Mobil 1 FS X2 5w50 vs Supercar 5w50?

[Robvette]

What are the different purposes? Intended applications? between Mobil 1 FS X2 and Supercar 5w50 oils?

The data fields / test info provided on PDS for each is different. It’d be nice to have a side by side comparison using all the same metrics - does that exist?

M1 Supercar 5w50
https://www.mobil.com/en-us/passenger-vehicle-lube/pds/na-xx-mobil-1-supercar-series

M1 FS X2 5w50
https://www.mobil.com/en/lubricants/for-personal-vehicles/our-products/products/mobil-1-fs-x2-5w-50

 

[buster]

One is mid/low SAP one is full.

ESP/Super Car oils - mid SAP.
FS - Full SAP.

Mobil's made a bit of mess with multiple 0w40s now but niche oils are the thing these days....

 

[ka9mnx]

 

[Robvette]

One is mid/low SAP one is full.

ESP/Super Car oils - mid SAP.
FS - Full SAP.

Mobil's made a bit of mess with multiple 0w40s now but niche oils are the thing these days....

Thanks! Since the FS can be found for $7ish a quart and Supercar is $13ish it seems like any car that doesn’t need the lower SAPS of Supercar could just happily use FS X2.

It’s interesting that both the pour point is lower and V@100c is higher on the Supercar oil.

 

[Robvette]

Here’s the response from Mobil:

 

[bhvrdr]

Would be nice to know which oil is on the left here...

 

[Robvette]

Would be nice to know which oil is on the left here...

 

[bhvrdr]

Again it would be nice to know which product Mobil themselves said is the same as m1 5w50 supercar and advertised such to every owner in that literature that was received.

 

[Robvette]

The ad said same tech - not the exact same oil. In contrast, the 0w-40 was exactly the same as ESP:

 

[bhvrdr]

I know that's my picture from Mobil 1 handouts I received when meeting with their engineers

They state the same for both...

 

[Robvette]

I know that's my picture from Mobil 1 handouts I received when meeting with their engineers

They state the same for both...

View attachment 147621

Just message Mobil tech and ask exactly what you want to know. They’re very responsive.

 

[Indyxc]

Adding this VOA comparison for discussion point. VOAs courtesy of PZEV.

Supercar looks like a higher ZDDP oil with less detergents.

Any reason these oils aren't essentally interchangeable? Which one is the higher quality base oil and better for wear protection?

 

[Indyxc]

One is mid/low SAP one is full.

ESP/Super Car oils - mid SAP.
FS - Full SAP.

Mobil's made a bit of mess with multiple 0w40s now but niche oils are the thing these days....

One question I have is how can the mid Saps oil (Supercar 5w50) have higher ZDDP than the Full Sap FS? Is only the 0w40 oil the mid saps version?

 

[ylk1]

By the VOA, the Supercar 5W-50 looks like midSAPS detergent/TBN level with Fricton reducers/ZDDP levels higher than a typical fullSAPS formulation.

I guess, LT6 valvetrain being all mechanical with no hydraulic compensation requires the higher organic ZDDP formulation to preserve the finger followers and Cams. The Porsche GT engines have similar valvetrain and I won't be suprised if the newer M1 CGT 0W-40 formulation is somewhat similar to 5W-50 supercar.

Compared to the FS X2, the Supercar MSDS shows a GTL base and the additive pack ingredients look like the ones used in a ACEA C3/ESP formulations.

The FS has group 2 ish base with standard ZDDP

 

[travis8352]

By the VOA, the Supercar 5W-50 looks like midSAPS detergent/TBN level with Fricton reducers/ZDDP levels higher than a typical fullSAPS formulation.

I guess, LT6 valvetrain being all mechanical with no hydraulic compensation requires the higher organic ZDDP formulation to preserve the finger followers and Cams. The Porsche GT engines have similar valvetrain and I won't be suprised if the newer M1 CGT 0W-40 formulation is somewhat similar to 5W-50 supercar.

View attachment 211480

View attachment 211475

Compared to the FS X2, the Supercar MSDS shows a GTL base and the additive pack ingredients look like the ones used in a ACEA C3 formulation.


View attachment 211474

The FS has group 2 ish base with standard ZDDP

Theres a VOA for c40 gt already. It has esp x3 add pack

 

[ylk1]

Theres a VOA for c40 gt already. It has esp x3 add pack

Right! just saw it, The C40 GT Zinc/Phosphorous levels don't look that much different to a typical ESP X4 0W-40. No idea what changed then.

 

[kschachn]

The FS has group 2 ish base with standard ZDDP

Group 2?

 

[4WD]

Group 2?

Must have looked at his boarding pass …

 

[ylk1]

Group 2?

I thought Exxon only made Group1, Group2/2+, Group3+?(Visom) and synthetic base stocks based on their product offerings
https://www.exxonmobil.com/en/basestocks/products

I don't know if they get Group 3 from SK/Chevron or somewhere else and have the CAS# in question.

Looking at MSDS sheets across manufacturers for base stocks, synthetic stocks and oil lines, This classification makes sense for me.
I get that there are always exceptions to the CAS classification based on manufacturing process and the final quality of the product matters more than anything else.
Having said that, I expect more from an M1 FS line.

Group 1	CAS#64742-65-0	Solvent Dewaxed Heavy Paraffinic Distillate	Exxon Americas CORE?
Group 2/2+	CAS#64742-54-7	Severly Hydrotreated Heavy Paraffanic Distillate	Exxon EHC, Some Yubase oils (group3)
Group 3	CAS#72623-8X-1	Lubricating oils, hydrotreated CXX-XX, neutral oilbased	Chevron Nexbase (group 3)
Group 3+?	CAS#64742-71-8	Catalytic Dewaxed Light Paraffinic Oil	Exxon Visom 4
GTL	CAS#848301-69-9	Distillates, Heavy, C18-50 - Branched, Cyclic and Linear (Fischer-Tropsch	Shell GTL
PAO/mPAO	CAS#68037-01-4 CAS#68649-12-7	1-Decene Homopolymer/Tetramer/Trimer etc.., Hydrogenated	Exxon SpectraSYN products

References:
Exxon basestocks: https://www.exxonmobil.com/en/basestocks/products
Exxon MSDS search: https://www.msds.exxonmobil.com/psims.aspx

Chevron basestocks: https://chevronbaseoils.my.site.com/s/typicals
Chevron MSDS search: https://cglapps.chevron.com/msdspds/SDSPage.aspx?directSDSLink=true

Shell GTL: https://www.shell.us/business-custo...8/product-stewardship-lubes-gtl-base-oils.pdf

SK's basestocks : https://www.skenmove.com/business/base_oil
YUBASE MSDS: http://www.yubase.com/product/msds


Mobil 1 Super 10W-40 blend for example:
Mix of Group 1 + Group 2

 

[FCD]

Here in Europe until last year we still had the X1 version, which was mostly GTL and PAO with a dash of Ester, the X2 version is mostly if not all Group 3 / 3+ which is kind of a bummer, although it is API SP now with less Calcium and more Magnesium.