wemay
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Hemi Engine Autopsy: 235,000-Mile 5.7L Out of a 2011 Challenger
Can a high-mileage Hemi with a history of problems be salvaged?
MOTORTREND: Hemi Engine Autopsy: 235,000-Mile 5.7L Out of a 2011 Challenger
- Thread starter wemay
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My thoughts exactly.
So the ultimate demise of the engine was caused by the ****ty job the dealership did repairing the timing chain - they did not clean the cylinder head correctly and they bent the dowel pin in the VCT assembly. SHOCKING! Reason #12384 why I avoid dealerships.
"We didn't have to look far to find a culprit of the gasket failure; a quick clean-up of the cylinder head's fire deck revealed that instead of having the cylinder heads sent out to a machine shop for resurfacing, the dealership that did the original timing chain warranty work in 2014 took a shortcut and used a Scotchbrite pad on a high-speed grinder to clean the gasket surface—a big no-no! Johnny's finger points to a series of telltale witness marks from the errant operation. (At this point we had to ask ourselves if the gaskets were reused, as well.) We are a little surprised it lasted 169,000 miles, though all those miles were fraught with other issues on a continual basis."
"As IMM dug deeper into the 5.7L Hemi and removed the timing chain and variable camshaft timing (VCT) hub assembly, it was discovered that the dowel pin that locates the timing chain and VCT assembly was severely bent. This would've affected the valve timing events by slightly retarding everything, but probably not enough to notice. What's interesting is that it never failed in the 169,000 miles since the timing chain was repaired at the dealership service department. We can't say for sure this is installation error, but the odds are in favor."
"We didn't have to look far to find a culprit of the gasket failure; a quick clean-up of the cylinder head's fire deck revealed that instead of having the cylinder heads sent out to a machine shop for resurfacing, the dealership that did the original timing chain warranty work in 2014 took a shortcut and used a Scotchbrite pad on a high-speed grinder to clean the gasket surface—a big no-no! Johnny's finger points to a series of telltale witness marks from the errant operation. (At this point we had to ask ourselves if the gaskets were reused, as well.) We are a little surprised it lasted 169,000 miles, though all those miles were fraught with other issues on a continual basis."
"As IMM dug deeper into the 5.7L Hemi and removed the timing chain and variable camshaft timing (VCT) hub assembly, it was discovered that the dowel pin that locates the timing chain and VCT assembly was severely bent. This would've affected the valve timing events by slightly retarding everything, but probably not enough to notice. What's interesting is that it never failed in the 169,000 miles since the timing chain was repaired at the dealership service department. We can't say for sure this is installation error, but the odds are in favor."
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Somebody should tell Johnny Bumpkins he can save money by doing his own oil changes. One might think an automotive journalist would know this. Since his tech articles often consisted of taking parts supplied by advertisers to a shop and documenting their installation, an argument could be made he doesn't have the skills required to change his wife's oil.
Also, the first time I've ever seen anyone comment with authority that a simple oil viscosity difference could cause a serious issue in an engine.
"A common problem is for the locking pin in an MDS lifter to not engage or disengage from the plunger, often the result of using an oil viscosity heavier than the specified 5W30 synthetic. When this happens, the loose roller tappet hammers and bounces on the cam lobe at high speed when it's supposed to be solidly engaged. The initial failure cascades until the needle bearings in the lifter cause the roller to lock up, at which time the affected cam lobe wears away. The valve seats and valves also pay a price when this happens."
"A common problem is for the locking pin in an MDS lifter to not engage or disengage from the plunger, often the result of using an oil viscosity heavier than the specified 5W30 synthetic. When this happens, the loose roller tappet hammers and bounces on the cam lobe at high speed when it's supposed to be solidly engaged. The initial failure cascades until the needle bearings in the lifter cause the roller to lock up, at which time the affected cam lobe wears away. The valve seats and valves also pay a price when this happens."
I don't think that camshaft locating pin is bent at all. It appears to me that he locating holes in the cam is enlarged, allowing the pin to shift. This likely happend during the timing chain mishap, unless the cam was replaced, but I see no mention of that.
Meh, Dodge themselves is being praised for their well-wearing engine. The dealer, well, I'm sure whatever tech did that lousy work 169K miles ago has moved on.
All that said, I'm pretty sure that the article is wrong and this vehicle calls for 5W-20, not that it matters. I'm guessing 5W-30 is better for this engine and since similar Hemis call for 0W-40, that would be fine too - so thicker oil isn't the problem here IMO - although I'm sure there's someone out there putting conventional 20W-50 in their Hemi and I definitely wouldn't wanna be the next owner of that one!
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My memory coincides with your assertion. I was selling 5W-30 to Dodge dealers. When the 5.7 Hemi came out, they needed to also stock 5W-20 for them. So Johnny is wrong. Again.
I believe the 0W-40 specced Hemis don't have the MDS system, however.
That was a sorry piece of writing... he keeps alluding to all these "problems" the dealer caused... what are they? The radiator sprayed water all over the electrical components? It runs fine in spite of having all these codes what codes?
Does he actually think the dealer tech remanufactured those heads, I'm betting on Mopar has them done and supplies them on an exchange basis...
He got 235,000 miles out of the engine 160something thousand out of the "shoddy" work and got Mopar to give him a new engine when what he needed to do was replace the head gaskets instead of dumping it full of snake oil.... Instead of diagnosing the problem and taking care of it he gets Mopar to foot most of the bill for the parts cannon by promising some "ink"...
What a tool.
Does he actually think the dealer tech remanufactured those heads, I'm betting on Mopar has them done and supplies them on an exchange basis...
He got 235,000 miles out of the engine 160something thousand out of the "shoddy" work and got Mopar to give him a new engine when what he needed to do was replace the head gaskets instead of dumping it full of snake oil.... Instead of diagnosing the problem and taking care of it he gets Mopar to foot most of the bill for the parts cannon by promising some "ink"...
What a tool.
Hemi Engine Autopsy: 235,000-Mile 5.7L Out of a 2011 Challenger
Can a high-mileage Hemi with a history of problems be salvaged?www.motortrend.com
I stopped reading after hearing about a ton of issues with this car, about halfway down in the article.
I do have tow straps and hooks with my 4Runner and would be happy to get this rig to a shop as needed...........no cost to the "author."
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Shanna's hot!!
Other than the early timing chain issue (that was repaired under warranty), it sounds like it was reliable until 200k plus. Also a fun, comfortable and enjoyable car to drive. Life's too short to drive a boring appliance.
Yup, having a daily driver that turns 13 second 1/4 miles is simply joyful.
The bent dowel likely happened when the timing chain guide broke & took the chain out... Not much of a way for the "Technician" to do that. Of coarse it should have been caught when the cam gear was off replacing the timing components.
Using abrasive disc's is a BIG no no.....But some mechanics can't break the habit even though every auto/engine manufacturer warns against it.
Using abrasive disc's is a BIG no no.....But some mechanics can't break the habit even though every auto/engine manufacturer warns against it.
6.4 HEMI’s have MDS and spec 0w40, both the 5.7 and 6.4 now use the same exact part numbers for the regular lifters and deactivating lifters.
For a period FCA couldn’t keep water pumps in 5.7 equipped Durango’s and Grand Cherokee’s,
I’m not sure if that extended to all 5.7 equipped vehicles or not… it’s possible it hilariously overheated at one point compromising the head gasket. When those pumps fail they don’t always immediately purge out all the coolant, mine went from normal ~203F then just skyrocketed to ~300F according to the EVIC and only then started blowing steam.
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