The add pack is always a major part of it but like I said there was a XOM presentation around here which iirc suggested AN were a contributor.
Mobil 1 ESP possibly using diblock polymer
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edyvw
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Can you please elaborate on this?
I’d say no one has any evidence other than speculation, to be honest. Even the thoughts about valve deposits.
you mean that if you burn plenty of oil which has more zinc and phosphorous could damage the cat?
why is that?
so i guess in this case of an oil with low saps is better for cat?
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If burning high amounts of oil a low saps oil would be better for the catalytic converter.
And it’s to do with Saps levels. Them burning and going to the catalytic converter both clogs and decreases efficiency causing it to die sooner.
The wider temp range 0W30 oils use more VII’s while 5W30 oils use less VII’s . The VII’s are thought to produce more intake valve deposits in GDI engines . Conversely , as VII’s improve this may no longer be the concern it once was . I say if an oil meets the MB & VW deposit specs - then it has to be well engineered and use with confidence.
i burn oil so i need low saps.
but i also have fuel dilution ,well its less now, but it is there.and in another topic , cant remember which one,some members suggested that for fuel dilution its better a high saps oil for retaining more additives .
so burn oil ,mid saps ( i never buy low saps )
fuel dilution high saps
solution?
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
That is if all things are equal. They are not.
These two oils have two different base stocks. If you compare older ESP 5W30, I would agree. New one? I am not so sure.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
No you don’t need low-SAPS. Primary “killer “ of catalytic converter is Zinc. Just because it is low-SAPS, doesn’t mean it has lowZinc levels. ESP Zinc levels are around 900ppm.
Is that good, bad, or “meh” in a modern GDI engine?
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
It does not have anything to do with GDI. Zinc is not one that sticks on valves. For anything higher, ZDDP reduces the possibility of LSPI. Euro oils were always high in ZDDP and very, very few EUro engines have LSPI issues. We have discussed a lot that. The LSPI issues started also when API reduced phosphorous levels with API SM for 0/5W30 oils. Euro oils stayed with high phosphorous/zinc levels, that is why many are still labeled API SL.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Since 1988 all oils are catalytic converter friendly. But if burning, I guess lower Zinc levels might slightly delay failure.
I don't recall any real consensus on the IVD issues.
I remember some saying an oil that burns more (or has a higher Noack #) is better for the IVD. Because it evaporates "better" and doesn't leave as much deposits ... Basically, a very low Noack # (I assume) wasn't good or something to that effect.
Also that the cause (or the main cause?) of IVD is not from the PCV end but mainly from the the oil getting thru into the combustion chamber.
Not sure if any of the above arguments were or remain valid or somewhat valid but all we want is peace in the world
sorry, I meant to say which oil and/or approvals are better for the IVD?
That might be a million-dollar question.
I remember some saying an oil that burns more (or has a higher Noack #) is better for the IVD. Because it evaporates "better" and doesn't leave as much deposits ... Basically, a very low Noack # (I assume) wasn't good or something to that effect.
Also that the cause (or the main cause?) of IVD is not from the PCV end but mainly from the the oil getting thru into the combustion chamber.
Not sure if any of the above arguments were or remain valid or somewhat valid but all we want is peace in the world
sorry, I meant to say which oil and/or approvals are better for the IVD? That might be a million-dollar question.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Very low Noack is good.I don't recall any real consensus on the IVD issues.
I remember some saying an oil that burns more (or has a higher Noack #) is better for the IVD. Because it evaporates "better" and doesn't leave as much deposits ... Basically, a very low Noack # (I assume) wasn't good or something to that effect.
Also that the cause (or the main cause?) of IVD is not from the PCV end but mainly from the the oil getting thru into the combustion chamber.
Not sure if any of the above arguments were or remain valid or somewhat valid but all we want is peace in the world
That might be a million-dollar question.
Difference in IVD is how much of sulfated ash each oil produces.
Patman
Staff member
That’s one thing that disappointed me when M1 changed from ESP Formula 5w30 to simply calling it ESP 5w30. The older version had 0.6% SA and the newer version has 0.8%. One of the big reasons I chose ESP Formula for my Corvette back in 2018 was that low SA, which I figured was perfect for keeping IVD low. At least for most of my oil changes all these years I have been using the original older formula. I stocked up quite a bit when they changed the formula.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Not only that, ESP Formula had Noack value of 5.6%.
Patman
Staff member
Yep
I have the last of that formula in my Corvette right now but once it’s done that’s the end of my stash of it.
edyvw
$50 site donor 2025
Yeah, I used that stuff in my X5 diesel and Tiguan. It was excellent oil.Yep
I have the last of that formula in my Corvette right now but once it’s done that’s the end of my stash of it.
I’d switch to ESP X4Yep
I have the last of that formula in my Corvette right now but once it’s done that’s the end of my stash of it.
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