Michelin CrossClimate2 Tires

[edyvw]

Cool story.

For those who don't own it, it actually is.

 

[Ws6]

For those who don't own it, it actually is.

You drive an old sedan and a minivan. Get over it.

 

[edyvw]

Yup different days. Same road. If you've done braking tests with Dragy, you know the slope can be like that. Subjectively, having driven them, they feel like the CC2s hook and stop better. The Hankooks were abysmal. The psas4 was good, just not quite as good as CC2.

You don't understand the fundamentals of tires that emphasize snow/ice performance.
They are softer. They need less heat. We used snow tires in summer for drag races. That is where initial bite comes from. They bite more aggressively.
The problem is that tires with better ice performance give up on wet performance. CC2 is an all-weather tire that compromises a lot of performance aspects to gain something else. It should be decent in snow and somewhat decent (at least better than AS tires) in ice. That means giving up on wet performance.
Tire Rack, or "my internet," results confirm that.

 

[edyvw]

You drive an old sedan and a minivan. Get over it.

Of course. I generally prefer to drive vehicles instead of hair dryers.

 

[Ws6]

You don't understand the fundamentals of tires that emphasize snow/ice performance.
They are softer. They need less heat. We used snow tires in summer for drag races. That is where initial bite comes from. They bite more aggressively.
The problem is that tires with better ice performance give up on wet performance. CC2 is an all-weather tire that compromises a lot of performance aspects to gain something else. It should be decent in snow and somewhat decent (at least better than AS tires) in ice. That means giving up on wet performance.
Tire Rack, or "my internet," results confirm that.

All I can tell you is my 60' and 0-60 times in the rain are great with CC2s even compared to my psas4s. Multuple runs and surfaces. Data is what it is.

 

[edyvw]

All I can tell you is my 60' and 0-60 times in the rain are great with CC2s even compared to my psas4s. Multuple runs and surfaces. Data is what it is.

The only thing I provided here (to others, so they can see, not you, that is a fool's errand) is data from the most respectable tire testing house in the US.
But, you are more than welcome to challenge them.

 

[Ws6]

The only thing I provided here (to others, so they can see, not you, that is a fool's errand) is data from the most respectable tire testing house in the US.
But, you are more than welcome to challenge them.

All I can do is share that I get equal traction accel/decel dry or wet on CC2 as PSAS4. Lateral may well differ.

 

[edyvw]

All I can do is share that I get equal traction accel/decel dry or wet on CC2 as PSAS4. Lateral may well differ.

I shared it too. The results speak for themselves, and they are what one who understands this subject would expect. There is nothing there that says CC2 is a bad tire; on the contrary. But it is a Grand Touring tire. It performs well for what it is made.

 

[Ws6]

I shared it too. The results speak for themselves, and they are what one who understands this subject would expect. There is nothing there that says CC2 is a bad tire; on the contrary. But it is a Grand Touring tire. It performs well for what it is made.

Yeah, handling is perfectly competent but not as sharp as my PSAS4s, but it hooks just as hard dry or wet, accel or decel. Its obvious its a GT tire, but the traction just is what it is. Ive measured it multiple times. When a website can race me, lemme know. I used to believe everything I read from reputable sources aas 100% applicable. Its not.

 

[edyvw]

Yeah, handling is perfectly competent but not as sharp as my PSAS4s, but it hooks just as hard dry or wet, accel or decel. Its obvious its a GT tire, but the traction just is what it is. Ive measured it multiple times. When a website can race me, lemme know. I used to believe everything I read from reputable sources aas 100% applicable. Its not.

Again, you can challenge their results. Go public and explain your methodology.
Until then, they stop 21ft longer than PS4AS.

 

[KevinMalone]

All I can do is share that I get equal traction accel/decel dry or wet on CC2 as PSAS4. Lateral may well differ.

Very interesting. Tyre Reviews did a comparison with results consistent with Tire Rack...

 

[Ws6]

Again, you can challenge their results. Go public and explain your methodology.
Until then, they stop 21ft longer than PS4AS.

I live in the real world. I dont care what they observed. I care what actually affects me.

 

[Vercingetorix]

Don’t let the facts get in the way of a good story.

 

[Ws6]

Very interesting. Tyre Reviews did a comparison with results consistent with Tire Rack...

View attachment 208565

Laterally, I bet they do perform better and that will show up on lap times for sure. All I can show is my results.
Also,
Tyre reviews tested the Euro tire. Different compounds.

 

[Ws6]

Don’t let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Facts to me are timeslips in my car. Not something someone read about.

 

[4WD]

Again, you can challenge their results. Go public and explain your methodology.
Until then, they stop 21ft longer than PS4AS.

… an amazing spread on the chart - enough to change consequences.

 

[edyvw]

Facts to me are timeslips in my car. Not something someone read about.

So, the person goes to doctor and doctor says: you have stage 3 cancer, and person is: "fact is, I feel fine, never better." That sums up your understanding of your "facts."

 

[Ws6]

So, the person goes to doctor and doctor says: you have stage 3 cancer, and person is: "fact is, I feel fine, never better." That sums up your understanding of your "facts."

No, its more like the doctor telling me my twin brother has cancer, so even though my PET scan is negative, Ive got to have cancer too.

 

[KevinMalone]

Facts to me are timeslips in my car. Not something someone read about.

Maybe Michelin accidentally shipped you a Crossclimate 3 prototype

 

[Ws6]

Maybe Michelin accidentally shipped you a Crossclimate 3 prototype

Nah. Dry braking takes a hit compared to psas4.