. It does however, fit many earlier Honda Accords and Civics that use/call for the #7317. Doesn't fit the latest gen. Accords.

fwiw, I now have the Nissan shorty spec'd filter because I got a complimentary Nissan oil change, otherwise I always use the longer 14610/7317 size.

Yeah, no oil cooler on the 2.5L and not enough space for 14459. Thanks for the pics.