It just keeps getting worse for Boeing

[BMWTurboDzl]

I hope they learn their lesson. However the damage is already done. The once American Giant Boeing is no longer. Airbus is continuing fill the growing void. I'm glad Airbus is investing in USA plants. Expanding their commitment's to provide a safe and reliable product. The government should be doing more to clamp down on Boeing but they are also flawed with same issues that plague Boeing. I wish Boeing the best. However this industry doesn't forgive recklessness and flaws Boeing's pushing out the door. If the bankruptcy and break up of Boeing is needed than so be it. The industry and the people deserve the best in air travel.

Airbus is laying off 2500 people in its Defense/Space division.

 

[Astro14]

Muilenber was primary cause of this crisis. Yes, we can go to 1997 and argue about merger, but he is the one that made critical moves that put Boeing unnecessarily in death spiral.
My point is, just bcs. someone is engineer doesn’t mean theh will do absolutely right. Does pilot have to be CEO of UAL? The real problem of Boeing is cultural that is so bad, that it really doesn’t matter at this point what background someone has. Bringing outsider was good move, but it might be too late.

Well, the CEO of UAL graduated from the Air Force academy - hard to get better aviation credentials than that…

The crash of Lion Air and Ethiopian were in 2018.

The decision to kill NMA, and to press on with the MAX, were made when Muilenberg was CEO. The subsequent bad engineering decisions happened in the culture of accountancy, corporate cost, and profit, not engineering, and not excellence, that he was directly responsible for creating.

Ten years of Muilenberg turned the big ship in a direction that was disastrous, ultimately. Takes a long time to correct the course, and I don’t think the successors even knew course was that bad until the crashes and other problems surfaced later.

 

[edyvw]

Well, the CEO of UAL graduated from the Air Force academy - hard to get better aviation credentials than that…

The crash of Lion Air and Ethiopian were in 2018.

The decision to kill NMA, and to press on with the MAX, were made when Muilenberg was CEO. The subsequent bad engineering decisions happened in the culture of accountancy, corporate cost, and profit, not engineering, and not excellence, that he was directly responsible for creating.

Ten years of Muilenberg turned the big ship in a direction that was disastrous, ultimately. Takes a long time to correct the course, and I don’t think the successors even knew course was that bad until the crashes and other problems surfaced later.

Of course, we can argue that the craft of engineering is most suitable to run Boeing or a similar company, but engineers, like pilots, are, in the end, human beings. You won't have a hardcore engineer as CEO ever, as that entails more than engineering. There are great engineers who could not keep an eye on two drawn cows on a piece of paper, let alone run a company like Boeing.
Being's problem is culture, not one person, and that will be difficult to fix.

As for USAFA and UAL, I think you get my point.

 

[Tdog02]

Well, the CEO of UAL graduated from the Air Force academy - hard to get better aviation credentials than that…

The crash of Lion Air and Ethiopian were in 2018.

The decision to kill NMA, and to press on with the MAX, were made when Muilenberg was CEO. The subsequent bad engineering decisions happened in the culture of accountancy, corporate cost, and profit, not engineering, and not excellence, that he was directly responsible for creating.

Ten years of Muilenberg turned the big ship in a direction that was disastrous, ultimately. Takes a long time to correct the course, and I don’t think the successors even knew course was that bad until the crashes and other problems surfaced later.

Stiff question, your opinion, is this something that can be rectified without breaking up the company? I know they are a major contractor for the military but the civilian market keeps them running.

 

[Astro14]

Stiff question, your opinion, is this something that can be rectified without breaking up the company? I know they are a major contractor for the military but the civilian market keeps them running.

Leading change for an institution that encompasses the scope is a challenging matter. No matter how articulate and motivated the CEO might be.

Ref: “Leading Change” by John Kotter.

Certainly, the sense of urgency exists. I cannot believe there is a single Boeing employee who, at this point, does not recognize and understand the urgent need for change.

But, building a coalition, guiding transformation, getting buy in, removing barriers, creating short term wins, and all that, is going to be difficult.

If you have not read Professor Kotter’s book, I highly recommend it.

The problem with Boeing is that it is large, and entrenched. Middle management is solely focused on cost. Solely focused on extracting profit. The legacy of decades of that being the company’s priority.

How do you get them back to “building the best”?

It’s like turning a super tanker. You have to apply a lot of rudder, and be relentless in that rudder application in order to get that enormous ship to turn. It took a long time to get that ship on this course, and it will take a long time to get the ship onto a new course.

Do I think they can do it? Yes, but they need a leader. An articulate visionary and inspirational person.

Not just a CEO, and certainly not a manager.

 

[fdcg27]

During the early jet transport days Boeing was led by a lawyer.
It's more a matter of having vision and an engineering and sales infrastructure in which one can have confidence than it is the specific area of expertise of the leader, and that person must have the personal decision making skills and the confidence to make good ones, which are also usually hard ones..
This was probably more common in the days of the 707 and 727 than it is today, but visionary leaders and companies do still exist.

 

[wavinwayne]

We have the defense side of Boeing here in North AL. I wonder how a potential bankruptcy would affect that part of the business?

 

[Silver Samurai]

This all began when Boeing had acquired MD and allowed their faulty business practices permeate - earnings over engineering...What was once a honorable company led by engineers is a shell of their former selves...Boeing has rightfully earned bankruptcy.

 

[The_Eric]

All this talk of financial instability, bankruptcy and splitting/reforming - how much of a concern is it that someone with deep pockets who isn't our friend buys Boeing (like China/Chinese state run firm)?

 

[wpod]

Let’s not forget that Boeing 1) operates in a duopoly with a very large order book and no short term alternative, 2) there will be no shortage of investors willing to buy shares to recapitalize the company and 3) there is a new CEO with an engineering/production background. So this is all tragic but let’s not write the company off. In any event this is a “too big to fail” company from a national perspective.

Boeing could be called and in all reality is a national asset.

 

[Silver Samurai]

All this talk of financial instability, bankruptcy and splitting/reforming - how much of a concern is it that someone with deep pockets who isn't our friend buys Boeing (like China/Chinese state run firm)?

Wouldn't surprise me if the execs/accountants approved it...

 

[edyvw]

Hopefully, the current CEO will get things sorted out, and Boeing will get some breakthroughs. If not, I am not sure how they survive this onslaught:

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/boeing...uring-plane-production-60-minutes-transcript/

 

[97prizm]

I hope they learn their lesson. However the damage is already done. The once American Giant Boeing is no longer. Airbus is continuing fill the growing void. I'm glad Airbus is investing in USA plants. Expanding their commitment's to provide a safe and reliable product. The government should be doing more to clamp down on Boeing but they are also flawed with same issues that plague Boeing. I wish Boeing the best. However this industry doesn't forgive recklessness and flaws Boeing's pushing out the door. If the bankruptcy and break up of Boeing is needed than so be it. The industry and the people deserve the best in air travel.

I'm bummed Mitsubishi didn't finish up on their msj jet. It was essentially ready for production.

 

[M56959]

Had to moderate this far too much.