Is Castrol Edge 10w30 improved over GC 0w30
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Originally Posted By: JSRT4
Caterham, that is the best explanation I've ever heard about the two viscosities, that might convince me to go with a 5w30 over a 10w30 despite temps as oil flow on these engines is a big deal. I'll definitely consider it now.
Eventually I want to go back to Amsoil early next season when the car gets back on the road, I've been considering Amsoil 10w30 vs. Amsoil 0w30, I was going to go with 10w30 due to the lower Noack numbers but now I'll re-think that one too. Along that logic Castrol GC 0w30 might be a good choice too.
Thanks for that explanation, very helpful.
You're welcome.
Amsoil 0W-30 with it's HTHS vis of 3.4cP is a heavy 30wt oil, almost as thick as GC. Your engine doesn't require a thick 30wt oil. If you're into Amsoil I'd actually consider their 0W-20 which is a very thick 20wt with it's HTHS vis of 2.8cP. That inconjunction with the fact that it is impervious to shear would make it an almost ideal oil choice for street use in your S2000.
Caterham, that is the best explanation I've ever heard about the two viscosities, that might convince me to go with a 5w30 over a 10w30 despite temps as oil flow on these engines is a big deal. I'll definitely consider it now.
Eventually I want to go back to Amsoil early next season when the car gets back on the road, I've been considering Amsoil 10w30 vs. Amsoil 0w30, I was going to go with 10w30 due to the lower Noack numbers but now I'll re-think that one too. Along that logic Castrol GC 0w30 might be a good choice too.
Thanks for that explanation, very helpful.
You're welcome.
Amsoil 0W-30 with it's HTHS vis of 3.4cP is a heavy 30wt oil, almost as thick as GC. Your engine doesn't require a thick 30wt oil. If you're into Amsoil I'd actually consider their 0W-20 which is a very thick 20wt with it's HTHS vis of 2.8cP. That inconjunction with the fact that it is impervious to shear would make it an almost ideal oil choice for street use in your S2000.
I don't think the oil matters when you're parking a car to only start it a few times.
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Amsoil 0W-30 with it's HTHS vis of 3.4cP is a heavy 30wt oil, almost as thick as GC.
You're not talking about SSO are you? SSO is ~10cSt with HTHS of 3.2. It is nowhere near "almost the same as GC" (12.1cSt/3.5 or 3.6 IIRC). If you have a euro engine which calls for A3 then SSO isn't going to cut it. It's too thin.
If you don't require A3 then SSO is a great 30 weight oil from everything I've heard. If I had an Asian power plant instead of German I'd probably be running it without a question.
Searching Amsoil.com for "0W-30" and "0W30" doesn't get me any hits other than SSO.
Amsoil 0W-30 with it's HTHS vis of 3.4cP is a heavy 30wt oil, almost as thick as GC.
You're not talking about SSO are you? SSO is ~10cSt with HTHS of 3.2. It is nowhere near "almost the same as GC" (12.1cSt/3.5 or 3.6 IIRC). If you have a euro engine which calls for A3 then SSO isn't going to cut it. It's too thin.
If you don't require A3 then SSO is a great 30 weight oil from everything I've heard. If I had an Asian power plant instead of German I'd probably be running it without a question.
Searching Amsoil.com for "0W-30" and "0W30" doesn't get me any hits other than SSO.
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If you're storing the car all winter, change the oil just before storage with a quality but less expensie dino like 5w30 PYB, then change out to your syn of choice in the spring.
It's more importnat to put the car to sleep with fresh, clean oil than the brand. (Even if you sneak it out a few times over winter, the PYB will be just fine)
It's more importnat to put the car to sleep with fresh, clean oil than the brand. (Even if you sneak it out a few times over winter, the PYB will be just fine)
The F-series motors are not picky about oil. German Castrol would be just fine. Mobil 1 0w40 is another safe choice and it's readily available.
Originally Posted By: Craig in Canada
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Amsoil 0W-30 with it's HTHS vis of 3.4cP is a heavy 30wt oil, almost as thick as GC.
You're not talking about SSO are you? SSO is ~10cSt with HTHS of 3.2. It is nowhere near "almost the same as GC" (12.1cSt/3.5 or 3.6 IIRC). If you have a euro engine which calls for A3 then SSO isn't going to cut it. It's too thin.
If you don't require A3 then SSO is a great 30 weight oil from everything I've heard. If I had an Asian power plant instead of German I'd probably be running it without a question.
Searching Amsoil.com for "0W-30" and "0W30" doesn't get me any hits other than SSO.
Thanks for pointing out the latest vis' spec's for SSO. It used to be heavier; KV100 of 11.2cSt and HTHS of 3.4cP.
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Amsoil 0W-30 with it's HTHS vis of 3.4cP is a heavy 30wt oil, almost as thick as GC.
You're not talking about SSO are you? SSO is ~10cSt with HTHS of 3.2. It is nowhere near "almost the same as GC" (12.1cSt/3.5 or 3.6 IIRC). If you have a euro engine which calls for A3 then SSO isn't going to cut it. It's too thin.
If you don't require A3 then SSO is a great 30 weight oil from everything I've heard. If I had an Asian power plant instead of German I'd probably be running it without a question.
Searching Amsoil.com for "0W-30" and "0W30" doesn't get me any hits other than SSO.
Thanks for pointing out the latest vis' spec's for SSO. It used to be heavier; KV100 of 11.2cSt and HTHS of 3.4cP.
thanks for all for all of the great tips. I've gone with Castrol Edge right now to hold me over until I put the car away in the next month. I think I'm going to switch to Amsoil 5w30 when the car gets back on the road next spring. I considered the Amsoil 0w30 but I like the NOACK numbers on the 5w30 a bit better. The long drain factor doesn't apply to my driving levels.
Castrol Edge 5W-30 sounds like a pretty good GP III oil choice for your S2000 although I can't get over what it costs up here in Canada. I trust you're getting some sort of deal on it as I would never pay the 12 bucks/L Cdn Tire wants for it. Heck I can get RL for that price!
I hope your going to put at least 8,000 kms on the oil before you change it out in the spring in favour of Amsoil, anything less would be a waste and frankly silly.
I'm not sure what's behind the disproportionate value in an extremely low NOACK percentage; i.e., 6.9% (5W-30) vs 8.65% ( SSO 0W-30) since it's not a DI application. Is it theoretically better oil consumption or perhaps the oil thickening unduly over an OCI? Fact is 8.65% is a very good percentage.
I agree with you on the long range factor, that's one reason I like the Amsoil's Dominator range of oils other than the price.
I hope your going to put at least 8,000 kms on the oil before you change it out in the spring in favour of Amsoil, anything less would be a waste and frankly silly.
I'm not sure what's behind the disproportionate value in an extremely low NOACK percentage; i.e., 6.9% (5W-30) vs 8.65% ( SSO 0W-30) since it's not a DI application. Is it theoretically better oil consumption or perhaps the oil thickening unduly over an OCI? Fact is 8.65% is a very good percentage.
I agree with you on the long range factor, that's one reason I like the Amsoil's Dominator range of oils other than the price.
Originally Posted By: Drew2000
If you're storing the car all winter, change the oil just before storage with a quality but less expensie dino like 5w30 PYB, then change out to your syn of choice in the spring.
It's more importnat to put the car to sleep with fresh, clean oil than the brand. (Even if you sneak it out a few times over winter, the PYB will be just fine)
Considering that Dino is more apt to sludge up when cold, I would NOT DO THAT.
If you're storing the car all winter, change the oil just before storage with a quality but less expensie dino like 5w30 PYB, then change out to your syn of choice in the spring.
It's more importnat to put the car to sleep with fresh, clean oil than the brand. (Even if you sneak it out a few times over winter, the PYB will be just fine)
Considering that Dino is more apt to sludge up when cold, I would NOT DO THAT.
Huh?
Exactly
The Edge 5W-30 should work well in your S2000 JSRT4. I have no experience with it, but it is Castrol's best offering these days. 10W-30 would have worked well for you too.
If you stick to your guns and don't drive the car during the winter months, then the oil won't need changed again until next fall. If you have summer tires, definitely stick to your guns!
If you can't stick to your guns and take some short trips around the block, or just fire it up in your garage a few times, then consider changing the oil due to unspent fuel accumulating in the sump.
Although I have bought and used (in my S2000 too) plenty of GC the last few years, I've decided that there are better engine oils out there. That makes sense not only with UOA's, but I've known for a long time that the Germans won't even export their best beers...so why send us their best engine oil? The same can be said for the Dutch and their coffee!
If you stick to your guns and don't drive the car during the winter months, then the oil won't need changed again until next fall. If you have summer tires, definitely stick to your guns!
If you can't stick to your guns and take some short trips around the block, or just fire it up in your garage a few times, then consider changing the oil due to unspent fuel accumulating in the sump.
Although I have bought and used (in my S2000 too) plenty of GC the last few years, I've decided that there are better engine oils out there. That makes sense not only with UOA's, but I've known for a long time that the Germans won't even export their best beers...so why send us their best engine oil? The same can be said for the Dutch and their coffee!
Originally Posted By: INDYMAC
The Edge 5W-30 should work well in your S2000 JSRT4. I have no experience with it, but it is Castrol's best offering these days. 10W-30 would have worked well for you too.
If you stick to your guns and don't drive the car during the winter months, then the oil won't need changed again until next fall. If you have summer tires, definitely stick to your guns!
If you can't stick to your guns and take some short trips around the block, or just fire it up in your garage a few times, then consider changing the oil due to unspent fuel accumulating in the sump.
Although I have bought and used (in my S2000 too) plenty of GC the last few years, I've decided that there are better engine oils out there. That makes sense not only with UOA's, but I've known for a long time that the Germans won't even export their best beers...so why send us their best engine oil? The same can be said for the Dutch and their coffee!
I agree with your comments with the exception that the 10W-30 Edge "would have worked well for you too". With synthetic oils today 10W-30 it's an obsolete grade.
The reason the Germans don't export their "best engine oil" to NA is because it's simply too expensive to sell here; no one will buy it.
Case in point. A few of us Canadian members are interested in Fuchs ester based Titan GT-1 0W-20.
http://www.millionauto.com/download/TITAN GT1 0W20.pdf
We asked the Fuchs importer why they don't carry this oil and a few other interesting oils. The answer is it's too expensive and it won't sell ($23/L $80/4L jug).
To make a long story short we have managed to talk them into bringing some in as a trial.
The Edge 5W-30 should work well in your S2000 JSRT4. I have no experience with it, but it is Castrol's best offering these days. 10W-30 would have worked well for you too.
If you stick to your guns and don't drive the car during the winter months, then the oil won't need changed again until next fall. If you have summer tires, definitely stick to your guns!
If you can't stick to your guns and take some short trips around the block, or just fire it up in your garage a few times, then consider changing the oil due to unspent fuel accumulating in the sump.
Although I have bought and used (in my S2000 too) plenty of GC the last few years, I've decided that there are better engine oils out there. That makes sense not only with UOA's, but I've known for a long time that the Germans won't even export their best beers...so why send us their best engine oil? The same can be said for the Dutch and their coffee!
I agree with your comments with the exception that the 10W-30 Edge "would have worked well for you too". With synthetic oils today 10W-30 it's an obsolete grade.
The reason the Germans don't export their "best engine oil" to NA is because it's simply too expensive to sell here; no one will buy it.
Case in point. A few of us Canadian members are interested in Fuchs ester based Titan GT-1 0W-20.
http://www.millionauto.com/download/TITAN GT1 0W20.pdf
We asked the Fuchs importer why they don't carry this oil and a few other interesting oils. The answer is it's too expensive and it won't sell ($23/L $80/4L jug).
To make a long story short we have managed to talk them into bringing some in as a trial.
"I agree with your comments with the exception that the 10W-30 Edge "would have worked well for you too". With synthetic oils today 10W-30 it's an obsolete grade."
I'm not sure where you got this information. SAE 10W-30 still seems to be the most popular grade here in Texas (judging by the shelves in the stores). It's the grade recommended by Honda, and it's probably my favorite too.
I'm not sure where you got this information. SAE 10W-30 still seems to be the most popular grade here in Texas (judging by the shelves in the stores). It's the grade recommended by Honda, and it's probably my favorite too.
To clarify, the 10W-30 grade becomes technically obsolete or redundant when you up-grade to a synthetic oil. But you're correct, from a marketing perspective it's anything but unpopular and the SAE grade on the bottle is all about marketing.
Some of the best syn' 5W-30's aleady contain no VII's or very little so you actually lose out when you opt for the 10W-30 grade.
Edge is a good case in point. The 5W-30 is very shear stable and has a typical VI of 170. Do you gain any shear stability in choosing the 10W-30 instead? Hardly. Instead you get an uncompetitively low VI of 148.
5W-30 has technically replaced 10W-30 as the bench mark for a 30wt oil with 0W-30 now the option.
The subject was discussed at length in the following post regarding the 5W-20 grade but if anything it even applies more to the 10W-30 syn grade:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1793648/
Some of the best syn' 5W-30's aleady contain no VII's or very little so you actually lose out when you opt for the 10W-30 grade.
Edge is a good case in point. The 5W-30 is very shear stable and has a typical VI of 170. Do you gain any shear stability in choosing the 10W-30 instead? Hardly. Instead you get an uncompetitively low VI of 148.
5W-30 has technically replaced 10W-30 as the bench mark for a 30wt oil with 0W-30 now the option.
The subject was discussed at length in the following post regarding the 5W-20 grade but if anything it even applies more to the 10W-30 syn grade:
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1793648/
There is more to an oil than simply basing all judgment on the VI.
HTHS anyone? An oil that doesn't throw in the towel is good too!
NOACK? An oil that doesn't disappear is important.
Actual UOA results during use? An oil that shows no wear is what I want.
I will still use 10w30.
And, 10w30 is NOT technically obsolete.
I prefer the highest HTHS value in an oil and not the highest VI value. There is a direct relationship with less engine wear when HTHS is higher. Anyone want to guess what happens as VI goes up?
HTHS anyone? An oil that doesn't throw in the towel is good too!
NOACK? An oil that doesn't disappear is important.
Actual UOA results during use? An oil that shows no wear is what I want.
I will still use 10w30.
And, 10w30 is NOT technically obsolete.
I prefer the highest HTHS value in an oil and not the highest VI value. There is a direct relationship with less engine wear when HTHS is higher. Anyone want to guess what happens as VI goes up?
Originally Posted By: unDummy
Anyone want to guess what happens as VI goes up?
Not knowing the answer to this one could you fill me in ?,
thanks
Anyone want to guess what happens as VI goes up?
Not knowing the answer to this one could you fill me in ?,
thanks
I like your choice. Castrol Edge is some really great oil. Probably the smoothest quietest oil I've ran yet.
I'm with caterham on his point he's making. The whole idea behind having less of a spread (ie: 5w30 vs 10w30) is shear stability. This is kind of outdated now with the newer synthetics b/c the higher quality basestocks used in wider spread viscosities more than makes up for it. Case in point, M1 0w30, it has been argued (not exactly fact based btw) that it uses more and better higher quality basestocks to achieve its spread. Whereas a 10w30 doesn't really need so much of it.
Or think of Redline oils, which use a lot of GrpV... I don't think they even use any VII's to achieve the 5w30 spread. At all. So there's no VII's to even shear. So if you're thinking of a 10w30 over a 5w30 just for shear stability, you might even end up short changing yourself by doing so simply b/c as he said, the 5w30 typically will have better flow ability than that oil's 10w30, even in warmer temperatures. So to me, the advantage lies in the 5w30 all the way. Just as shear stable and better startup flow and probably better basestocks.
Of course you can then start talking about the NOACK's and the HTHS numbers, which may or may not factor into your decision. Low NOACK for less oil vaporization, supposedly important in D.I. engines and HTHS for protection. So you may or may not want to factor those in to the equation depending on your application. But as far as 5w vs 10w, I wouldn't sweat shear stability, at all, but I would covet the 5w for its better coldflow properties.
At least that's what I've gathered. Though I'm a newb compared to the people here. Just going off what I've thought I've understood so far on my time here. lol
I'm with caterham on his point he's making. The whole idea behind having less of a spread (ie: 5w30 vs 10w30) is shear stability. This is kind of outdated now with the newer synthetics b/c the higher quality basestocks used in wider spread viscosities more than makes up for it. Case in point, M1 0w30, it has been argued (not exactly fact based btw) that it uses more and better higher quality basestocks to achieve its spread. Whereas a 10w30 doesn't really need so much of it.
Or think of Redline oils, which use a lot of GrpV... I don't think they even use any VII's to achieve the 5w30 spread. At all. So there's no VII's to even shear. So if you're thinking of a 10w30 over a 5w30 just for shear stability, you might even end up short changing yourself by doing so simply b/c as he said, the 5w30 typically will have better flow ability than that oil's 10w30, even in warmer temperatures. So to me, the advantage lies in the 5w30 all the way. Just as shear stable and better startup flow and probably better basestocks.
Of course you can then start talking about the NOACK's and the HTHS numbers, which may or may not factor into your decision. Low NOACK for less oil vaporization, supposedly important in D.I. engines and HTHS for protection. So you may or may not want to factor those in to the equation depending on your application. But as far as 5w vs 10w, I wouldn't sweat shear stability, at all, but I would covet the 5w for its better coldflow properties.
At least that's what I've gathered. Though I'm a newb compared to the people here. Just going off what I've thought I've understood so far on my time here. lol
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