New Kia Optima

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Originally Posted By: CKN
Good post. Puts the "resale" myth to rest. BTW-your right...Subaru is selling all the vehicles they make these days-not much reason for the dealers to do you any favors.



Thanks! Sometime I get something right... just like a broken clock.

Resale for the general consumer is more of a customer satisfaction thing. It is there to give you the warm-fuzzies most of the time (but it can be real in some situations... like with big SUVs and a fuel spike)

However, in the fleet world, "resale" is not a myth.... but it is different. Then again, I am not targeting vehicles with the "best" resale, just those with good, low purchase price and consistent resale. When you are doing 25 vehicles etc, that $500-$1000 per vehicle can be significant. Knowing when to buy and unload vehicles is a part of the business plan. For example, I could buy and sell a general sedan every 3-5 years at about 80K and make the most back compared to my cost per mile. It depends on how "hot" the used market happens to be. Compare that to a minivan that I have to keep 12 years and 120K miles (or more) to make up the cost (higher buy-in cost and I tend to get less miles on those vehicles). However, this is not a consumer world. An "new" leftover 2013 (older model) Impala in government spec back in the day would cost me 2/3 or less of the MSRP. I could have gotten a mid-trim Fusion for about $18K ... or something ridiculously cheap. So then I would want to find where the recoup at 50% target would be so I could roll value forward during the next replacement. I am basically helping stock your local Carmax with bland-mobiles.
 
I have a 2011 Kia Optima with the 2.4 l engine. It has about 110,000 km on it and continues to be trouble free. I would definitely buy another after this one.
 
Originally Posted By: FutureDoc
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Don't buy anything Korean with direct fuel injection.


Like the Buick Encore right?

I love to say it, but it seems to me that GM and the Korean makes were the ones who got direct injection "correct" and do not have the issues that plague other makes (cough VW, cough BMW). Ford is close behind but their DI and "Ecoboost" turbo might be causing other issues when combined... Anyway, worrying about a Korean GDi engine is like freaking out of the Y2K bug. It is a non issue and GDi is, for the most part, a non-issue for post 2010 cars.

Granted, I have only had my Hyundai GDi vehicle for a bit over a year and other than the "tick" of the injectors when you are outside the vehicle, nothing else is is anything that even approaches a concern. It is a darn good car so far...

Hyundai/Kia did recall a lot of 2011/2012 vehicles due to debris in the manufacturing process that affected the GDi process (and thus the internet thinks it is GDi in the GDi engines). Still, it is not a rare recall, was still mostly under warranty, and is a a GDi issue.



Well said. That recall was for ~2% of all engines made during that time frame (includes mine). They are replacing the long block for free and warranty it to 10yr/120K for ALL owners (original, 2nd, etc.).

I'm at 60K, tuned and love my car! My only real concern is large fuel dilution (via Polaris UOA, not Blackstone) but I keep my OCI to 4K miles and use full synthetic oil (M1 0W-40 till now, switching to Castrol Edge 0W-40) along with a very good OCC. I've seen NO issues as a result (wear levels are fine).

I normally run my cars to 250K+ miles with very good maintenance and don't horse trade cars.
 
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Don't buy anything Korean with direct fuel injection.
I have heard of zero issues with Hyundai GDI. Not that I've been looking for them but it seems like a non-problem. I'll be doing a UOA for my car this weekend.


You aren't paying attention...
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/feds-investigate-hyundai-kia-for-1-7m-vehicle-engine-recall/

Edit: I have a 2012 Sonata, not listed in my sig. Engine is fine so far with 49K.

Edit 2: There are like 20 2011-2014 Sonatas at the local dealer back lot sitting waiting for an engine. There is a shortage of engines. People on the Hyundai forums are saying it's taking 2-3 months to get their cars back.

Edit 3: The initial recall was stated to be for manufacturing debris that was not fully removed at the new Alabama engine plant. Regardless, the symptom is spinning and grenading connecting rod bearings and sudden engine seizures.

http://autoweek.com/article/recalls/hyundai-and-kia-recall-15-million-engines
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Brons2
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Don't buy anything Korean with direct fuel injection.
I have heard of zero issues with Hyundai GDI. Not that I've been looking for them but it seems like a non-problem. I'll be doing a UOA for my car this weekend.


You aren't paying attention...
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/feds-investigate-hyundai-kia-for-1-7m-vehicle-engine-recall/

Edit: I have a 2012 Sonata, not listed in my sig. Engine is fine so far with 49K.

Edit 2: There are like 20 2011-2014 Sonatas at the local dealer back lot sitting waiting for an engine. There is a shortage of engines. People on the Hyundai forums are saying it's taking 2-3 months to get their cars back.

Edit 3: The initial recall was stated to be for manufacturing debris that was not fully removed at the new Alabama engine plant. Regardless, the symptom is spinning and grenading connecting rod bearings and sudden engine seizures.

http://autoweek.com/article/recalls/hyundai-and-kia-recall-15-million-engines

Sorry, I'm not talking about the engines themselves. I'm talking about the GDI portion of these engines. I was under the assumption you were totally against the GDI portion of these engines. Fortunately 2015 and newer are not affected by this issue.
 
Originally Posted By: Brons2
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Don't buy anything Korean with direct fuel injection.
I have heard of zero issues with Hyundai GDI. Not that I've been looking for them but it seems like a non-problem. I'll be doing a UOA for my car this weekend.


You aren't paying attention...
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/feds-investigate-hyundai-kia-for-1-7m-vehicle-engine-recall/

Edit: I have a 2012 Sonata, not listed in my sig. Engine is fine so far with 49K.

Edit 2: There are like 20 2011-2014 Sonatas at the local dealer back lot sitting waiting for an engine. There is a shortage of engines. People on the Hyundai forums are saying it's taking 2-3 months to get their cars back.

Edit 3: The initial recall was stated to be for manufacturing debris that was not fully removed at the new Alabama engine plant. Regardless, the symptom is spinning and grenading connecting rod bearings and sudden engine seizures.

http://autoweek.com/article/recalls/hyundai-and-kia-recall-15-million-engines



Well said. The risk is greater than than Hyundai/Kia wants you to believe. Much greater than 2%. I'm running 10w 40 syn in my 2013 optima to maximize the journal bearing life in a design that now appears questionable. That's without the the manufacturing debris. I'm going to run it till it dies. I'm at 64K now. I'm also battling 3.5% fuel dilution thanks to GDI. GDI

GDI is years away from being perfected.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Nick1994
Originally Posted By: Linctex
Don't buy anything Korean with direct fuel injection.
I have heard of zero issues with Hyundai GDI. Not that I've been looking for them but it seems like a non-problem. I'll be doing a UOA for my car this weekend.


Injectors fall apart inside the cilinder....
 
Originally Posted By: asb151

Well said. The risk is greater than than Hyundai/Kia wants you to believe. Much greater than 2%. I'm running 10w 40 syn in my 2013 optima to maximize the journal bearing life in a design that now appears questionable. That's without the the manufacturing debris. I'm going to run it till it dies. I'm at 64K now. I'm also battling 3.5% fuel dilution thanks to GDI. GDI

GDI is years away from being perfected.


I was going to go with a thicker 5w30, something around 12cst give or take, and set a condemnation limit of going out of grade. 10w40 seems pretty extreme, but I guess with 3.5% dilution it will probably shear back to mid-30s. I'm curious to see my dilution, I do a lot of freeway driving.

I was actually going to get a brand new Sonata with the rebares, but then found this manual equipped car and could not resist. It was well below KBB private party values. I knew about the recall but decided to take a chance anyway, have 70,000 more miles of free extended engine warranty!
 
Originally Posted By: Fordai
One of my local dealers has new optimas listed at 20k with "$5,000 for your trade in any condition" bringing the price down to 15k which is the same price for a slightly used one at carmax. I'm worried the dealer might be running a scam / false advertising though.


Advertising is deceptive. When I bought 2017 Elantra SE I had $15 to spend. I contacted 3 dealerships with advertised price below $15K. Problem was two of them crunched the numbers and lowest they could do was $700 over my budget. One salesman said I could not buy an Elantra for $15k, but I did. Other members of Hyundai-Forums got theirs below $14k. So I would not trust the advertising for the Kia.

For me, playing 3 dealerships against each other by email mostly got the best deal. You may want to broaden your search to Hyundai models or other Kia dealerships. BTW, the 2017 Elantra has come long way since buying your Elantra. I was getting 52 mpg on the freeway the other day before I went back to my city driving. Normally average 32 mpg.

Here is a sample of one strategy someone used to get a good price on a Sonata:

Save at least $7750 on Sonata

Hyundai had a lot of the same discounts when I bought my Elantra. I bought the last day of the month and my dealership had Hyundai cash that allowed me to stay within my budget. I did not trade in a car or get any extended warranties.
 
Originally Posted By: MONKEYMAN
Here is a sample of one strategy someone used to get a good price on a Sonata:

Save at least $7750 on Sonata


Ok so $19,500 out the door after tax. Seems kind of up there in price when someone on here recently bought a used 2015 Sonata with 50k miles, former rental but looks great for $10,000.
 
Originally Posted By: SatinSilver
Originally Posted By: MONKEYMAN
Here is a sample of one strategy someone used to get a good price on a Sonata:

Save at least $7750 on Sonata


Ok so $19,500 out the door after tax. Seems kind of up there in price when someone on here recently bought a used 2015 Sonata with 50k miles, former rental but looks great for $10,000.
Well, to be fair it's a bit of a unicorn at that price. Searching Autotrader again shows only a few in the country at the price I paid for my Sonata, and who knows if those dealers charge ungodly fees (I didn't pay crazy fees).
 
I was trying to show some of the discounts or strategies for buying. Not everyone wants the more expensive model with extra features. It looked like the OP was looking for a certain price like me. That determined what I bought. The advantage of new is the warranty.
 
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