Loosers on the loose

Pew

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1,363
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Illinois
They polled within inner-city limits, where EVs would make the most sense because of the population density, price of gasoline and lack of gas stations, and better public transportation versus suburban/rural areas. Push it outside the city limits and it'll be a whole new ball game.
Originally Posted by Cujet
Three things need to be fixed. 1) Price 2) Range 3) Charge time Real world highway range at various speeds. I must admit that while 80mph is the top category, traffic often moves faster than that on major interstates. NOTE: EV quoted range IS NOT highway range. NOTE 2: look at what 30 minutes at the supercharger gets you. https://twitter.com/TroyTeslike/status/1038920763955396608 My typical West Palm Beach to Jacksonville, FL round trip is 600 miles, plus local driving. None of the Tesla cars can make it one way. Nor is there a charger near the hotels I use. I just don't have the time to deal with that.
[censored], if those 200-300 mile range numbers are true, then that's just straight garbage, not including recharge time. I wouldn't even be able to make it to some national parks from the closest charge center.
 
Originally Posted by Astro14
What do you propose to create hydrogen as fuel? It takes a ton of electricity to get hydrogen from hydrolysis... and right now, most hydrogen comes from steam reformation of natural gas.
It's been awhile since I've perused the alternative methods of H2 generation, but weren't they using the multi-mirror concentrators to generate steam, which was then used to run a turbine genset, which then used the electricity for hydrolysis? One thing I've said for a while, which I still can't understand why it hasn't caught on for the EV craze- take a small, highly efficient diesel engine (like a 3-cyl Kohler 44HP turbo) paired to a genset that can charge the batteries and/or provide enough motive current to power the electric drives. When there is sufficient battery storage, run on battery power. When battery capacity drops below a certain point, kick on the diesel ONLY AS A GENERATOR to charge the batteries, and keep it at a constant RPM at peak BSFC and heavily loaded, so you get the maximum benefit for the amount of fuel used. This way, even if the batteries are completely dead, the diesel can still be run. Even with only a 5 gallon tank, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to achieve a 600+ mile range on batteries and diesel electricity.... to me, this is the only real way to sate Americans' want of cars they can just get in and drive wherever. This would also allow shrinking of the battery packs, cutting down on raw battery materials and saving weight. Every PHEV so far has used a gasoline engine as a backup motive source, instead of solely generating electricity. With a constant load on the genset and hence a constant recharge rate, battery lifetime should also be extended because it would be extremely easy to program the optimum charge/discharge cycle plans into the computer on when to run the diesel. But hey, what do I know, I'm just a stupid consumer that likes hydrocarbons.
 
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...
Subie, I think we are starting to see a change in that model. Mazda and Toyota are working on that arrangement using a small rotary engine to run the generator. Mitsubishi just showed a new crossover at the recent Tokyo Auto Salon that used a turbine. So some manufacturers are thinking outside the box.
 
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916
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Hollister, CA
Originally Posted by Cujet
Three things need to be fixed. 1) Price 2) Range 3) Charge time
You forgot one - the cost of electricity and the supply that will be needed. Out here in Northern Kali the price of electricity will cost more for 10kwh then the price of one gallon of gas which will get you roughly the same amount of distance traveled. The only reason I still have an EV is because I have solar.
 
Originally Posted by WylieCoyote
I'm happy for the multitudes of people who can justify that in their own minds, or even more so, the $100K price tag on a Model S.
A majority of those people didn't justify these purchases in their own minds, they justified them with dollars from other taxpayers' wallets in the form of subsidies and incentives... again proving that without artificial, illegitimate support, there is no real market support for EVs outside of inner cities, which would probably be better served by public transport options anyways. That's not even bringing up the fact that we are spoonfed the pipe dream that all these EV batteries supposedly are produced without consuming any electricity, raw materials, or the fact that battery material is toxic to just about every living thing. At least plants can use the CO from hydrocarbon fuels....
 

Pew

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1,363
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Illinois
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
One thing I've said for a while, which I still can't understand why it hasn't caught on for the EV craze- take a small, highly efficient diesel engine (like a 3-cyl Kohler 44HP turbo) paired to a genset that can charge the batteries and/or provide enough motive current to power the electric drives. When there is sufficient battery storage, run on battery power. When battery capacity drops below a certain point, kick on the diesel ONLY AS A GENERATOR to charge the batteries, and keep it at a constant RPM at peak BSFC and heavily loaded, so you get the maximum benefit for the amount of fuel used. This way, even if the batteries are completely dead, the diesel can still be run. Even with only a 5 gallon tank, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to achieve a 600+ mile range on batteries and diesel electricity.... to me, this is the only real way to sate Americans' want of cars they can just get in and drive wherever.
I've wondered that too. It works well on locomotives, albeit with a different purpose, but it still works well. I wonder what the costs affiliated with that would be or would it be okay to assume ownership costs wouldn't be more than today's hybrids?
 
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D/FW Metroplex
Originally Posted by MaximaGuy
Originally Posted by Rolla07
You dont think EVs get handouts?! Lol
Yes they do both Federal and State breaks. But the point I am making is in many forms ICE over the years have gotten handouts and it isn't working right. Big3 have junked cars (Chrysler makes muscle cars no one wants ) and jumped into bigger truck/SUVs gathering more attention towards emission levels
I'm curious how you came to believe that is even remotely true. Do you have some articles, reports, or anything at all really that you can cite to support your assertion that no one wants FCA's LX/LC cars? Please link them here if you do, as I would love to read thru them to see things from your perspective...because as it looks now, you are just making statements without regard for accuracy or facts, and reading through that kind of a post is ultimately a big waste of everyone's time, and I'm sure we'd all like to avoid such time-sinks in the future. Regards, Nuke
 
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Wisconsin
Originally Posted by Rolla07
Originally Posted by MaximaGuy
there would be an eventual ban ICE or de- incentivized against alternatives (they have already banned small diesels and 3 stroke engines). We better get ready for another bailout.
You dont think EVs get handouts?! Lol
Yeah, you get a handout to buy a more expensive car paying more sales tax out of the rebate then get to pay 4x more title and registration , How is that a handout? one hand gives the other takes it back. In my state fewer pure BEVs are selling due to taxes, if a car is only as useful as a moped it should pay the same $25 biannually a moped pays for plates.
Originally Posted by Cujet
Three things need to be fixed. 1) Price 2) Range 3) Charge time Nor is there a charger near the hotels I use. I just don't have the time to deal with that.
Your in luck, the $3500 used Chevy Volt solves all 3 of your problems and it's an infinitely more satisfying ride than a Prius.
 
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5,702
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Atlanta,GA
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
One thing I've said for a while, which I still can't understand why it hasn't caught on for the EV craze- take a small, highly efficient diesel engine (like a 3-cyl Kohler 44HP turbo) paired to a genset that can charge the batteries and/or provide enough motive current to power the electric drives. When there is sufficient battery storage, run on battery power. When battery capacity drops below a certain point, kick on the diesel ONLY AS A GENERATOR to charge the batteries, and keep it at a constant RPM at peak BSFC and heavily loaded, so you get the maximum benefit for the amount of fuel used. This way, even if the batteries are completely dead, the diesel can still be run. Even with only a 5 gallon tank, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to achieve a 600+ mile range on batteries and diesel electricity.... to me, this is the only real way to sate Americans' want of cars they can just get in and drive wherever.
The BMW i3 (2013 - Present) contains a motorcycle engine which acts as a APU to extend the range of the vehicle. BMW toyed with a 3-cylinder diesel in the i8 (hybrid set up instead of APU) and allegedly* couldn't get it emissions compliant. *I suspect customer focus groups revealed that owners of these cars would balk at filling with diesel.
 
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3,897
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Canada
Originally Posted by Cujet
I just don't have the time to deal with that.
thankyou #1 reason why electric cannot become more mainstream.
 
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304
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Midwest
Originally Posted by Pew
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
One thing I've said for a while, which I still can't understand why it hasn't caught on for the EV craze- take a small, highly efficient diesel engine (like a 3-cyl Kohler 44HP turbo) paired to a genset that can charge the batteries and/or provide enough motive current to power the electric drives. When there is sufficient battery storage, run on battery power. When battery capacity drops below a certain point, kick on the diesel ONLY AS A GENERATOR to charge the batteries, and keep it at a constant RPM at peak BSFC and heavily loaded, so you get the maximum benefit for the amount of fuel used. This way, even if the batteries are completely dead, the diesel can still be run. Even with only a 5 gallon tank, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to achieve a 600+ mile range on batteries and diesel electricity.... to me, this is the only real way to sate Americans' want of cars they can just get in and drive wherever.
I've wondered that too. It works well on locomotives, albeit with a different purpose, but it still works well. I wonder what the costs affiliated with that would be or would it be okay to assume ownership costs wouldn't be more than today's hybrids?
Other than diesel vs gas, what's different about your musings and the Chevy Volt?
 

M56959

Staff member
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AZ, USA
Please keep discussion technical. Political commentary and more profanity will get this locked or removed.
 
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Florida
It's all there, black and white, clear as crystal! You stole fizzy lifting drinks! You bumped into the ceiling which now has to be washed and sterilized, so you get nothing! You lose! You Lose!
 
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Not here
The biggest hurdle I see is only after they get to the 300 mile range. Charging station infrastructure.near as I can tell there is a 48 amp station and a 72 amp. The vast majority of home service ampacity is 200 or 225 amp. Even after you would pay a very large price tag to have a charging station installed at your home most would want 2. Now the service at your house is not big enough because there would be no load diversity. Your power bill would be crazy high because your demand charges would be crazy. Now look at this from your power companies perspective. Each house with 2 charging stations would potentially double or triple their demand. Massive upgrades would need to be made system wide. How would apartment complex's handle this? Motels? It's not going to be free and the infrastructure costs would be huge.
 
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14,668
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The Old North State
Originally Posted by JeffKeryk
I got stuck on "Loosers on the loose". Pretty sure I don't get the premise of the post.
Then you must be a "Looser" j/k. laugh Don't feel alone, I'm still stuck on topic title. crazy
 
Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
The BMW i3 (2013 - Present) contains a motorcycle engine which acts as a APU to extend the range of the vehicle. BMW toyed with a 3-cylinder diesel in the i8 (hybrid set up instead of APU) and allegedly* couldn't get it emissions compliant. *I suspect customer focus groups revealed that owners of these cars would balk at filling with diesel.
To me, using a gas engine of any sort to run the genset is not optimizing the setup. A small diesel run at a constant rate is going to be more efficient than a gas engine of the same output simply based on the fact that diesel contains more energy. Considering it would always run at a constant speed, you would be able to design everything from top to bottom to make it as efficient as possible; high compression ratio, turbo optimized for a very narrow operating window for max airflow at minimum boost would likely eliminate the need for an intercooler and its associated piping, ceramic coatings for heat control and friction reduction, etc etc etc. EVs first appeared sometime around 1896 from what I've seen... and in 120 years haven't made enough sense on their own to firmly establish themselves without huge subsidies. They're not "clean" like proponents profess when you follow the entire energy lifecycle... and simply kick the consumption can down the road to the power companies. Since we already have power grid issues, can we really hope to support millions of additional EVs on the current grid? No way. All it's going to do is drive up electric bills for everyone, even those that don't own EVs.
 
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6,494
Location
Connecticut
I like the idea of an electric car, and I do applaud Tesla for their efforts. I still think we have a ways to go before they become a viable option as an only vehicle for many people due to the infrastructure and range issues. The banning of ICE vehicles is just moronic. Do they think that people who live in the city are the only ones who drive there? What happens when people who live outside the city but own ICE cars want to work in or visit the city? Also, I'm definitely sure the entire population who lives in the city can immediately go out and buy an electric car or can transition to having no car at all. crazy
 
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