Need a Gun Recommendation



It's good stuff. All the arts are good but I think in the streets Krav Maga is pretty effective. I kick boxed but wasn't great at it but I did burn calories and made friends

I hate to break it to you but most of those on that video, are demonstrations of an artform, not real fighting. It's hollywood fictional fighting. I've never in my life seen anyone in a real fight, do half of these fantasy moves. You need a compliant opponent doing exactly what you want, for a demonstration. Someone that fights back at full speed will defeat most of this stuff. Notice that during these demonstrations, the subject never fights back.

Go watch MMA for a few hours. You'll see almost none of these fancy nonsense moves.
 
with all due respect, attaining sufficient proficiency to be useful in actual self-defense in any martial art requires considerable and dedicated practice, as well as a certain mindset. i was in my college’s boxing and rugby clubs. i toe-to-toe knocked guys down silly on the canvas and down hard on the pitch, was knocked down many times myself, and was carried off with a broken sideways nose, and ankles & knees that needed weeks on crutches to heal. at least boxing and rugby have rules. as leadcounsel said, mma is the real deal. i’m never doing any of that now.

i learned about firearms on a 22lr bolt action rifle in my preteens in a nra club and later on the m14 & m16 in the army. when push came to shove and i really needed protection for my young family i chose firearms. why? 1. it was an easy transition to handguns courtesy of training by the nra (most especially) and the army. 2. samuel colt’s dictum (“god made man, colt made men equal”).

man or woman, young or old, if you are new to firearms please start with 500 practiced rounds of rimfire and some instruction. if you decide on a 22lr pistol for protection because you like it, even if nobody else does, guess what? don’t let the “cool kids” sway you, you are far better protected than 80% of america. act smart, be aware, carry it always and carry it with confidence.
 
Last edited:
and there “ought to be a law” that every 380acp and 38sp handgun be offered in some 32 caliber variant, with ammo availability and price to match.
 
.......... The odds of a woman being able to defend herself by pulling a firearm out of her pocket book and defending herself is effectively zero........... Sending a woman out with a firearm in a pocketbook is a recipe for disaster in many times with a few exceptions.
But you're OK with them carrying pepper spray?
 
Asking carry gun advice on an internet forum for yourself, or even worse, for someone else, is always a bad idea.
 
Asking carry gun advice on an internet forum for yourself, or even worse, for someone else, is always a bad idea.
Puzzled. Why do you believe this, and also why bother being a member of any forum if you think so poorly of asking advice on forums?

Turns out, forums have subject matter experts on various topics. This forum has well informed members who are chemists, pilots, engineers, mechanics, military backgrounds, and firearm experts. And, while it is true there are some nonsensical opinions, generally the better more well informed opinions are evident and the nonsensical ones also evident. It seems a pretty good place for a mostly science/reality related audience to get a opinion on topics of this nature (it even has a firearms sub-forum, go figure).

So what is the alterative? Paying thru the nose for a "expert opinion?" No. This nut has been cracked by thousands of global military and police agencies in rigorous testing. Pick something the pros have tested and chosen. Find something with a good track record of testing, approvals, and decades long service. Not a long list, really. A handful of makers - Sig, HK, CZ, Beretta, Glock, FN, Walther, SW, Springfield, Ruger... Then narrow it down to ideal design features (safety vs. hammer, size and caliber, capacity, cost...). It's a relatively easy and fun process of elimination.

Where do you think getting carry gun advice is best from, some minimum wage employee at a gun store pushing the gun he has the highest margins on? No. I have heard some of the worst advice or opinions in gun shops (example: "you don't need to aim a shotgun" or similar nonsense).
 
I was thinking on this and another option, I'd completely forgotten about that might fit the OPs spouse well, that surprised me is the Beretta PX4 (and Stoeger Cougar). An ugly duckling I overlooked for a really long time but astonished me in truth.

The Stoeger is metal framed, can be found without a rail. The Beretta is a updated polymer framed. Same essential firearm, I think Beretta licensed it or has close ties to Stoeger, etc. Not exactly sure on that relationship. But these are basically the same gun made by the same parent company, with slightly different materials. I own both.

A very good 65 year old friend of mine who is a firearms expert showed up at the range with me. I never knew what his chosen carry gun is. It just never came up. He is a guy with 100,000s of thousands of rounds of experience, extremely competent and intelligent, a man of wealth, and can buy/carry any handgun he wants. He's had the gamut, Sigs, Hks, Berettas, Glocks, etc. He produced a Beretta PX4. He told me it's his top choice, favorite, and he carries it everywhere. Until then I'd never handled or fired one. It has a innovative rotating barrel system that reduces recoil, and aids in accuracy. I shot it, and I was very impressed. The PX4 impressed me more than any handgun I'd fired for the first time, in at least a decade. I went out and bought several and a Cougar. It does have a drawback, in that the safety needs to be swapped out, because the factory one is terrible. The wings stick out too far, and it the decocker locks down to safe. I generally hate slide mounted decocker/safety feature, I just do not like them. A inexpensive factory replacement is available to make it more flush, and returns to fire. And a PX4 compact is about the same dimensions of a Sig P229, so a bit thick. But other than that, the PX4 is totally overlooked as an incredible pistol. In my view, after doing the safety conversion (Beretta, fix this), it's a 5 star pistol.

I'd strongly recommend a PX4 compact for a carry gun or PX4 for home defense. It totally slipped my mind. Definitely an ugly duckling, but a stellar performer, with low recoil due to the rotating barrel design.

Stoeger
Stoeger-cougar-40-Smith-and-Wesson_100844937_597_325D6118C902788E.JPG


Beretta
wm_7625227.jpg

Edited to add some pictures.
 
Last edited:
Puzzled. Why do you believe this, and also why bother being a member of any forum if you think so poorly of asking advice on forums?

Turns out, forums have subject matter experts on various topics. This forum has well informed members who are chemists, pilots, engineers, mechanics, military backgrounds, and firearm experts. And, while it is true there are some nonsensical opinions, generally the better more well informed opinions are evident and the nonsensical ones also evident. It seems a pretty good place for a mostly science/reality related audience to get a opinion on topics of this nature (it even has a firearms sub-forum, go figure).

So what is the alterative? Paying thru the nose for a "expert opinion?" No. This nut has been cracked by thousands of global military and police agencies in rigorous testing. Pick something the pros have tested and chosen. Find something with a good track record of testing, approvals, and decades long service. Not a long list, really. A handful of makers - Sig, HK, CZ, Beretta, Glock, FN, Walther, SW, Springfield, Ruger... Then narrow it down to ideal design features (safety vs. hammer, size and caliber, capacity, cost...). It's a relatively easy and fun process of elimination.

Where do you think getting carry gun advice is best from, some minimum wage employee at a gun store pushing the gun he has the highest margins on? No. I have heard some of the worst advice or opinions in gun shops (example: "you don't need to aim a shotgun" or similar nonsense).
Puzzled.
You make many assumptions, most of which are just that mixed with your opinions. You also ask questions from my post and proceed to immediately answer them yourself. Why bother asking? Clearly you already know the answer...just not the one I would provide.
Perhaps seeking advice from people one knows that actually do what you are inquiring about...professionally. A seasoned law enforcement officer that actually carries a sidearm for a living, in this case, perhaps a female. An instructor at a well established gun club.

Or if utilizing the internet, perhaps a dedicated firearms forum, of which there are many to pick from could be a better choice to start.

Do you think it prudent to seek information about private aircraft avionics on a knitting forum? How about advanced woodworking specifics on a cheese making forum?

The sidearms you posted are likely good ones but are almost duty sized so concealment becomes an issue.
 
A seasoned law enforcement officer that actually carries a sidearm for a living, in this case, perhaps a female.

IME that's not a very good idea, for one they need not conceal, for two a good portion of them are clueless about anything except the one they are issued.

You were right the first time really.

SHE needs to find what works for her.

Wonder how many answering this question are women...
 
Puzzled.
You make many assumptions, most of which are just that mixed with your opinions. You also ask questions from my post and proceed to immediately answer them yourself. Why bother asking? Clearly you already know the answer...just not the one I would provide.
Perhaps seeking advice from people one knows that actually do what you are inquiring about...professionally. A seasoned law enforcement officer that actually carries a sidearm for a living, in this case, perhaps a female. An instructor at a well established gun club.

Or if utilizing the internet, perhaps a dedicated firearms forum, of which there are many to pick from could be a better choice to start.

Do you think it prudent to seek information about private aircraft avionics on a knitting forum? How about advanced woodworking specifics on a cheese making forum?

The sidearms you posted are likely good ones but are almost duty sized so concealment becomes an issue.
I understand your point; asking a firearms question on what is fundamentally an oil forum.

But I will say, that the group we have here, has specific expertise in a variety of areas, that reach far beyond topics on just oil.

We have doctors, lawyers, computer, programmers, software people, financial people, folks who work on cars, manage watersheds, and a host of other areas of expertise. There are even a few pilots, or so I’ve heard.

So, there are people with specific expertise, able to answer this question. The challenge with the responses in this thread, and those challenges exist across all internet fora, is separating the good answers from the specious, or worse, knee-jerk, responses.

It is often hard to know, if the poster truly knows what they’re talking about. Many of the answers in the mechanical forum, or in selecting an oil, are in fact, not very good.

It takes a bit of critical thinking, and a bit of familiarity with the topic to be able to discern which posts are helpful, and which are not.

So, to circle back to the original poster’s question, I think there are some good suggestions here.
 
IME that's not a very good idea, for one they need not conceal, for two a good portion of them are clueless about anything except the one they are issued.

You were right the first time really.

SHE needs to find what works for her.

Wonder how many answering this question are women...
Every police department that has any type of valid accreditation requires it's sworn personnel to carry off duty. That would cover some of your point about concealment, but admittedly not all.
Most departments provide a range of off duty calibers that are permissible(i.e. minimum 9mm max. 40)and are very specific about ammunition as well. Duty ammunition is always issued.
I'd bet a pension check or three that none of those replying are women.
 
I 100% disagree with this advice and if I were in your class, I would leave.

Watch real world shootings around the globe, usually caught on CCTV surveillance. People, routinely, draw concealed firearms and fend off attackers. I don't want to violate the terms on this site but one famous one is on Youtube ASP channel. Go find this video which 100% proves the opposite of the methods you teach your students. This woman probably saved a life or lives of a bunch of children and women outside a school. Go to Youtube, find this video.

Mama Bear Makes Robber Take Room Temperature Challenge | Active Self ProtectionWell don't take any devensive firearm classes. I have had PP Inside the home.​

I have taken NRA: CCW, Defensive Pistol, PP Inside the Home, Outside the Home..each twice. Thats what I have learned. There are exceptions but I teach only the Inside the home, ...the others I have participated and watched how other students, less trained than I. When I leave the class, that's what they are capable of. Your experiences may differ. Again that's also what I see in my Law enforcement Academy Training. Again..I present MY experience. Again yours may differ.
 
Puzzled.
You make many assumptions, most of which are just that mixed with your opinions. You also ask questions from my post and proceed to immediately answer them yourself. Why bother asking? Clearly you already know the answer...just not the one I would provide.
100% agree with you on your points. But as you and I see we are arguing against the faceless "INTERNETS". As such I am done with this thread. :giggle:
 
Perhaps seeking advice from people one knows that actually do what you are inquiring about...professionally. A seasoned law enforcement officer that actually carries a sidearm for a living, in this case, perhaps a female. An instructor at a well established gun club.

Or if utilizing the internet, perhaps a dedicated firearms forum, of which there are many to pick from could be a better choice to start.
I agree with seeking advice from those who know what they are talking about, generally enthusiasts who want to know as much as possible and immerse oneself in the topic. Your idea of a internet gun forum is a strong suggestion, and maybe the OP has this question on gun forums. Advice on the internet, like in life, is just gathering data points.

I would rely on gun enthusiasts, over the random cop or Soldier who might not be a gun enthusiast. I would say most are not enthusiasts. When I was in the military, I was shocked at how few "gun enthusiasts" were and even met a surprisingly high number of people who were anti-2nd Amendment! Sad, but true. As for experts, their process is much like I've suggested. Go to the top 5 or 10 makers, review what they have in striker/hammer, size, caliber, and narrow it down and start with those options. This is not a novel problem. I've taught, on my own time/money, many people how to shoot guns, including women, to try to get more people involved in the hobby lifestyle. I have a very good sense of what women gravitate towards, given hand strength and size, recoil, being comfortable, etc. It's generally compact sized hammer fired guns with excellent ergonomics. The CZ75 variants (I'll include affordable clones here, like the SAR B6P), and Sig P229 (including variations like the P6 or P225) are very popular, for many many reasons. We're not solving cancer, we're picking from a fairly small selection of practical realistic options when you boil it down. There's not millions, there's maybe a few dozen realistic suggestions within a realistic criteria of probably a compact hammer fired .380 or 9mm roughly the size of the CZ75 compact.

Asking a female cop, is problematic. First, you'll have to find one. Going up to a stranger and asking, is weird, time consuming, and a data point of 1. Next, she likely does not have a choice and is probably issued a Glock, statistically. Next, she'll probably just rely on either what she was issued as a backup, or a similar smaller gun of the same design for training simplicity. Next, if she has an option it's unlikely she'll do more than ask male gun enthusiasts, or just go with the actual gun or a smaller version of her duty gun for training overlap. I dated a female cop detective, and she carried what she was issued, a Glock. She didn't know much about any other guns b/c she was a busy mom when not playing detective.

IME that's not a very good idea, for one they need not conceal, for two a good portion of them are clueless about anything except the one they are issued.
This has been my experience with most cops.
SHE needs to find what works for her.

Wonder how many answering this question are women...
Ultimately yes. But considering men designed and built probably every gun in existence, and men dominate this arena of hobby and professional use, it seems logical to get opinions from men. I've been a member of many gun forums, engaged in gun conversations thousands of times, etc. Only a few women engage in this topic. It's just not something women get enthusiastic about in general. Men are almost universally going to aid in narrowing down the choices to a handful for a woman to pick from, so as to not have an overwhelming decision. This is my overall life experience.

The worst way to go about it is for a woman novice to go pick out something b/c she'll almost always come back with a cute little mouse gun that will be a miserable experience. She'll develop a flinch from the recoil, then put it in a drawer and forget about it. I've seen that happen and had to break people of the flinching they developed from some gun store clerk advice on a mouse gun.
 
I have taken NRA: CCW, Defensive Pistol, PP Inside the Home, Outside the Home..each twice. Thats what I have learned. There are exceptions but I teach only the Inside the home, ...the others I have participated and watched how other students, less trained than I. When I leave the class, that's what they are capable of. Your experiences may differ. Again that's also what I see in my Law enforcement Academy Training. Again..I present MY experience. Again yours may differ.
Those might be fine and I'm not here to argue to demean. But if I understand your point, these discourage carrying in public? I must be misunderstanding. If that's the case, then I just fundamentally disagree. It's estimated that hundreds of thousands of assaults in the US are thwarted by armed citizens, annually.

I would suggest to supplement your training with watching real world assault videos as they unfold, generally from CCTV footage. A surprisingly high percentage of attacks are stopped by people carrying firearms in public.
 
I have taken NRA: CCW, Defensive Pistol, PP Inside the Home, Outside the Home..each twice. Thats what I have learned. There are exceptions but I teach only the Inside the home, ...the others I have participated and watched how other students, less trained than I. When I leave the class, that's what they are capable of. Your experiences may differ. Again that's also what I see in my Law enforcement Academy Training. Again..I present MY experience. Again yours may differ.
Al - c’mon, man, you’re an instructor. You teach this stuff.

What advice would you give a new student who is struggling with recoil? What kind of firearm would you recommend?

“I’m out” - is that how you would handle a question from a new shooter in your class ?
 
I will also add, that sometimes women don't like advice from men. For that woman, there's a site where women give advice to women, called https://www.corneredcat.com/contents/

There, it's basically elementary school starting point on terms, discussions, etc. Key topics are covered, at a very elementary level, from a female to a female novice audience, and an audience fearful of guns or otherwise not inclined to want to get one or carry, but feel compelled for various reasons. It might help to disarm a woman reluctant to take advice from men.

Here's a good read, and things to consider. I'll yield this author pushes back on thinking all women are alike, and she's entitled to her opinion. But she offers some alternate viewpoints to consider.

One that stands out is size and hand size. I have never seen a woman unable to operate a compact gun, but for a really small woman (OP says wife is 5' tall) perhaps even a smaller gun would be a good option. In that case, I could make a few 9x18mm (Makarov) or proven hammer fired metal framed .380 suggestions. None of these are in my top defensive choices but I would feel confident and not undergunned in typical public carry, so if you're a smaller person with smaller/weaker hands, I would confidently make these suggestions in order of preference.

1. A CZ82 (9x18) or CZ83 (.380acp) or 2. Makarov. Proven designs. I prefer the CZs due to the exceptional trigger and safety and ergonomics. The performance of the Makarov is roughly equivalent to a .380.
cz82_cz83_ammo_DSC4384web.jpg


Makarov was a workhorse for decades in the Communist nations and is still a favorite of many shooters today.
3f99e0b7e569640c9ddd3ac45f0624f0.jpg


3. Beretta Cheetah, model 84 or 85. This comes in a few calibers but the best for defense IMO is the .380. I particularly like the Cheetah for its frame mounted safety.
Beretta-84-2.jpg



I would next suggest, budget depending, the Walther PPK or a very similar Bersa Thunder both in .380. The Walther is about twice as expensive. Both have loyal cultlike following and are very proven. It's a tie and comes down to budget and preference.

Walther PPK, made famous in Hollywood especially James Bond, has a cult following.
1077-04.jpg

Bersa Thunder .380.
Z62.jpg
 
I posted Cornered Cat earlier.

I know 2 women with thunders neither of them shoots it much - that's a straight blowback, the slide is stiff and the recoil is significant... Id rather shoot a 45 or 9mm defender all day than a Thunder. I'd even rather shoot a Pocketlite all day than a Thunder.

Suspect the Walter is similar, the one thing the Walther has going for it is that you can get one in 22LR, assuming you could afford 2 you could conceivably do most of your practice with the 22 and use the 380 for defense.

I agree with eh 84/85 I also mentioned that earlier, I think they also came in 22... I had one and my Girlfriend at the time had no issues with it.

Still think 6 pages of men recommending women's guns is borderline hilarious.
 
Back
Top