China invented paper, but... who was it again who invented the Internet?
It's China again
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When I saw this story on the local news today, they did not mention where the toys were made. It seemed odd that any company would allow lead paint to find its way on to toys...now I hear they are made in China, and everything makes sense.
anyone remember this?
http://www.lead.org.au/lanv3n3/lanv3n3-6.html
http://www.lead.org.au/lanv3n3/lanv3n3-6.html
No but hatred (or at least cautious regard) of their government is a very good reason to keep China at arms length and stop buying their products.
We're talking about a country that jails and harvests organs from people with unpopular religious views (Falun Gong). That is heavily invested in the Sudanese genocide. This is a communist country with a human rights record no better than Nazi Germany. Their behavior cannot be defended.
Melamine, ethylene glycol, and lead sure tast good when you get it a bargan prices.
Dead right about the organ harvesting. I have a brochure from CIPFG. 18,500 transplants 94-99 before FG persecution, 60,000 2000-2005 after persecution of Falun Gong started in July 99
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Well (we're getting out there, folks ..in terms of the PRS stuff), one must ask how one solves these issues ..and what are the precursors that make them so??
Does it stop these things with "punishment"? Or are the present conditions the reason things are the way that they are? Aren't they being offered an alternative to this behavior? Do behaviors stop on a dime ...much like your hunger isn't satisfied with the first bite of food after a very long fast? You don't fix those things overnight and you've got to give a preferred pathway out of them (if you want them to end). Developing the seductive consumerism that has enslaved the entire planet to capitalism is not an overnight thing.
That alternative view aside.....
..I really don't feel great about financing this evolution for them wiht MY economic vitality. I was never asked to be the benefactor of the global population. A most generous nation is awfully generous with OPM (other people's money).
Does it stop these things with "punishment"? Or are the present conditions the reason things are the way that they are? Aren't they being offered an alternative to this behavior? Do behaviors stop on a dime ...much like your hunger isn't satisfied with the first bite of food after a very long fast? You don't fix those things overnight and you've got to give a preferred pathway out of them (if you want them to end). Developing the seductive consumerism that has enslaved the entire planet to capitalism is not an overnight thing.
That alternative view aside.....
..I really don't feel great about financing this evolution for them wiht MY economic vitality. I was never asked to be the benefactor of the global population. A most generous nation is awfully generous with OPM (other people's money).
John I don't know where you got this kind of info about chinese from but I can tell you that most chinese would be proud of our 5000 years history. However, modern chinese people(in mainland, Hong Kong, Taiwan) never have the same mentality as the Nazi Third Reich, at least since the last century. We don't think that we are the master race and are destined to rule the world.
For those chinese people who make poison goods, illegal copies, blame them hard and I do as a chinese. I konw this is an american forum but making fun or insult on race(any) is really bad for discussions or debate.
hung - you know what you are saying is basically true. But it's very hard for Americans to separate/distinguish China now from China Mao. And you must admit, as much as the world hates USA, nothing like the killing, torture, misery Mao and his comrades did ever happened in the USA. Currently mainland China still has.....issues.....
Pablo all poor and developing countries have issues. What I want to say is just simply blame the issues, poking fun on those dog eating things on chinese really doesn't help much and probably make things even worse. Foreigners may find it difficult to understand why a lot of chinese still taking Mao as god, I don't and I don't know but who care? Mao has died 30+ years and he has nothing to do with china's current issues. I think a lot of chinese people find it difficult to understand why american still voted Bush to president too. I don't like Bush but that doesn't make me to hate american people.
Now a bit off topic, let me talk about the dog eating things in china. I grew up in Hong Kong and I have never eaten dog or cat. Amount all the mainland chinese I have known, over 70% of them DO NOT eat dog or cat. For the rest, they do but not regularly their meal. However, My point is.... amount most asian countries, dog used to be regular food to those people for centuries, like beef to most western world people. This is just different culture that people need to respect. A lot of farmers in china and asian countries never eat beef because cows were/are partners to farmers doing farm job. My grandmother was one of them but she never blamed those beef eating people including myself.
Now a bit off topic, let me talk about the dog eating things in china. I grew up in Hong Kong and I have never eaten dog or cat. Amount all the mainland chinese I have known, over 70% of them DO NOT eat dog or cat. For the rest, they do but not regularly their meal. However, My point is.... amount most asian countries, dog used to be regular food to those people for centuries, like beef to most western world people. This is just different culture that people need to respect. A lot of farmers in china and asian countries never eat beef because cows were/are partners to farmers doing farm job. My grandmother was one of them but she never blamed those beef eating people including myself.
hung, these same people have similar attitude towards other ethnicities so it's not only the Chinese they are hateful of. The unfortunate part of this is that a vast majority of them confuse the US foreign policy or political propaganda with inter-human relations and make such blanket statements.
As long as nothing American is bashed (besides for environmentalists and liberals), the topic can go on. Even the Aussies are not spared.
As long as nothing American is bashed (besides for environmentalists and liberals), the topic can go on. Even the Aussies are not spared.
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hung: You make many valid points. You're seeing the side effects of the longest standing stable government (folks, most contemporary governments are post WWII or later) with the most stable ethnic population that's in retreat on the planet. We're being overrun ..at an accelerated rate, by "others" ..both demographically and economically. There's going to be some of these effects evidenced in our rhetoric.
It's like the Cold War question, "Do Russians love their children?" Sure they did. So do most parents ..worldwide. That doesn't stop some provincial father in many poor and underdeveloped countries from selling them. Poverty breeds corruption and loss of what we consider moral conduct.
We can afford pets. This assigns them extended privileges in our society. If they weren't meat eaters, they may have made it on our menus. You'll note that not many mammalian carnivores are eaten here.
It's like the Cold War question, "Do Russians love their children?" Sure they did. So do most parents ..worldwide. That doesn't stop some provincial father in many poor and underdeveloped countries from selling them. Poverty breeds corruption and loss of what we consider moral conduct.
We can afford pets. This assigns them extended privileges in our society. If they weren't meat eaters, they may have made it on our menus. You'll note that not many mammalian carnivores are eaten here.
It's really the machines that are taking over. People become very immoral when they hide behind their machines. You don't see road rage on the sidewalk too often. You don't see conversations like this thread face to face.
I do not hate people from China!! I made a the distinction of not Trusting them as a nation. I was sure to point out that their are probably many fine Chineese in China and people of Chineese decent. No matter how you slice it China has a horrable Human Rights violations past and present! No matter how you slice it their are constant issues with Hazardious waste and heavy metals makeing into products made in China and exported globaly. No matter how you slice it intellectual theft is the primary comodity in China!
I feel the same way. I have nothing against Chinese people as a whole, nor am I racist by any stretch. I am concerned though with the number of flat out dangerous products that come out of China. Of course, they are not going to list "heavy metals" or "toxins" as an ingrediant in any product, so shoppers have no way of knowing what they are getting. Chinese products are all over our store shelves, and with China's horrible track record with quality control and allowing dangerous substances to find their way into the products we need, it is a little frigtening. I don't want to die from my toothpaste, or my cats to die from their food. That isn't racism or xenophobia, that is a legitimate concern these days.
And the Chinese government does have a horrible history of human rights violations. That is a fact. I mean they have mobile execution vans...that just isn't right.
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It's very hard to ride ramrod on a herd of nearly 1 billion people. Sure it's a large country ..but a good bit of it is suitable for mountain goats. India is no better. There are lots of problems there too ...any under developed nation has these issues. Everywhere from the banana republics with their wealthy power core using a militarized police state to keep the peasants in line ..or whatever. The group of modern industrialized nations has a very good life that we kinda take for granted without realizing the cost of it. Take away our food and our space and our other means of support and I assure you that we'll have a very authoritarian state that will start moving more and more of the benefits to a central core ..and let the slimes behave or pay the price.
I hope that you all realize that there's going to be some eventual equilibrium reached ..and seeing as there doesn't appear to be an endless supply of resources ..that 1/3 of the world's population (between India and China) are going to elevate at OUR expense (the aligned industrial populations)... you can see that there is going to be some radical decline in our future lifestyles for the vast majority of Western or para-western nations. Since we have the most ..we will give the most up. I really don't think many of you have really thought it out thoroughly.
I hope that you all realize that there's going to be some eventual equilibrium reached ..and seeing as there doesn't appear to be an endless supply of resources ..that 1/3 of the world's population (between India and China) are going to elevate at OUR expense (the aligned industrial populations)... you can see that there is going to be some radical decline in our future lifestyles for the vast majority of Western or para-western nations. Since we have the most ..we will give the most up. I really don't think many of you have really thought it out thoroughly.
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I do have a Heinlein-esque plan.
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Quote:
I do have a Heinlein-esque plan.
Mine is more aligned with Saberhagen.
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