Jailed for taking electricity worth 5 cents !

[jrustles]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Some people wake up with a chip on their shoulder and are confrontational by nature. This guy with the Leaf could be one of those personalities.


I lol'd. You began describing a lot of the law enforcement out there, only to then appropriate the statement to regular citizens who just want to live their lives.

Imagine, a citizen driven by 'a chip on their shoulder' persuing and harrassing cops for any daily petty crimes they commit.

To all these hard-talkers that want to talk about "emotions" and legal zeal, keep pretending you're some type of SS robot operating under legal orders, while the rest of humanity acts like humans; flawed emotional humans complete with discretion, diligence, compassion, humility and empathy- character traits that are absent in the psychopath. You wouldn't send your own mother to jail or put her through that over something so petty, or stealing a piece of gum and mouthing off to a cop about how petty he's being. And if you would, even to make a point, then maybe you're a psychopath.

Quote:

But when participants imagined pain to others, these regions [of the brain] failed to become active in high psychopaths. Moreover, psychopaths showed an increased response in the ventral striatum, an area known to be involved in pleasure, when imagining others in pain.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: jrustles
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Some people wake up with a chip on their shoulder and are confrontational by nature. This guy with the Leaf could be one of those personalities.


I lol'd. You began describing a lot of the law enforcement out there, only to then appropriate the statement to regular citizens who just want to live their lives.

Imagine, a citizen driven by 'a chip on their shoulder' persuing and harrassing cops for any daily petty crimes they commit.

To all these hard-talkers that want to talk about "emotions" and legal zeal, keep pretending you're some type of SS robot operating under legal orders, while the rest of humanity acts like humans; flawed emotional humans complete with discretion, diligence, compassion, humility and empathy- character traits that are absent in the psychopath. You wouldn't send your own mother to jail or put her through that over something so petty, or stealing a piece of gum and mouthing off to a cop about how petty he's being. And if you would, even to make a point, then maybe you're a psychopath.

Quote:

But when participants imagined pain to others, these regions [of the brain] failed to become active in high psychopaths. Moreover, psychopaths showed an increased response in the ventral striatum, an area known to be involved in pleasure, when imagining others in pain.


I'm glad you enjoyed that.

A citizen driven by 'a chip on their shoulder' perusing and harassing cops for any daily petty crimes they commit deserves what the cops dish out to them. Most people living their lives obeying the law and not looking for trouble won't get into trouble. So far that philosophy has worked for me, and millions of other Americans. Every once in a while you hear that something goes wrong for someone, but that's the exception and not the norm. Then usually you'll hear or read about it, never really knowing all the facts. YMMV.

 

[KenO]

Originally Posted By: whip
Chamblee GA must be a very peaceful town. All other crime must be non existent to be wasting police resource on something this petty. Tell the guy to unplug his car, and move along.


Chamblee is one of the northern suburbs of Atlanta. I think it actually borders Atlanta city limits.


Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: jrustles
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Some people wake up with a chip on their shoulder and are confrontational by nature. This guy with the Leaf could be one of those personalities.


I lol'd. You began describing a lot of the law enforcement out there, only to then appropriate the statement to regular citizens who just want to live their lives.

Imagine, a citizen driven by 'a chip on their shoulder' persuing and harrassing cops for any daily petty crimes they commit.

To all these hard-talkers that want to talk about "emotions" and legal zeal, keep pretending you're some type of SS robot operating under legal orders, while the rest of humanity acts like humans; flawed emotional humans complete with discretion, diligence, compassion, humility and empathy- character traits that are absent in the psychopath. You wouldn't send your own mother to jail or put her through that over something so petty, or stealing a piece of gum and mouthing off to a cop about how petty he's being. And if you would, even to make a point, then maybe you're a psychopath.

Quote:

But when participants imagined pain to others, these regions [of the brain] failed to become active in high psychopaths. Moreover, psychopaths showed an increased response in the ventral striatum, an area known to be involved in pleasure, when imagining others in pain.


I'm glad you enjoyed that.

A citizen driven by 'a chip on their shoulder' perusing and harassing cops for any daily petty crimes they commit deserves what the cops dish out to them. Most people living their lives obeying the law and not looking for trouble won't get into trouble. So far that philosophy has worked for me, and millions of other Americans. Every once in a while you hear that something goes wrong for someone, but that's the exception and not the norm. Then usually you'll hear or read about it, never really knowing all the facts. YMMV.



Let me guess - you & Trajan HAVE to be Obama voters, aren't you?? Thats the only thing that makes sense here.

 

[linkbelt]

Originally Posted By: whip
Chamblee GA must be a very peaceful town. All other crime must be non existent to be wasting police resource on something this petty. Tell the guy to unplug his car, and move along.


That town is anything but peaceful! We used to live very close to Chamblee. It is almost in Atlanta.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: KenO
Originally Posted By: whip
Chamblee GA must be a very peaceful town. All other crime must be non existent to be wasting police resource on something this petty. Tell the guy to unplug his car, and move along.


Chamblee is one of the northern suburbs of Atlanta. I think it actually borders Atlanta city limits.


Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: jrustles
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Some people wake up with a chip on their shoulder and are confrontational by nature. This guy with the Leaf could be one of those personalities.


I lol'd. You began describing a lot of the law enforcement out there, only to then appropriate the statement to regular citizens who just want to live their lives.

Imagine, a citizen driven by 'a chip on their shoulder' persuing and harrassing cops for any daily petty crimes they commit.

To all these hard-talkers that want to talk about "emotions" and legal zeal, keep pretending you're some type of SS robot operating under legal orders, while the rest of humanity acts like humans; flawed emotional humans complete with discretion, diligence, compassion, humility and empathy- character traits that are absent in the psychopath. You wouldn't send your own mother to jail or put her through that over something so petty, or stealing a piece of gum and mouthing off to a cop about how petty he's being. And if you would, even to make a point, then maybe you're a psychopath.

Quote:

But when participants imagined pain to others, these regions [of the brain] failed to become active in high psychopaths. Moreover, psychopaths showed an increased response in the ventral striatum, an area known to be involved in pleasure, when imagining others in pain.


I'm glad you enjoyed that.

A citizen driven by 'a chip on their shoulder' perusing and harassing cops for any daily petty crimes they commit deserves what the cops dish out to them. Most people living their lives obeying the law and not looking for trouble won't get into trouble. So far that philosophy has worked for me, and millions of other Americans. Every once in a while you hear that something goes wrong for someone, but that's the exception and not the norm. Then usually you'll hear or read about it, never really knowing all the facts. YMMV.



Let me guess - you & Trajan HAVE to be Obama voters, aren't you?? Thats the only thing that makes sense here.


LOL Not even close buddy. Obama was the last person I wanted to see as Pres. I have no idea who Trajan voted for, very rarely do we see eye to eye on anything.

We really shouldn't go down the political road should we?
That might get the thread locked.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: Trav

Amazing how in situations like this the cop is always the bad guy and the perp is the poor abused citizen.



I don't think the cop was bad, just incompetent, as evidenced by his 2nd grade write-up of the situation.

He could have baited the guy into one of several contempt-of-cop citations (failure to obey lawful order, failure to disperse, disorderly conduct) but exercised restraint, kicking the incident to his highers-up. They then went with the stolen electricity gambit. I honestly wonder why... not knowing the whole story. Maybe they assume the allegation of nickel theft will demean his intellect and he'll fly off the handle, alert the media, etc.


How was the cop supposed to know how much electricity was stolen? Did this guy have a meter on the line so he could repay the people he stole it from?
It sounds like this guy is in the habit of fueling his car at someone else's expense.

Comparing his car to a freaking gadget or drinking water as justification is what convinces me he thinks its a god given right to steal electricity (fuel) for it.
This guy doesn't know the difference between right and wrong and if I was the Judge I would make an example of him for every other would be thief with an electric gadget car.

Quote:
Kamooneh plans to fight the charges, arguing that “not all takings are theft.” He compares his case to drinking water from a school spigot, or plugging a cell phone into an outlet without permission, and says that no records exist of anyone being charged with theft for either activity in the jurisdiction.

 

[jrustles]

Originally Posted By: KenO

Let me guess - you & Trajan HAVE to be Obama voters, aren't you?? Thats the only thing that makes sense here.


Couldn't care for him, TBH. Seems about as insincere, untrustworthy and personally motivated as the best of them.
Proof that pigeon holing is usually never accurate

I'm glad that many of you have never been harrassed by the cops or been put through such rigamarole for pettiness, that's great. Congratulations. But don't interpret that as "well, I guess I've been perfect and 100% law abiding, so I'll just give myself this award here and tell everyone else they have no excuse". That's just ignorant. I don't blame people with cancer or tell them they deserve it for not eating right or exposing themselves to carcinogens or whatever, just simply because I've never had cancer, that attitude is just beyond reproach IMO. Likewise, you all could have- and will again be- sinners and law breakers subject to potential criminal charges.

But what I can't understand is that TAX PAYERS are okay with teaching some guy a lesson he'll never forget on their own dime!! This isn't about recovering damages - at all-, so what is the issue really, to jstify wasting public resources in such a manner? I'm not here to fund any cop's indulgence of power or a blood-lust for civilan subordination.

No shortage of really tall horses around here. Shame.

 

[Mykl]

Originally Posted By: jrustles
I'm glad that many of you have never been harrassed by the cops or been put through such rigamarole for pettiness, that's great. Congratulations.


I get it. I'm as sensitive to police over-reach as anybody who doesn't trust cops in general. But at the same time they do actually have a job to do. So if you get caught stealing anything, no matter how cheap or petty, and you're a jerk about it, why should anybody offer you an ounce of sympathy because the police did what their job allows them to do and in many cases is expected of them?

If you don't want to get harrassed by cops, don't give them a reason to harrass you, and right up near the top of the "suggestions for avoiding unwanted attention from cops" is "don't get caught stealing."

 

[demarpaint]

Since so many people feel the electric was free, the Leaf owner was right, and that the cop was wrong here's an idea. Maybe after this incident a sign should be put up at that site stating free electric for electric car owners. Or even free electric for any rechargeable devices and keep it fair. As a punishment the police officer could direct traffic of people charging their items/cars there, and keep things orderly. All the costs would be covered by the school taxes.

 

[KenO]

Originally Posted By: Trav

How was the cop supposed to know how much electricity was stolen? Did this guy have a meter on the line so he could repay the people he stole it from?
It sounds like this guy is in the habit of fueling his car at someone else's expense.

Comparing his car to a freaking gadget or drinking water as justification is what convinces me he thinks its a god given right to steal electricity (fuel) for it.
This guy doesn't know the difference between right and wrong and if I was the Judge I would make an example of him for every other would be thief with an electric gadget car.

Quote:
Kamooneh plans to fight the charges, arguing that “not all takings are theft.” He compares his case to drinking water from a school spigot, or plugging a cell phone into an outlet without permission, and says that no records exist of anyone being charged with theft for either activity in the jurisdiction.



Whats different about it? All of the above examples are using public (school) resources for personal use.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: TrevorS
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
I think sporting an attitude and asking the cop if he had asked for permission before polluting the air with his cruiser when asked if he had permission to use the outlet are ultimately what led to him being jailed. He was a d-bag acting like he was saving the environment and this "polluter cop" was getting in his way of doing so.


I didn't read that part in the Fox News report.

When did this argument take place and when did the arrest take place?

Has he been charged with arguing with an officer?


I think it is from the ABC report, it was posted on the 2nd page:

Quote:
According to the Chamblee police report, the police officer wrote, "I asked him why his vehicle was plugged into the power at the school. He told me that was an excepted [sic] practice and that I was making to [sic] much of it. I asked him if he has [sic] asked the Dekalb County school system if he could take the power. He told me that I did not ask if my patrol car can dirty the air -- did you? He says 'No you did not'."

 

[Vikas]

Anybody wants to take a list of participants and then run a statistical correlation from a typical electric car topic? To make it even more fun, compare and contrast that list with a gun control and/or healthcare topic.

The guys who have no problem with a cop putting his muddy shoes inside the said electrical vehicle without any probable cause are usually the first one screaming at top of their lung when topic of roadside sobriety blocks are mentioned. Their constitutional rights then reign supreme.

As I said, I am shocked, shocked to see the usual list on the each side of this issue!

(that "Mr. Patel" reference, if had been true, would have made this even more obvious)

 

[bigjl]

Originally Posted By: KenO
Originally Posted By: bigjl
Originally Posted By: KenO
It doens't matter what the guy said to the cop. Unless he threatened the officer of physically assaulted the officer, what was said to the officer is irrelevant. The man should have simply been told to unplug his car. In reality, the **** that called the cops is the real moron here. Why is everybody so quick to call police? If there is an issue with something ons chool property, shouldn't school administrators be the first ones to go to? And then shouldn't the schoola dministrators be making the determination if it's right or wrong, and if wrong, then going and asking the man to unplug, and to not do it again? People over react in todays society. I have never once called the police in my entire life, and I hope I don't have to. There's just no reason for it, and there was no justication for calling the police in this instance.


I suspect the reason the Police were called is he may have been asked previously not to charge his car there

As lets be honest. How many think this was his first time trying to get some free electricity.

How many other times and places has he done so

The Leaf has a range of nearly 100 miles on a full charge.

And you think he just happened to "run low" a few miles from home at the same place he found an unused electrical outlet in an out of the way part of the school grounds.

And he also quite by accident happended to have his vehicles adapter that allows use of a normal plug to charge he battery up.

Really.

Are people really gullible enough to think this is the first time he has done it?



Actually, the Leaf has a range of about 75-80 miles TOPS, if you're lucky. Atlanta city traffic, heater on, he probably gets a realistic 50-60 miles on a full charge. It's why I haven't purchased one, the realistic range just isn't there yet. Most people with an EV carry a 110v charger with them for emergency purposes - it's incredibly stupid not to. I think you're making some improper generalizations and inferring the man is a criminal because he carries an extension cord for an electric car, in his electric car.....


So it would be legal to steal fuel if your car had a small tank?

The Leaf is typically achieving nearly 100 miles range going by the magazine tests.

Not heard of a single test or report where they are getting around the 50 mile mark

 

[KenO]

Originally Posted By: bigjl
Originally Posted By: KenO
Originally Posted By: bigjl
Originally Posted By: KenO
It doens't matter what the guy said to the cop. Unless he threatened the officer of physically assaulted the officer, what was said to the officer is irrelevant. The man should have simply been told to unplug his car. In reality, the **** that called the cops is the real moron here. Why is everybody so quick to call police? If there is an issue with something ons chool property, shouldn't school administrators be the first ones to go to? And then shouldn't the schoola dministrators be making the determination if it's right or wrong, and if wrong, then going and asking the man to unplug, and to not do it again? People over react in todays society. I have never once called the police in my entire life, and I hope I don't have to. There's just no reason for it, and there was no justication for calling the police in this instance.


I suspect the reason the Police were called is he may have been asked previously not to charge his car there

As lets be honest. How many think this was his first time trying to get some free electricity.

How many other times and places has he done so

The Leaf has a range of nearly 100 miles on a full charge.

And you think he just happened to "run low" a few miles from home at the same place he found an unused electrical outlet in an out of the way part of the school grounds.

And he also quite by accident happended to have his vehicles adapter that allows use of a normal plug to charge he battery up.

Really.

Are people really gullible enough to think this is the first time he has done it?



Actually, the Leaf has a range of about 75-80 miles TOPS, if you're lucky. Atlanta city traffic, heater on, he probably gets a realistic 50-60 miles on a full charge. It's why I haven't purchased one, the realistic range just isn't there yet. Most people with an EV carry a 110v charger with them for emergency purposes - it's incredibly stupid not to. I think you're making some improper generalizations and inferring the man is a criminal because he carries an extension cord for an electric car, in his electric car.....


So it would be legal to steal fuel if your car had a small tank?

The Leaf is typically achieving nearly 100 miles range going by the magazine tests.

Not heard of a single test or report where they are getting around the 50 mile mark




Not sure where you're getting that from, but a quick Google shows otherwise.

http://green.autoblog.com/2013/02/21/2013-nissan-leaf-revealed-gets-75-mile-range-actually-84-in-n/

Here's a whole forum of users, almost nobody is getting the kind of range you're speaking of, and more closely to the range that I suggested:

http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=2523&sid=6a4a1522dc098353689445d1c677f768


And again - it has nothing to do with 'stealing'. As stated, this is no different from plugging in any other electrical device for personal use. Should I run around and tell people to unplug their phones, because they're stealing electricity?? If a friend needed to charge their electric car for a bit to get home, would you really tell them no? If so, you're a pretty big POS.


I think at some point, now that electric cars are starting to proliferate the market, perhaps a 'do's and don'ts' of where is and is not appropriate to charge an electric car should be established. At this point, however, that has not been done.

 

[uc50ic4more]

Originally Posted By: Mykl
If you don't want to get harrassed by cops, don't give them a reason to harrass you,


?!?!?!??!?!?!

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: KenO
If a friend needed to charge their electric car for a bit to get home, would you really tell them no? If so, you're a pretty big POS.



Heck no, but a friend would ask first. In fact a buddy was here visiting a few weeks ago and asked if I minded if he plugged in his cell phone to charge it. I laughed and said why'd you ask? His reply was why shouldn't he ask.

 

[KenO]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: KenO
If a friend needed to charge their electric car for a bit to get home, would you really tell them no? If so, you're a pretty big POS.



Heck no, but a friend would ask first. In fact a buddy was here visiting a few weeks ago and asked if I minded if he plugged in his cell phone to charge it. I laughed and said why'd you ask? His reply was why shouldn't he ask.



OK. So you admit that not asking is appropriate. Do you ask to plug in your device (of any kind) when you're in any other public building? At work, the airport, in a school, a training sessions, at the garage waiting on your car..... At this point, those have ALL been long considered public domain. Just because the device plugged in is a vehicle makes it no different (yet). If you'd like to change that, then perhaps you need to start a campaign to change public opinion to your view of 'right & wrong'. Because thats just it - it's YOUR VIEW, it's not law.

 

[bigjl]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: Trajan
Originally Posted By: TrevorS

the officer had no evidence that a crime was in progress.


Was the car being charged at a designated charging station?

It's a rhetorical question. He was on school property charging his car without their permission. Since he did not have their permission to use the outlet, he was...... stealing.



Or the school infastructure and policies were arranged prior to the introduction of electric vehicles and they quite reasonably thought that they didn't need to point out to reasonable people that charging your vehicle up without permission from the bill payer is not on.

Is there a sign saying not to remove the school desks for home use?

What about a sign saying don't use the school library as your own inventory for textbook rental?

I am not surprised at the assumption that the PO overstepped the mark.

Some people think they have the right to do what they want.

Such as this bloke.

There was a report made to the Police.

The Police investigated it

Found this idiot

He acting like he is above the law

He found out that he wasn't

He will now have his legally entitled day in court.

If somebody in the UK is caught syphoning fuel but is caught when they have only stolen a litre, does that make them innocent

The person involved may say there is no legal precedent set regarding this.

Good, now he is part of his own test case

I want to thank him for being public spirited enough to allow this test case to be carried out.

Why people want to defend criminality by saying the Police Officer was over zealous i don't know.

If i was the bloke involved i would be embarressed for trying to steal such a trivial amount.

But he did it and had likely been doing it since he bought the car.

It might even be the reason he bought the car

There are two schools of thought...

1) If it's not explicitly forbidden, it's okay.
2) One must gain explicit permission for it to be okay.

The school never felt it was an issue, and has not issued a sign/ policy about their electricity. They felt the Leaf owner's presence during school hours was an issue (distracting to the students? Security?) and warned him about that. The school has a power vacuum about its electricity policy; noone wanted to step up and set policy. Those in authority were following #1.

However, a concerned citizen felt like #2 was happening and called the police. The attitude of the Leaf owner allowed the formerly neutral Police to also feel like #2 was happening.

The variety of responses to this thread include 1 & 2 and aren't seeing eye-to-eye.

 

[uc50ic4more]

Originally Posted By: KenO
If a friend needed to charge their electric car for a bit to get home, would you really tell them no? If so, you're a pretty big POS.


If people could bring themselves to think of others as "friends" then a whole lotta problems beyond the pilfering of inconsequential amounts of electricity would be solved. This very thread illustrated that this incident is a symptom; the problem being an attitude of ME ME ME and MINE MINE MINE, complete with a police force to serve and protect property.

 

[KenO]

Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
Originally Posted By: KenO
If a friend needed to charge their electric car for a bit to get home, would you really tell them no? If so, you're a pretty big POS.


If people could bring themselves to think of others as "friends" then a whole lotta problems beyond the pilfering of inconsequential amounts of electricity would be solved. This very thread illustrated that this incident is a symptom; the problem being an attitude of ME ME ME and MINE MINE MINE, complete with a police force to serve and protect property.



OK, now I'll agree with this. The root though, really, is in our government. They are dead set on dividing the people of this country. As they say - divide & conquer.....