Leave factory fill in? No Thanks

[StevieC]

I've always dumped early and frequently within the 3 changes before running factory intervals.

I can't prove it has a benefit but I also have never had any failures and always get long lives out of my vehicles so I keep doing it. It's cheap anyway.

 

[Trav]

The particles probably have not gone through the pressure lubrication system just down the drains and bores back into the pan, the particles in the filter have gone through the oil pump though.

 

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by Jimmy_Russells
Here's the thing I don't understand:

I see there's some metal in the filter in the original post, that's obvious. But, the metal has already travelled through the engine and been captured by the filter. Any damage it would do has already been done, and it's not going back into the engine. Even if you change the oil now, any new metal particles that are created are going to also travel through the engine and get caught by the filter, again. I don't believe draining the original oil is going to have literal chunks of metal debris flowing out with it. If the oil does have remaining micron level suspended metal particles (no doubt it does) that are small enough to travel through the filter, they're not going to be large enough to cause any damage.

Of course anything large enough will be immediately taken out and will never be recirculated unless there's a tear in the filter or a bypass event. I don't necessarily buy it, but the supposed rationale is that metal particles that don't get filtered out still have an affect on wear, and the additional rationale would be that it would be beneficial to limit the amount of these particles by dumping the oil early.

A lot of marketing of bypass filters is that particles as small as 2 micron can cause damage, and that getting those particles slowly filtered out can nearly eliminate one source of wear.

I did a few early UOAs on the last new car I bought. Of course the filter will trap anything large enough, so large shavings wouldn't typically show up in an UOA unless they settle at the bottom of the pan and end up in the oil sample. The aluminum levels were actually pretty normal. There was elevated iron and copper, which is probably from cam break-in. However, these particles were likely recirculating in the oil, and depending on who you ask that could mean elevated wear compared to getting rid of that as soon as possible.

I remember the talk about 3000 mile oil changes was primarily a suggestion that additional wear occurs because the oil is dirty, as opposed to loss of viscosity and depletion of additives. So I suppose the claim is that during break-in it gets exceptionally dirty due to elevated metals, so it would be good to eliminate as much of that as possible.

 

[CKN]

Just had my first free oil change at the dealer on my 2018 Silverado, that I purchased new 7 months ago. The millage read 6,600 at 11% left as indicated by the OLM.

I never change out the factory fill early. I have never had a motor blow up either.

The dealer return sticker indicated come back at 5,000 miles. It's one more free oil change.

They use the ACDelco Semi Synthetic 5w/20 (8 quarts capacity)

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Digital Computer age?

A lot of cheap cars are net built and have tolerances all over the place using slipper skirt pistons and long stroke.
Like the Cheap Nissan Versa I owned. And few have had multiple engines let go on this forum in a couple years.
Thinner alloy blocks are prone to distortion.
Next you spec in 20 grade oil and have wider plain bearings with under 1 mil radial running clearances.
Then you design the engine with a variable capacity oil pump to reduce parasitic loss.
The you spec an oil filter the size of a fuel filter on a riding mower.
Then the sump is under a gallon.
Then add VVT and DOHC 4V and make a smogged 80 HP per litre.

Then you want to go over 10K km on the factory oil.

These parts ( crank and block) have to be cleaned after machining. Recall the Subaru Turbo fiasco with metal turning chips in the crank oil bores? Lost a few motors there.

I dont really care since I dont own it, but I will ask VW to change my oil on my new jetta at 3000miles. I have to get the front end alignment checked anyhow. I want the Thing to perform well in the 2 years I own it.

Will an early change help? is 3k miles too late? This thing make 3 liter BMW torque out of a 1.4L turbo 4 banger. 20 grade oil too.

 

[Triple_Se7en]

Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Digital Computer age?


The Digital Computer Age began with that clock at the bottom-right of your desktop taskbar, components earlier transplanted into a digital processor hooked up to that monitor. Then someone put in the calendar dates. Then Daylight Savings Time was added. Did your first computer show a windup clock?

 

[PimTac]

Originally Posted by ARCOgraphite
Digital Computer age?

A lot of cheap cars are net built and have tolerances all over the place using slipper skirt pistons and long stroke.
Like the Cheap Nissan Versa I owned. And few have had multiple engines let go on this forum in a couple years.
Thinner alloy blocks are prone to distortion.
Next you spec in 20 grade oil and have wider plain bearings with under 1 mil radial running clearances.
Then you design the engine with a variable capacity oil pump to reduce parasitic loss.
The you spec an oil filter the size of a fuel filter on a riding mower.
Then the sump is under a gallon.
Then add VVT and DOHC 4V and make a smogged 80 HP per litre.

Then you want to go over 10K km on the factory oil.

These parts ( crank and block) have to be cleaned after machining. Recall the Subaru Turbo fiasco with metal turning chips in the crank oil bores? Lost a few motors there.

I dont really care since I dont own it, but I will ask VW to change my oil on my new jetta at 3000miles. I have to get the front end alignment checked anyhow. I want the Thing to perform well in the 2 years I own it.

Will an early change help? is 3k miles too late? This thing make 3 liter BMW torque out of a 1.4L turbo 4 banger. 20 grade oil too.







Computers have improved over the decades. My 1985 Ford Ranger had one and I went through four of those units before I fired that truck. I was much more patient in those days.