Larger Luxury Sedans

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: yesthatsteve
CTS-v was one I'd noticed missing, as well.

Not sure I'd call the CTS-V "larger" though, which is what the OP is looking for.


The CTS is actually a small car...IIRC, it's officially "midsize". The others mentioned are all, IIRC, full-size cars. (I know a 300 is.)

 

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted By: itguy08
Originally Posted By: MCompact

If I was shopping domestic I'd go with the SRT8 Charger(the 300 styling does nothing for me)


Why? It gets abysmal fuel economy - you get to pay a gas guzzler tax on it. It's on par with a Mustang or Camaro ( and no gas guzzler on those ) at 0-60 and trails in handling.

Like I said, I'd really check out the SHO or MKS. 0-60 in the mid 5 seconds, AWD, proven powertrain, great interior and 26 MPG. They soak up the miles like crazy. You have to leave your brand snobbery at the door although if you are considering Crysler that should not be an issue.

Other than that the Infinits are solid choices. Reliable and sporty.


Quite simple: the SRT8 Charger and 300 are rocketships. They run with cars twice their prices.

 

[cchase]

How many kilowatts does the Tesla require to go from fully dead to fully charged?

 

[itguy08]

Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle

Quite simple: the SRT8 Charger and 300 are rocketships. They run with cars twice their prices.


I don't think the Mustang and Camaro are twice the price. And both are as fast as or faster than the SRT8 vehicles. Both offer better fuel economy and a cheaper purchase price. Although they will not seat 4 like the 300. I believe even the Corvette is not $90k at a level that will embarrass the 300.

 

[hattaresguy]

Originally Posted By: Spazdog
How unfortunate that no one has suggested a full-size Cadillac or Lincoln.

The times have changed.

No MKS. No XTS.

The MKS just looks weird to me. I'm sure the AWD model compares well with some Audis and to the best of my knowledge, the Acura RLX AWD/AWS has not made it here yet so bonus for the Lincoln. I just can't get past that weird styling.

I also don't see why anyone would pick the XTS over the current LaCrosse. You can get a loaded out AWD LaCrosse for a couple thousand or so less than the FWD standard XTS.


No American company makes a large sedan that competes in that class anymore. Cadillac probably will again at some point.

Don't forget about the Porsche Panamera either, ugly as sing but a blast to drive.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Quite simple: the SRT8 Charger and 300 are rocketships. They run with cars twice their prices.

...In a straight line. Which is hardly the main criterion for someone looking at cars like the OP.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: cchase
How many kilowatts does the Tesla require to go from fully dead to fully charged?

60 kWh or 85 kWh, depending on what you order.

 

[hattaresguy]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: andyd
I would get either a Town Car or a Grand Marquise. Less gadgetry to replace.

As eminently trustworthy and endearing as those cars are, they ride and drive like ox carts compared to the other cars listed here.


Anyone claiming that has never ridden in a Town Car. It really is that simple.

Except me, evidently. It's rarely safe to make assumptions about people you've never met.

Dynamically, the Town Car is competitive with modern luxury cars in exactly one respect: It soaks up bumps reasonably well. Unfortunately, it still jiggles over some bumps because of its live rear axle, and it still permits a lot of excess body motion. Modern luxury cars can match or beat the Town Car's ride compliance while handling WAY better.

Steering in the Town Car is overboosted, slow, vague, and numb. That, combined with the excess body motion and preposterously unsupportive seats, makes the car hard to place on the road. Even the softest modern luxury cars (thinking of Mercedes and Lexus here) do a better job here. This is important because luxury is about feeling at ease, and it's hard to feel at ease when you have no idea what the car is about to do next.

All Panther platform cars make very poor use of their huge footprints. They have HUGE trunks, but their interior dimensions are nothing special for a car of that size. Other luxury cars have much roomier and more usable interiors.

In terms of speed, the Town Car is nowhere on the map. Modern luxury cars can easily outrun it with fewer cylinders and better fuel economy.

Sorry, but the Panther Platform was outdated 20 years ago. It has a body-on-frame chassis with a live rear axle and an engine that wasn't particularly advanced in the early 90s. It's desirable because it's cheap, it's reliable, and it has character -- not because it actually stands up to modern cars in any measurable way.


Couldn't agree more, the panther platform is good for limo companies because they are cheap to fix and run forever.

But compared to a modern $100k full size sedan? They are not even in the same league as say an Audi S8 or a Mercedes S550. They don't have anywhere near the technology to keep up.

Different worlds.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Originally Posted By: itguy08
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle

Quite simple: the SRT8 Charger and 300 are rocketships. They run with cars twice their prices.


I don't think the Mustang and Camaro are twice the price. And both are as fast as or faster than the SRT8 vehicles. Both offer better fuel economy and a cheaper purchase price. Although they will not seat 4 like the 300. I believe even the Corvette is not $90k at a level that will embarrass the 300.


Comparing a full-sized sedan (and it is: the Charger is a BIG car) to a ponycar or a 2-seater is, to be charitable, ridiculous. Why not compare a Chevy Silverado to a Miata...it would make just as much sense!

 

[dohnuts]

A partner at my firm has the Tesla. It is a fantastic vehicle, truly a "game changing" vehicle. Ridiculous instant torque, no shift shock at all, compared with other great luxury cars where you can feel a "slight" shock. I would probably consider it, but would be more interested in future generations.

If it were my money, and I'm not in the market for a near six-figure luxury sedan (though I wouldn't mind if I were) I'd narrow it down as follows:

Mercedes Benz S-Class, current (deal on existing inventory or CPO) or next generation, which I guess by looking at the preview info online could be even better. I've driven a current model S550. An amazing car in every way.

Porsche Panamera. Truly a Porsche sports sedan, but the exterior is...an acquired taste. A deal breaker is that it's only a four passenger ride, and I think for a large luxo-barge, to truly spread out the center rear seat would be the way to go.

Or, a Lexus LS, probably CPO. It is bland by comparison, but still very solid, reliable as the sun rising in the morning. Gives you about the same level of luxury, very comfortable.

Ah, and this is where my frugal roots betray me. My money? I'm good with a Toyota Avalon. Comfortable highway ride, and I have 50-60k to spend elsewhere. But then, I'm a cheap [censored]. If I had the money, those three above would be my finalists for large luxury sedans.

 

[surfstar]

Originally Posted By: dohnuts
Ah, and this is where my frugal roots betray me. My money? I'm good with a Toyota Avalon. Comfortable highway ride, and I have 50-60k to spend elsewhere. But then, I'm a cheap [censored].


Yep, as fun as imagining having to make this decision, I'd rather retire a couple of years earlier and drive an Avalon or older LS (if I had to choose something in this class range).

Go for the Tesla, though. That would be the 'funnest' choice for many reasons.

 

[TrevorS]

I am looking at 2011 / 2 year old for the XJ, 750 and maybe an S550 although I don't think that would fit the bill for sporty luxury.

All of these have depreciated heavily.

For a cheaper option, I'm looking at Infiniti M. Indeed 2012 or even new 2013 M35h could be an option compared to the M56 since it will cost less, perform the same and use less fuel. But luggage space is compromised.

The M also depreciated heavily and they have large discounts on new models. I've always liked their styling.

Lexus is out for me as is Porsche. I like torque and sporty handling so Lexus is out and both these cars have not depreciated sufficiently.

The Tesla is a consideration against these up to $60k with tax options because the extra outlay could be offset by fuel and maintenance savings.

 

[TrevorS]

Does anyone have any opinion on the AWD options from BMW, Infiniti, Jaguar?

Those who test drive the A7 say the Quattro helps, so I'm wondering whether to consider these in my short list when I go for test drives.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Quite simple: the SRT8 Charger and 300 are rocketships. They run with cars twice their prices.

...In a straight line. Which is hardly the main criterion for someone looking at cars like the OP.


completely ignoring the cars track success. Ever seen one? They are very low volume cars, they don't make millions of any SRT model. Mid 12's in the quarter mile with 180 mph+ top speed and great hwy economy now with MDS in the 6.4. And they out brake SPORTS cars! Excuse me, the competition is a little thin unless you are dropping BIG coin.

Those of us who have been lucky enough to actually own one and take it to the track know that it whips the pants off the luxo barges. And Audis can only compete in a straight line, when they come to the track they quickly show their weight and dynamic failings in the bigger models.

But you can't be a brand snob. I know that's a HUGE drawback here!

 

[d00df00d]

Point taken.

But again, hardly what the OP seems to be looking for, wouldn't you say?

 

[itguy08]

Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8

completely ignoring the cars track success. Ever seen one? They are very low volume cars, they don't make millions of any SRT model. Mid 12's in the quarter mile with 180 mph+ top speed and great hwy economy now with MDS in the 6.4. And they out brake SPORTS cars! Excuse me, the competition is a little thin unless you are dropping BIG coin.


If they get such great fuel economy why is there a gas guzzler tax? 14/23 is not great at all. And for the $60k you could get just about anything and tune it and be out ahead.

There are guys with tunes on SHO's and Flexes that are hanging with Vettes on the drag strip (Look up Ecobrick Bob) . Not bad for something that weighs as much as an F150. They both need a little help in the handling department but that too can be fixed cheaply.

There is something to be said about a warranty and having it done from the factory but if it were me commuting 120 miles a day in something that is lucky to get 23 on the highway (and 14 in town) is not a good idea. At least with the Taurus I get 26 or so on the highway and around 20 in town. Not great but liveable for me.

For the OP, I'd definitely look at the Infiniti M and maybe even G - they are probably one of the best driving luxury cars in their price ranges. The G is basically a 4 door 370Z.

 

[gofast182]

Not sure why people are suggesting the MKS, XTS, or even SHO based on the original list. He'd be better off with an Acura RLX than those two and even that falls short of the criteria until the sport hybrid with individual hub motors comes out in the fall.

From what I can see Infiniti's AWD system is there to check off a box for people in snowy areas, not [truly] enhance performance like xDrive or Quattro will, I don't know anything about Jag's system. If looks are your priority, you need the Jag. For an engaging drive you'll want one of the Germans. That said, the Tesla is still intriguing...

Edit: if you are still inclined to go Infiniti, the G (Q50?) is much better in it's segment than the M is in its segment, but then again that still betrays the original list of true sport/luxury cars.

 

[whip]

What about the Maserati Quatroport? Ferrari engine in a beautiful car for a lot less money.

 

[Win]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: andyd
The newer, larger BMWs need 1500$ of cooling system parts before 100k.

Not true any more.

And even if it were, I'd expect this $1,500 would be a drop in the bucket compared to all other expenses once the car is off warranty. But that holds true for most if not all luxury vehicles.



The out of warranty repair costs on our '04 Jaguar have been zero. Everything, including the ten year old battery, continues to work as intended.

That said, if maintenance costs are a potential concern, one should probably reconsider whether they can afford the vehicle in the first place.

 

[Falcon_LS]

T
Originally Posted By: Spazdog
How unfortunate that no one has suggested a full-size Cadillac or Lincoln.

The times have changed.

No MKS. No XTS.

The MKS just looks weird to me. I'm sure the AWD model compares well with some Audis and to the best of my knowledge, the Acura RLX AWD/AWS has not made it here yet so bonus for the Lincoln. I just can't get past that weird styling.

I also don't see why anyone would pick the XTS over the current LaCrosse. You can get a loaded out AWD LaCrosse for a couple thousand or so less than the FWD standard XTS.


Times have certainly changed. If the Big Three wanted to, and the EPA wasn't on their backsides, they can build really good cars - case in point would be the '57 Eldorado.