Overkill...You are dead on, Royal Purple is a glorified blending facility like many others. They buy the base stock, additives, esters, and etc from whoever (if they are using a PAO, then odds are it comes from the big PAO facility in Beaumont,TX. The name on facility is "Exxon Mobil", however there are a handful of smaller PAO refineries in the US and Canada). I would like to know what additives RP add to the mix make their oil better than anyone elses. Is it friction modifier, detergent, do they have a super VI improver? I dont know...
Mobil 1 AFE or Royal Purple 0W-20
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Originally Posted By: Dan14
Overkill...You are dead on, Royal Purple is a glorified blending facility like many others. They buy the base stock, additives, esters, and etc from whoever (if they are using a PAO, then odds are it comes from the big PAO facility in Beaumont,TX. The name on facility is "Exxon Mobil", however there are a handful of smaller PAO refineries in the US and Canada). I would like to know what additives RP add to the mix make their oil better than anyone elses. Is it friction modifier, detergent, do they have a super VI improver? I dont know...
You used the word "glorified" in a negative way about the company and then indicate that you don't know much about the oil itself. Is that not strange to you? Sounds like forming an opinion on something that you don't have enough information to base the opinion on. It's already been said...some RP oils have Synerlec in it which is a sulfurized ester. It's an antiwear additive. Also, many RP oils have very high TBN which helps them clean and last for long OCIs.
Overkill...You are dead on, Royal Purple is a glorified blending facility like many others. They buy the base stock, additives, esters, and etc from whoever (if they are using a PAO, then odds are it comes from the big PAO facility in Beaumont,TX. The name on facility is "Exxon Mobil", however there are a handful of smaller PAO refineries in the US and Canada). I would like to know what additives RP add to the mix make their oil better than anyone elses. Is it friction modifier, detergent, do they have a super VI improver? I dont know...
You used the word "glorified" in a negative way about the company and then indicate that you don't know much about the oil itself. Is that not strange to you? Sounds like forming an opinion on something that you don't have enough information to base the opinion on. It's already been said...some RP oils have Synerlec in it which is a sulfurized ester. It's an antiwear additive. Also, many RP oils have very high TBN which helps them clean and last for long OCIs.
Dan14, a belated welcome to BITOG!
There are dozens of small blenders such as Red Line, Amsoil and RP that for the most part source their base oils and additives from the majors. But that doesn't mean they can't make a superior product for a particular application to what the majors currently offer. In other words they fill a niche market.
But when the application is precisely defined, the small blenders are at a distinct disadvantage to the majors in both resources, cost points and I'll even include expertise.
Put another way, all leading edge oils originate with the majors.
Two benchmark examples:
M1 0W-40. Name one oil that's even on par that doesn't cost twice as much.
Nippon Oil's 0W-20. Lead the way in developing an ultra high VI 0W-20. Only the majors XOM and Idemitsu have competing products.
There are dozens of small blenders such as Red Line, Amsoil and RP that for the most part source their base oils and additives from the majors. But that doesn't mean they can't make a superior product for a particular application to what the majors currently offer. In other words they fill a niche market.
But when the application is precisely defined, the small blenders are at a distinct disadvantage to the majors in both resources, cost points and I'll even include expertise.
Put another way, all leading edge oils originate with the majors.
Two benchmark examples:
M1 0W-40. Name one oil that's even on par that doesn't cost twice as much.
Nippon Oil's 0W-20. Lead the way in developing an ultra high VI 0W-20. Only the majors XOM and Idemitsu have competing products.
JAG...i have plenty of information to go on when it comes to this, if you want to call my opinion negative go ahead. When it comes down to it CATERHAM is right...there are the bigs and then there are those who play in the niche market. Where i live Amsoil is big. Would i put it in my ATV or Snowmobile over Mobil 1? Yes. Would i put in my car? NO. Why, well for one even if i know that the basestock comes from Mobils plant in TX and the addpack comes from Infinnium (or who ever is suppling at the time) i still wont pay the extra 4 dollars a quart for AMSOIL. What am i getting for the extra four dollars?
TBN measures additive performance rather than by-products of oxidation, therefore the oil must contain a base number additive. The TBN decreases until the oxidation ihibitor is depleted...it has nothing to do with keeping your oil clean
TBN measures additive performance rather than by-products of oxidation, therefore the oil must contain a base number additive. The TBN decreases until the oxidation ihibitor is depleted...it has nothing to do with keeping your oil clean
Dan, if you had posted your reasons why you believe the RP oils have a deficiency or whatever I may not have said anything. It's just that when someone makes a negative remark they should say why. Instead you also said you don't know what's in RP that makes it better than any other oil. It looks like mudslinging out of dislike or some thing else of a personal nature.
I know what organo-metallic detergents do and one of them is to clean high temperature areas of engines. I'm not going to make a follow up post about it if you disagree because that would be too off-topic. I refer you to a good Google search instead. Sorry for being crabby...I'm sick today.
I know what organo-metallic detergents do and one of them is to clean high temperature areas of engines. I'm not going to make a follow up post about it if you disagree because that would be too off-topic. I refer you to a good Google search instead. Sorry for being crabby...I'm sick today.
Originally Posted By: fpracha
What specific equipments? Btw what are you using in air compressors (both reciprocating and screw-driven types) in your industrial setup and what kind of oil life and equipment life is being experienced?
Reciprocating compressors, high pressure water pumps, and so forth. Right now, the duty cycle on the air compressors is probably close to 25%, maybe a hair more. The pumps are probably at a 75% duty cycle. OCIs are roughly three months, using conventional oil (i.e. CH, Cat).
One compressor is two years old and already experiencing significant blowby. Pumps need valve jobs on a regular basis, six months to one year, and sometimes they're so far gone a valve job isn't possible. The high ambient temperatures cannot be helpful.
What specific equipments? Btw what are you using in air compressors (both reciprocating and screw-driven types) in your industrial setup and what kind of oil life and equipment life is being experienced?
Reciprocating compressors, high pressure water pumps, and so forth. Right now, the duty cycle on the air compressors is probably close to 25%, maybe a hair more. The pumps are probably at a 75% duty cycle. OCIs are roughly three months, using conventional oil (i.e. CH, Cat).
One compressor is two years old and already experiencing significant blowby. Pumps need valve jobs on a regular basis, six months to one year, and sometimes they're so far gone a valve job isn't possible. The high ambient temperatures cannot be helpful.
Some boutique oils are excellent and fill certain niche markets. Amsoil/Redline for an example have certain oils that are very good.
I also think they tend to be behind in additive/base oil technology. It's often older/boosted existing additives that are really not cutting edge. Just look at Amsoil's calcium/boron/moly levels. Nothing wrong with it, but their oils are not really that innovative.
Royal Purple's claim to fame is Synerlec.
Roytal Purple has shown to be a very good oil. Some of their UOA's show really good Tbn retention. Some better than Amsoil.
Some engines types can benefit from higher levels of ZDP, although that doesn't seem to be the case for the most part. Royal Purple's oils have traditionally had higher levels.
I also think they tend to be behind in additive/base oil technology. It's often older/boosted existing additives that are really not cutting edge. Just look at Amsoil's calcium/boron/moly levels. Nothing wrong with it, but their oils are not really that innovative.
Royal Purple's claim to fame is Synerlec.
Roytal Purple has shown to be a very good oil. Some of their UOA's show really good Tbn retention. Some better than Amsoil.
Some engines types can benefit from higher levels of ZDP, although that doesn't seem to be the case for the most part. Royal Purple's oils have traditionally had higher levels.
I definitely think in some ways Mobil 1 is an odd oil. In terms of UOA data, it really hasn't shown to be any better than any other oil. However it meets some of the most demanding specs out there. I've always thought Mobil 1's best qualities are high temperature deposit and oxidation resistance. It rarely thickens and keeps the ring clean.
Originally Posted By: buster
Some boutique oils are excellent and fill certain niche markets. Amsoil/Redline for an example have certain oils that are very good.
I also think they tend to be behind in additive/base oil technology. It's often older/boosted existing additives that are really not cutting edge. Just look at Amsoil's calcium/boron/moly levels. Nothing wrong with it, but their oils are not really that innovative.
Royal Purple's claim to fame is Synerlec.
Roytal Purple has shown to be a very good oil. Some of their UOA's show really good Tbn retention. Some better than Amsoil.
Some engines types can benefit from higher levels of ZDP, although that doesn't seem to be the case for the most part. Royal Purple's oils have traditionally had higher levels.
Perhaps not innovative additive packages that we can see, but if you're going by that you may as well call Amsoil's SSO Pennzoil Ultra.
Then there is always the spin that new doesn't always/automatically default into = better.
I mean really, why can't it stand alone as being very good quality of a certain type of add package, new or old...the way you phrased/presented this post just seems to scream marketing or selling something.
Why can't all of the good oils that we 'know' are good simply be regarded as slightly differing tools to be used in the right way and there are also wrong ways, etc?
Some boutique oils are excellent and fill certain niche markets. Amsoil/Redline for an example have certain oils that are very good.
I also think they tend to be behind in additive/base oil technology. It's often older/boosted existing additives that are really not cutting edge. Just look at Amsoil's calcium/boron/moly levels. Nothing wrong with it, but their oils are not really that innovative.
Royal Purple's claim to fame is Synerlec.
Roytal Purple has shown to be a very good oil. Some of their UOA's show really good Tbn retention. Some better than Amsoil.
Some engines types can benefit from higher levels of ZDP, although that doesn't seem to be the case for the most part. Royal Purple's oils have traditionally had higher levels.
Perhaps not innovative additive packages that we can see, but if you're going by that you may as well call Amsoil's SSO Pennzoil Ultra.
Then there is always the spin that new doesn't always/automatically default into = better.
I mean really, why can't it stand alone as being very good quality of a certain type of add package, new or old...the way you phrased/presented this post just seems to scream marketing or selling something.
Why can't all of the good oils that we 'know' are good simply be regarded as slightly differing tools to be used in the right way and there are also wrong ways, etc?
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: fpracha
What specific equipments? Btw what are you using in air compressors (both reciprocating and screw-driven types) in your industrial setup and what kind of oil life and equipment life is being experienced?
Reciprocating compressors, high pressure water pumps, and so forth. Right now, the duty cycle on the air compressors is probably close to 25%, maybe a hair more. The pumps are probably at a 75% duty cycle. OCIs are roughly three months, using conventional oil (i.e. CH, Cat).
One compressor is two years old and already experiencing significant blowby. Pumps need valve jobs on a regular basis, six months to one year, and sometimes they're so far gone a valve job isn't possible. The high ambient temperatures cannot be helpful.
I have many friends who solved similar problems many years ago by using some special oil group - i will let you know what they did and may be you can help your equipment too. Later.
Originally Posted By: fpracha
What specific equipments? Btw what are you using in air compressors (both reciprocating and screw-driven types) in your industrial setup and what kind of oil life and equipment life is being experienced?
Reciprocating compressors, high pressure water pumps, and so forth. Right now, the duty cycle on the air compressors is probably close to 25%, maybe a hair more. The pumps are probably at a 75% duty cycle. OCIs are roughly three months, using conventional oil (i.e. CH, Cat).
One compressor is two years old and already experiencing significant blowby. Pumps need valve jobs on a regular basis, six months to one year, and sometimes they're so far gone a valve job isn't possible. The high ambient temperatures cannot be helpful.
I have many friends who solved similar problems many years ago by using some special oil group - i will let you know what they did and may be you can help your equipment too. Later.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
You obviously know very little about Royal Purple and what they do. Maybe you should educate yourself a little more before making claims as quoted above; many of which are false. About the only correct things you posted is that they do not have a refinery.
So instead of buying lubricant and additive components from the majors like every other blender, they have the magic additive pixie deliver "Royal Purple Exclusive" add packs and components?
Perhaps I haven't "educated" myself enough. I need to go watch some more one-armed bandit advertising videos I guess.
You implied all RP does is buy premade components and throw them together which is untrue. RP actually formulates their Synerlac additive in house for one thing. Keep on making your wild claims. Just makes you look bad.
I implied no such thing, are you really that sensitive regarding this company???
My statement was that they purchase the components to blend their lubricants from the majors. Is this an incorrect statement? Do they have a company called "Royal Purple Chemical" that they buy their AN's, PAO, Esters and other lubricant components from?
Yes, companies like Lubrizol and Infineum offer "pre-configured" additive packages to small blenders to help them meet specific performance criteria with their final products. However, there is a glaring absence of that being mentioned in the post of mine you quoted.
You see what you post vastly different than I do reading it. Perhaps you don't convey your actual intent well? You come across, most times, as someone with a bias against RP who takes every opportunity to belittle their product.
RP does not just go the the oil additive store and grab what they want and then go home and throw it into a bottle as you are basically saying here. This isn't buying a bottle of Prego at the supermarket and going home and dumping it in a pot and saying you made homemade spaghetti sauce when dinner is served. That is how you make it sound with RP. In otherwords their product is actually all someone else's stuff they just mix together and throw in a bottle without RP actually doing anything with what they buy to come up with a unique product.
They obviously buy basestock as they are not a refiner and they may well buy some additives as you say. However, they do a lot of formulating on their own and a lot of what goes into the bottle is not something that comes from a supplier. RP's Synerlac is something done in house. It may be made up of items purchased but it is what they do with it that gives the end result. Frankly, most oil suppliers fall into this but do you question them and discredit their products as well?
Believe what you wish I really could care less. I am only sensitive when people go out of their way to discredit RP for reasons unrelated to an actual bad experience using it or some legit reason that does not require use. Sadly it happens on this site far too often. I really don't care if people use it or even like it just be civil and fair.
There are a LOT of oils/oil mfg's I dislike but I do not purposely go out of my way to beat up on them the way you and other RP detractors do( yes, that is what you are even if you won't admit to it and use their ATF ). I actually dislike ExxonMobil with a passion and think their oils are mediocre at best but do I run around in every M1 post saying that? NO! I generally just avoid the post. "IF" there is a specific question about M1 tied into a post about other oils I might mention it is not my choice but I don't berate and belittle those who use it. Even in this thread I did not belittle M1. Rather I questioned the reasons some of you were using to claim it as the best ever.
The anti RP crowd( many of whom have never even used it )feel the need to talk it down in every thread where it is mentioned however. The second RP is mentioned you can count the seconds until someone will feel the need to start trashing it in some way or form. GUARATEED! In some way they will speak negative about it. It is foolish and frankly annoying. THAT is why I respond at times as if I am sensitve.
In this thread in particular all people needed to do was simply pick - RP or M1 and leave it at that. If a certain spec is needed for say warranty that RP does not cover fine say that and leave it at that. If M1 is actually certified to the spec and we don't know about RP that doesn't mean RP doesn't or can't meet the spec either. It just means their oil was not tested but people will try and say because MI has the cert that makes it better which we all know, in truth, is a bogus statement. If you have used one or the other in the specific vehicle( there was one mentioned in the original post right? )say I used RP or M1 and it did good or bad in the application. Basically speak to the question and leave out the brand bashing.
Instead it gets turned into M1 is the best ever and is used FF and in race teams, and it carries every spec cert under the sun as if that makes it the actual best oil, while RP is just some backwoods company who buys premade ingredients for their oils and just mixes it all together and bottles it. You personally made it sound like RP is the housewife who bought bottled sauce and tried to pass it off as homemade. That is just untrue. The constant RP bashing on this site just gets old. I know M1 gets it's share of bashing too so I believe the M1 fans know what I mean. If they do they should try and not do it with RP.
Bottom line is stick to the topic and leave out the rants and rhetoric. If you don't use a product or know how it is made don't speculate and stir up a hornets nest and then whine when people call you out.
I am done with this and I hope you can be as well. Let the thread go back to the actual topic.
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
You obviously know very little about Royal Purple and what they do. Maybe you should educate yourself a little more before making claims as quoted above; many of which are false. About the only correct things you posted is that they do not have a refinery.
So instead of buying lubricant and additive components from the majors like every other blender, they have the magic additive pixie deliver "Royal Purple Exclusive" add packs and components?
Perhaps I haven't "educated" myself enough. I need to go watch some more one-armed bandit advertising videos I guess.
You implied all RP does is buy premade components and throw them together which is untrue. RP actually formulates their Synerlac additive in house for one thing. Keep on making your wild claims. Just makes you look bad.
I implied no such thing, are you really that sensitive regarding this company???
My statement was that they purchase the components to blend their lubricants from the majors. Is this an incorrect statement? Do they have a company called "Royal Purple Chemical" that they buy their AN's, PAO, Esters and other lubricant components from?
Yes, companies like Lubrizol and Infineum offer "pre-configured" additive packages to small blenders to help them meet specific performance criteria with their final products. However, there is a glaring absence of that being mentioned in the post of mine you quoted.
You see what you post vastly different than I do reading it. Perhaps you don't convey your actual intent well? You come across, most times, as someone with a bias against RP who takes every opportunity to belittle their product.
RP does not just go the the oil additive store and grab what they want and then go home and throw it into a bottle as you are basically saying here. This isn't buying a bottle of Prego at the supermarket and going home and dumping it in a pot and saying you made homemade spaghetti sauce when dinner is served. That is how you make it sound with RP. In otherwords their product is actually all someone else's stuff they just mix together and throw in a bottle without RP actually doing anything with what they buy to come up with a unique product.
They obviously buy basestock as they are not a refiner and they may well buy some additives as you say. However, they do a lot of formulating on their own and a lot of what goes into the bottle is not something that comes from a supplier. RP's Synerlac is something done in house. It may be made up of items purchased but it is what they do with it that gives the end result. Frankly, most oil suppliers fall into this but do you question them and discredit their products as well?
Believe what you wish I really could care less. I am only sensitive when people go out of their way to discredit RP for reasons unrelated to an actual bad experience using it or some legit reason that does not require use. Sadly it happens on this site far too often. I really don't care if people use it or even like it just be civil and fair.
There are a LOT of oils/oil mfg's I dislike but I do not purposely go out of my way to beat up on them the way you and other RP detractors do( yes, that is what you are even if you won't admit to it and use their ATF ). I actually dislike ExxonMobil with a passion and think their oils are mediocre at best but do I run around in every M1 post saying that? NO! I generally just avoid the post. "IF" there is a specific question about M1 tied into a post about other oils I might mention it is not my choice but I don't berate and belittle those who use it. Even in this thread I did not belittle M1. Rather I questioned the reasons some of you were using to claim it as the best ever.
The anti RP crowd( many of whom have never even used it )feel the need to talk it down in every thread where it is mentioned however. The second RP is mentioned you can count the seconds until someone will feel the need to start trashing it in some way or form. GUARATEED! In some way they will speak negative about it. It is foolish and frankly annoying. THAT is why I respond at times as if I am sensitve.
In this thread in particular all people needed to do was simply pick - RP or M1 and leave it at that. If a certain spec is needed for say warranty that RP does not cover fine say that and leave it at that. If M1 is actually certified to the spec and we don't know about RP that doesn't mean RP doesn't or can't meet the spec either. It just means their oil was not tested but people will try and say because MI has the cert that makes it better which we all know, in truth, is a bogus statement. If you have used one or the other in the specific vehicle( there was one mentioned in the original post right? )say I used RP or M1 and it did good or bad in the application. Basically speak to the question and leave out the brand bashing.
Instead it gets turned into M1 is the best ever and is used FF and in race teams, and it carries every spec cert under the sun as if that makes it the actual best oil, while RP is just some backwoods company who buys premade ingredients for their oils and just mixes it all together and bottles it. You personally made it sound like RP is the housewife who bought bottled sauce and tried to pass it off as homemade. That is just untrue. The constant RP bashing on this site just gets old. I know M1 gets it's share of bashing too so I believe the M1 fans know what I mean. If they do they should try and not do it with RP.
Bottom line is stick to the topic and leave out the rants and rhetoric. If you don't use a product or know how it is made don't speculate and stir up a hornets nest and then whine when people call you out.
I am done with this and I hope you can be as well. Let the thread go back to the actual topic.
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Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
My statement was that they purchase the components to blend their lubricants from the majors. Is this an incorrect statement? Do they have a company called "Royal Purple Chemical" that they buy their AN's, PAO, Esters and other lubricant components from?
There are restaurants that buy milk wholesale from the same company. How their pudding tastes is entirely dependant on the chef itself. Like they say the proof's in the pudding. Milk is a basestock to many great desserts but we all know that those desserts don't taste the same everywhere.
Royal Purple may buy their basestocks from ExMo but I believe(opinion here so don't lynch me)their additive package SYNERLEC, made in-house is a better additive than what Mobil uses. Why do I believe this? Simply like to believe what I see during tear downs.
My statement was that they purchase the components to blend their lubricants from the majors. Is this an incorrect statement? Do they have a company called "Royal Purple Chemical" that they buy their AN's, PAO, Esters and other lubricant components from?
There are restaurants that buy milk wholesale from the same company. How their pudding tastes is entirely dependant on the chef itself. Like they say the proof's in the pudding. Milk is a basestock to many great desserts but we all know that those desserts don't taste the same everywhere.
Royal Purple may buy their basestocks from ExMo but I believe(opinion here so don't lynch me)their additive package SYNERLEC, made in-house is a better additive than what Mobil uses. Why do I believe this? Simply like to believe what I see during tear downs.
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NHHEMI, OT but where will you find two guys with multiple sclerosis backing up a product that most people on this board despise due to their marketing. Good stuff my man and for a guy with MS you articulate yourself very well. Keep it up!
Thanks and right back at you.
I am lucky that the MS has not impacted my motorskills as of this point. It has disabled me for work purposes but I can still funciton and take care of myself and such.
Oh, almost forgot, add in we live fairly close as well with you being in MA and me in NH. At most we would only be 3-4 hours away tops as I live about 10 miles from the MA border. Small world.
I am lucky that the MS has not impacted my motorskills as of this point. It has disabled me for work purposes but I can still funciton and take care of myself and such.
Oh, almost forgot, add in we live fairly close as well with you being in MA and me in NH. At most we would only be 3-4 hours away tops as I live about 10 miles from the MA border. Small world.
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OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: deven
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
My statement was that they purchase the components to blend their lubricants from the majors. Is this an incorrect statement? Do they have a company called "Royal Purple Chemical" that they buy their AN's, PAO, Esters and other lubricant components from?
There are restaurants that buy milk wholesale from the same company. How their pudding tastes is entirely dependant on the chef itself. Like they say the proof's in the pudding. Milk is a basestock to many great desserts but we all know that those desserts don't taste the same everywhere.
Royal Purple may buy their basestocks from ExMo but I believe(opinion here so don't lynch me)their additive package SYNERLEC, made in-house is a better additive than what Mobil uses. Why do I believe this? Simply like to believe what I see during tear downs.
Fair enough, you are entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine. However, to use your milk analogy, most farmers to run dairy farms don't also sell pudding, nor do they manufacture and sell the other components necessary to make pudding with.
I'm not saying Mobil makes the best oils as some sort of universal truth, and I DID attempt clarify that a few times. My point was that they have the CAPABILITY to make the best oils, and I think their 0w40 is a good example of that effort
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
My statement was that they purchase the components to blend their lubricants from the majors. Is this an incorrect statement? Do they have a company called "Royal Purple Chemical" that they buy their AN's, PAO, Esters and other lubricant components from?
There are restaurants that buy milk wholesale from the same company. How their pudding tastes is entirely dependant on the chef itself. Like they say the proof's in the pudding. Milk is a basestock to many great desserts but we all know that those desserts don't taste the same everywhere.
Royal Purple may buy their basestocks from ExMo but I believe(opinion here so don't lynch me)their additive package SYNERLEC, made in-house is a better additive than what Mobil uses. Why do I believe this? Simply like to believe what I see during tear downs.
Fair enough, you are entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine. However, to use your milk analogy, most farmers to run dairy farms don't also sell pudding, nor do they manufacture and sell the other components necessary to make pudding with.
I'm not saying Mobil makes the best oils as some sort of universal truth, and I DID attempt clarify that a few times. My point was that they have the CAPABILITY to make the best oils, and I think their 0w40 is a good example of that effort
Frankly as someone who is wearing out a lot of nice trucks I have come to believe that most any synthetic is way better than needed, especially at the ridiculously short intervals everyone uses.
You've got to run an oil a LONG time to see if it's any "better" than another in your application. And you must realize that due to everyones duty cycle being so different, what you consider a great oil may not deliver the same results to me in my usage.
We just tore down a 6.0 gas GMC motor and it is nearly sparkling internally after over 250k miles of severe service! This is buying whatever is on sale in the correct grade.
Both RP and Amsoil get a raw deal because of their marketing. They both make competent products. But you can't compare their resources and research with the boys at XOM.
You've got to run an oil a LONG time to see if it's any "better" than another in your application. And you must realize that due to everyones duty cycle being so different, what you consider a great oil may not deliver the same results to me in my usage.
We just tore down a 6.0 gas GMC motor and it is nearly sparkling internally after over 250k miles of severe service! This is buying whatever is on sale in the correct grade.
Both RP and Amsoil get a raw deal because of their marketing. They both make competent products. But you can't compare their resources and research with the boys at XOM.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
You see what you post vastly different than I do reading it. Perhaps you don't convey your actual intent well? You come across, most times, as someone with a bias against RP who takes every opportunity to belittle their product.
Or perhaps you are overly sensitive to what I'm saying or THINK I'm saying, and subsequently don't necessary read what I'm saying in the manner in which I meant it. I DO try and be as clear as possible.
Quote:
RP does not just go the the oil additive store and grab what they want and then go home and throw it into a bottle as you are basically saying here.
No, that's not what I'm saying at all.
Quote:
This isn't buying a bottle of Prego at the supermarket and going home and dumping it in a pot and saying you made homemade spaghetti sauce when dinner is served. That is how you make it sound with RP.
No, it isn't.
Quote:
In otherwords their product is actually all someone else's stuff they just mix together and throw in a bottle without RP actually doing anything with what they buy to come up with a unique product.
No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that as a BLENDER, they are more limited in their choice of what components they have available to them compared to the majors. This is because they don't have the ability to make their own components if they need something that doesn't exist like say a special high VI base oil.
Quote:
They obviously buy basestock as they are not a refiner and they may well buy some additives as you say. However, they do a lot of formulating on their own and a lot of what goes into the bottle is not something that comes from a supplier. RP's Synerlac is something done in house. It may be made up of items purchased but it is what they do with it that gives the end result. Frankly, most oil suppliers fall into this but do you question them and discredit their products as well?
1. You sort of contradict yourself above. If the item is purchased, then it comes from a supplier.
2. I am NOT trying to discredit them! I've stated that companies like XOM have the CAPABILITY to make the "best" products because they can MAKE their own components! And this is SPECIFICALLY why I mentioned race lube relationships, because I think THOSE situations are often "max effort".
This does NOT mean that:
A) Blenders like Ashland, RP, AMSOIL, Redline...etc may not put more effort into specific grades of their lubes, or lubes for specific applications (see RP's industrial lubes as Garak mentioned).
B) That the majors are the "best" across the board. Having the capability of being the best does not mean that you ARE the best! Particular at EVERYTHING. As I mentioned earlier, and was echo'd by others: Mobil 1 0w40 is their "flagship" oil, and likely a very good example of their "best" effort. That doesn't mean that their 10w30 is!
Quote:
Believe what you wish I really could care less. I am only sensitive when people go out of their way to discredit RP for reasons unrelated to an actual bad experience using it or some legit reason that does not require use. Sadly it happens on this site far too often. I really don't care if people use it or even like it just be civil and fair.
Please take a look back through the thread at my first few posts. I did nothing to tear down RP and only stated that the AFE had a higher VI. It wasn't until this post by deven:
Quote:
Between those two oils I will choose Royal Purple all the time and all day long. Seen race engines at my shop that have run M1 and RP and every SINGLE time there is less wear with RP than M1 fed cars.
That I made a point about bringing up Mobil's OEM race program use, and things quickly went downhill from there.
Quote:
There are a LOT of oils/oil mfg's I dislike but I do not purposely go out of my way to beat up on them the way you and other RP detractors do( yes, that is what you are even if you won't admit to it and use their ATF ).
You know, I actually don't dislike RP. That's why I'm using their ATF. You won't find a SINGLE BP product in my house. You won't find SOPUS products, or any Ashland products. I don't use them.
I responded to a CLAIM made in this thread about the performance of one of the brands of oil I use. There was no mentioned of grade used, whether it was race oil or PCMO, HDEO....etc. It was just a blanket bomb dropping and I responded to it.
Quote:
I actually dislike ExxonMobil with a passion and think their oils are mediocre at best but do I run around in every M1 post saying that? NO! I generally just avoid the post. "IF" there is a specific question about M1 tied into a post about other oils I might mention it is not my choice but I don't berate and belittle those who use it. Even in this thread I did not belittle M1. Rather I questioned the reasons some of you were using to claim it as the best ever.
But we weren't claiming it is the "best ever", simply that the company who makes it has the CAPABILITY to make the best lubes due to their size and scope.
Quote:
The anti RP crowd( many of whom have never even used it )feel the need to talk it down in every thread where it is mentioned however. The second RP is mentioned you can count the seconds until someone will feel the need to start trashing it in some way or form. GUARATEED! In some way they will speak negative about it. It is foolish and frankly annoying. THAT is why I respond at times as if I am sensitve.
So then you can understand why I responded to the M1 claim, right? My response is based on the same defence mechanism as your own. Nobody likes to see a product they've used extensively and for a very long time talked down, particularly in the vague and often aloof fashion that is quite common on here.
Quote:
In this thread in particular all people needed to do was simply pick - RP or M1 and leave it at that.
Threads never go that way on here, you know that
Quote:
If a certain spec is needed for say warranty that RP does not cover fine say that and leave it at that. If M1 is actually certified to the spec and we don't know about RP that doesn't mean RP doesn't or can't meet the spec either. It just means their oil was not tested but people will try and say because MI has the cert that makes it better which we all know, in truth, is a bogus statement.
Not necessarily. While some of the certs and approvals may not be all that meaningful, I think with some of the high-end certs and approvals (again, see M1 0w40), you ARE being given a guarantee of performance.
Quote:
If you have used one or the other in the specific vehicle( there was one mentioned in the original post right? )say I used RP or M1 and it did good or bad in the application. Basically speak to the question and leave out the brand bashing.
Instead it gets turned into M1 is the best ever and is used FF and in race teams, and it carries every spec cert under the sun as if that makes it the actual best oil, while RP is just some backwoods company who buys premade ingredients for their oils and just mixes it all together and bottles it. You personally made it sound like RP is the housewife who bought bottled sauce and tried to pass it off as homemade. That is just untrue. The constant RP bashing on this site just gets old. I know M1 gets it's share of bashing too so I believe the M1 fans know what I mean. If they do they should try and not do it with RP.
Yes, I DO know what you mean, and I'm sorry you took what I stated in the manner in which you did. That was NOT my intent. I was validating XOM's capabilities by demonstrating their manufacturer relationships, that is not the same thing as tearing down RP, even if it ended up being viewed in that way.
Quote:
Bottom line is stick to the topic and leave out the rants and rhetoric. If you don't use a product or know how it is made don't speculate and stir up a hornets nest and then whine when people call you out.
I am done with this and I hope you can be as well. Let the thread go back to the actual topic.
But this kinda is the topic
Either oil is going to work just fine in this application. But that's been stated a gazillion times at this point.
You see what you post vastly different than I do reading it. Perhaps you don't convey your actual intent well? You come across, most times, as someone with a bias against RP who takes every opportunity to belittle their product.
Or perhaps you are overly sensitive to what I'm saying or THINK I'm saying, and subsequently don't necessary read what I'm saying in the manner in which I meant it. I DO try and be as clear as possible.
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RP does not just go the the oil additive store and grab what they want and then go home and throw it into a bottle as you are basically saying here.
No, that's not what I'm saying at all.
Quote:
This isn't buying a bottle of Prego at the supermarket and going home and dumping it in a pot and saying you made homemade spaghetti sauce when dinner is served. That is how you make it sound with RP.
No, it isn't.
Quote:
In otherwords their product is actually all someone else's stuff they just mix together and throw in a bottle without RP actually doing anything with what they buy to come up with a unique product.
No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that as a BLENDER, they are more limited in their choice of what components they have available to them compared to the majors. This is because they don't have the ability to make their own components if they need something that doesn't exist like say a special high VI base oil.
Quote:
They obviously buy basestock as they are not a refiner and they may well buy some additives as you say. However, they do a lot of formulating on their own and a lot of what goes into the bottle is not something that comes from a supplier. RP's Synerlac is something done in house. It may be made up of items purchased but it is what they do with it that gives the end result. Frankly, most oil suppliers fall into this but do you question them and discredit their products as well?
1. You sort of contradict yourself above. If the item is purchased, then it comes from a supplier.
2. I am NOT trying to discredit them! I've stated that companies like XOM have the CAPABILITY to make the "best" products because they can MAKE their own components! And this is SPECIFICALLY why I mentioned race lube relationships, because I think THOSE situations are often "max effort".
This does NOT mean that:
A) Blenders like Ashland, RP, AMSOIL, Redline...etc may not put more effort into specific grades of their lubes, or lubes for specific applications (see RP's industrial lubes as Garak mentioned).
B) That the majors are the "best" across the board. Having the capability of being the best does not mean that you ARE the best! Particular at EVERYTHING. As I mentioned earlier, and was echo'd by others: Mobil 1 0w40 is their "flagship" oil, and likely a very good example of their "best" effort. That doesn't mean that their 10w30 is!
Quote:
Believe what you wish I really could care less. I am only sensitive when people go out of their way to discredit RP for reasons unrelated to an actual bad experience using it or some legit reason that does not require use. Sadly it happens on this site far too often. I really don't care if people use it or even like it just be civil and fair.
Please take a look back through the thread at my first few posts. I did nothing to tear down RP and only stated that the AFE had a higher VI. It wasn't until this post by deven:
Quote:
Between those two oils I will choose Royal Purple all the time and all day long. Seen race engines at my shop that have run M1 and RP and every SINGLE time there is less wear with RP than M1 fed cars.
That I made a point about bringing up Mobil's OEM race program use, and things quickly went downhill from there.
Quote:
There are a LOT of oils/oil mfg's I dislike but I do not purposely go out of my way to beat up on them the way you and other RP detractors do( yes, that is what you are even if you won't admit to it and use their ATF ).
You know, I actually don't dislike RP. That's why I'm using their ATF. You won't find a SINGLE BP product in my house. You won't find SOPUS products, or any Ashland products. I don't use them.
I responded to a CLAIM made in this thread about the performance of one of the brands of oil I use. There was no mentioned of grade used, whether it was race oil or PCMO, HDEO....etc. It was just a blanket bomb dropping and I responded to it.
Quote:
I actually dislike ExxonMobil with a passion and think their oils are mediocre at best but do I run around in every M1 post saying that? NO! I generally just avoid the post. "IF" there is a specific question about M1 tied into a post about other oils I might mention it is not my choice but I don't berate and belittle those who use it. Even in this thread I did not belittle M1. Rather I questioned the reasons some of you were using to claim it as the best ever.
But we weren't claiming it is the "best ever", simply that the company who makes it has the CAPABILITY to make the best lubes due to their size and scope.
Quote:
The anti RP crowd( many of whom have never even used it )feel the need to talk it down in every thread where it is mentioned however. The second RP is mentioned you can count the seconds until someone will feel the need to start trashing it in some way or form. GUARATEED! In some way they will speak negative about it. It is foolish and frankly annoying. THAT is why I respond at times as if I am sensitve.
So then you can understand why I responded to the M1 claim, right? My response is based on the same defence mechanism as your own. Nobody likes to see a product they've used extensively and for a very long time talked down, particularly in the vague and often aloof fashion that is quite common on here.
Quote:
In this thread in particular all people needed to do was simply pick - RP or M1 and leave it at that.
Threads never go that way on here, you know that
Quote:
If a certain spec is needed for say warranty that RP does not cover fine say that and leave it at that. If M1 is actually certified to the spec and we don't know about RP that doesn't mean RP doesn't or can't meet the spec either. It just means their oil was not tested but people will try and say because MI has the cert that makes it better which we all know, in truth, is a bogus statement.
Not necessarily. While some of the certs and approvals may not be all that meaningful, I think with some of the high-end certs and approvals (again, see M1 0w40), you ARE being given a guarantee of performance.
Quote:
If you have used one or the other in the specific vehicle( there was one mentioned in the original post right? )say I used RP or M1 and it did good or bad in the application. Basically speak to the question and leave out the brand bashing.
Instead it gets turned into M1 is the best ever and is used FF and in race teams, and it carries every spec cert under the sun as if that makes it the actual best oil, while RP is just some backwoods company who buys premade ingredients for their oils and just mixes it all together and bottles it. You personally made it sound like RP is the housewife who bought bottled sauce and tried to pass it off as homemade. That is just untrue. The constant RP bashing on this site just gets old. I know M1 gets it's share of bashing too so I believe the M1 fans know what I mean. If they do they should try and not do it with RP.
Yes, I DO know what you mean, and I'm sorry you took what I stated in the manner in which you did. That was NOT my intent. I was validating XOM's capabilities by demonstrating their manufacturer relationships, that is not the same thing as tearing down RP, even if it ended up being viewed in that way.
Quote:
Bottom line is stick to the topic and leave out the rants and rhetoric. If you don't use a product or know how it is made don't speculate and stir up a hornets nest and then whine when people call you out.
I am done with this and I hope you can be as well. Let the thread go back to the actual topic.
But this kinda is the topic
Either oil is going to work just fine in this application. But that's been stated a gazillion times at this point.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
We just tore down a 6.0 gas GMC motor and it is nearly sparkling internally after over 250k miles of severe service! This is buying whatever is on sale in the correct grade.
This is the best statement made in this thread. To compare racing engines or even claim tear downs of engines mean jack. There are a million things plus that could make different wearing of parts. Point is, either or is more than capable oil. I think people play way too much into their loyalty towards brands. I have seen many racing motorcycle engines broken down that rev a lot higher than a car, and I can say I have seen good and bad from both high end to low end oils used.
We just tore down a 6.0 gas GMC motor and it is nearly sparkling internally after over 250k miles of severe service! This is buying whatever is on sale in the correct grade.
This is the best statement made in this thread. To compare racing engines or even claim tear downs of engines mean jack. There are a million things plus that could make different wearing of parts. Point is, either or is more than capable oil. I think people play way too much into their loyalty towards brands. I have seen many racing motorcycle engines broken down that rev a lot higher than a car, and I can say I have seen good and bad from both high end to low end oils used.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
NHHEMI said:
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