Mobil 1 0W30 8k Miles - 2004 Volvo S60

[Devo242]

Second post here at BITOG, second UOA. I posted the follow up UOA to this sample from my next change with Red Line 5W30 here.

Some notes:
* Sump capacity is 6 quarts
* Engine is a normally aspirated 2.4 liter 5 cylinder
* Oil Filter - Volvo OEM (Mahle)
* Oil was changed when sample was taken, it was in service for appx 5 months

Blackstone: You’re looking for issues with this engine and we're glad to say we don't see anything out of line
here. Metals are all low and compare well to universal averages, which is good news considering this oil
saw a longer run (by more than 3,000 miles) than average. There was no measurable fuel, water, coolant,
or excessive dirt present, and the TBN of 2.2 shows some active additive left for a longer oil run, if you so
desire. It looks like you've been taking good care of this engine -- nice report at 115,836 total miles.

Code:


OIL Mobil 1 0w30 AFE

MILES IN USE 7,939

MILES 115,836

MAKE UP OIL 1 QT

SAMPLE TAKEN 04/28/12



ALUMINUM 3

CHROMIUM 0

IRON 10

COPPER 1

LEAD 0

TIN 0

MOLYBDENUM 56

NICKEL 0

MANGANESE 0

SILVER 0

TITANIUM 0

POTASSIUM 0

BORON 34

SILICON 3

SODIUM 5

CALCIUM 1084

MAGNESIUM 634

PHOSPHORUS 570

ZINC 803

BARIUM 0



INSOLUBLES 0.3

WATER 0

FUEL
ANTIFREEZE 0

INSOLUBLES 0.3

FLASHPOINT ºF 390

SUS VIS 210ºF 57.4

cSt @ 212ºF 9.48

TBN 2.2


Questions and comments welcome.

Thanks,
Shawn

 

[bigjl]

I think I would stick with Mobil after your current full of Redline is changed.

What is interesting is that spec of oil is left in for 18k in Europe, with no change for Severe Service.

 

[Devo242]

I seemed to have botched the link to my next UOA with the Red Line 5W30, so here it is.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...;gonew=1#UNREAD

Originally Posted By: bigjl
I think I would stick with Mobil after your current full of Redline is changed.

What is interesting is that spec of oil is left in for 18k in Europe, with no change for Severe Service.


From what I have read here at BITOG, Red Line seems to need a few changes to get 'settled in' regarding UOA numbers. Whether there is any merit to this I do not know. I was disappointed with the TBN in the Red Line UOA but wear numbers seem to belie this. I have Red Line 5W30 in the sump now so I will send off for a UOA when I perform my next service.

One thing I did like very much about the Red Line is the slight increase in economy I saw in comparison to the M1 0W30. I averaged appx 28.9 MPG on the Redline 5W30 versus the 28.5 MPG I saw with the M1. The engine is also quieter at idle, which means nothing of course but wanted to mention.

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Originally Posted By: bigjl
I think I would stick with Mobil after your current full of Redline is changed.

What is interesting is that spec of oil is left in for 18k in Europe, with no change for Severe Service.


The Mobil 1 0w30 surely would not make even 15K with a 2.2 tbn at 8K! Interesting indeed! Can Anyone in Europe or anyone in the Know elaborate on this?

 

[Cardenio327]

Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
Can Anyone in Europe or anyone in the Know elaborate on this?


I'm not in Europe or in the Know , but we deal with the same phenomenon in Mexico. It has to do with the sulfur content in the fuel. The maximum in Europe is 10 ppm while the maximum in the U.S. is 30 ppm I believe. The sulfur content is higher still here in Mexico. The combustion process converts some of the sulfur to sulfuric acid, which is what depletes the TBN. Maybe using a top tier gasoline would help? It might not have the maximum amount of sulfur compared to cheaper brands. The 92 octane here supposedly has 88% less sulfur than the 87 octane does here.

 

[bigjl]

That is what I have been told aswell.

I keep forgetting that the US has higher sulphur content than Europe!

I keep in mind what XOM have apparently commented, that TBN isn't the only thing in the equation.

I never use cheap fuel anyway, possibly more important with the relatively highly tuned turbo diesels common in Europe.

But I have noticed that some low saps long drain oils in the UK only have a starting TBN of 5.5!

But they pass all the Mercedes and VAG specs for extended OCI.

I wonder if Volvo has different service intervals in the US than mentioned in my handbook from 2008. As it basically lists Europe, Belgium and Rest of the World.

But with very high quality oils.

I have been looking at Redline and Amsoil but the cost is prohibitive in the UK as you can really only get them from specialists like Opieoils.

And this isn't the first time I have heard they don't last as well as other oils of similar price and quality.

 

[Sam_Julier]

Originally Posted By: Devo242
I seemed to have botched the link to my next UOA with the Red Line 5W30, so here it is.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...;gonew=1#UNREAD

Originally Posted By: bigjl
I think I would stick with Mobil after your current full of Redline is changed.

What is interesting is that spec of oil is left in for 18k in Europe, with no change for Severe Service.


From what I have read here at BITOG, Red Line seems to need a few changes to get 'settled in' regarding UOA numbers. Whether there is any merit to this I do not know. I was disappointed with the TBN in the Red Line UOA but wear numbers seem to belie this. I have Red Line 5W30 in the sump now so I will send off for a UOA when I perform my next service.

One thing I did like very much about the Red Line is the slight increase in economy I saw in comparison to the M1 0W30. I averaged appx 28.9 MPG on the Redline 5W30 versus the 28.5 MPG I saw with the M1. The engine is also quieter at idle, which means nothing of course but wanted to mention.


Thanks for posting. My experience with Redline in the Volvo 2.4L NA engine:
1. TBN drops quickly but the TAN is fine (4.7 in the last UOA at 6800 miles).
2. The engine is remarkably quiet at idle. I have no idea if this is important.
3. Fuel economy increased by about 1.5 mpg from the dealer bulk OC's.

After my RL stash is gone I'll use any 0W-30 that meets the most current/stringent Volvo spec. The spec is met by M1 0W30 AFE ($32 at WM), half the price of of Redline ($60 at Carquest).

The importance of meeting the Volvo spec was well made in this post:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...015#Post2695015

 

[volk06]

Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
Originally Posted By: bigjl
I think I would stick with Mobil after your current full of Redline is changed.

What is interesting is that spec of oil is left in for 18k in Europe, with no change for Severe Service.


The Mobil 1 0w30 surely would not make even 15K with a 2.2 tbn at 8K! Interesting indeed! Can Anyone in Europe or anyone in the Know elaborate on this?


TBN retention is not linear. SN Mobil 1 gets to a tbn of around 2 and stays there for a loooong time.

 

[Hokiefyd]

It also may be possible that the 0W-30 Mobil 1 available in Europe may not be the same 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy oil that ExxonMobil markets in the United States. For example, the 5W-30 ESP oil in Europe has a very different (heavier) formulation than either the regular 5W-30 or even the 5W-30 EP here in the US.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
It also may be possible that the 0W-30 Mobil 1 available in Europe may not be the same 0W-30 Advanced Fuel Economy oil that ExxonMobil markets in the United States. For example, the 5W-30 ESP oil in Europe has a very different (heavier) formulation than either the regular 5W-30 or even the 5W-30 EP here in the US.


We have the ESP here too, you just can't get it at Walmart.

 

[A_Harman]

Why not try Redline 0w30?

 

[gpshumway]

I've been following your Redline UOAs because there are few using it and I'm interested how it holds up in various applications. I hear you on idle smoothness and responsiveness. Redline 5w30 in my WRX is as good on that front at 5,000 miles as RT6 is fresh, and much better than GC.

Much as I like Redline products for turbo and quasi-racing applications, it seems to me that M1 0w30 is the better choice for this engine. The wear metals are as low as can be expected, the TBN retention is good, and it stays in grade.

Volvo's N/A 5cyl just doesn't seem to benefit from the heat resistance, shear stability and high HTHS viscosity of Redline. Redline is not a long drain oil, so unless your engine benefits from its unique properties, there is little reason to pay the premium for it. Quiet operation seems the only reason in this engine.

Given how well M1 0w30 worked in this engine, I would argue that Redline 5w30 is too thick. Redline 0w30, or 5w20 are probably better choices within the Redline product range. Redline 5w30 has an HTHS viscosity of 3.8 cSt, the same as M1 0w40. Redline 5w20 has HTHS of 3.3 cSt and the 0w30 is 3.2 cSt, both higher than M1 0w30, and the Redline is much more shear stable.

Thanks for sharing your uoas, keep them coming.

 

[buster]

^+1

 

[Sam_Julier]

^ +1