Owning 10 year old car is a good compromise between reliability and cost of ownership. Not 20 year old cars.
Is a hybrid right for my commute?
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I have a Prius V so I can only comment that vs a 4 cylinder corolla or a 6 cylinder IS 250.
The hybrid is very comfortable to drive and vibrate way less than another 4 cylinder car of the same displacement. Basically it cushion the vibration with the electric motor and only power just enough to drive the wheel / charge the battery. What shines is the slow speed driving and stop and go traffic, much quieter and vibrate only if battery runs low. I like it. Climbing hills on the other hand is the part that is very loud, way more than a 6 cylinder engine but still similar to another 4 cylinder.
Newer car always have good NVH vs old, but with Toyota's hybrid you are on CVT, which means your engine revs only as little compare to a 4 cylinder car with step transmission.
Guys, OP already weighed in. His kids ride in his car and he values safety so he’s going to stick with a newer car.
If you want to debate anything, debate the economics of a new vs sub-3 year old vehicle and Hybrid vs Regular drivetrains.
I’m squarely in the brand new Hybrid camp for OP’s situation. OP racks up the mileage so he will benefit from Toyota’s new 150K battery warranty coverage and with the used market being so hot, 2-3 year old hybrids are going for just as much as a new one. In addition, take the Camry LE vs Camry Hybrid LE; there is only a roughly $2,100 premium to move from a normal drivetrain up to a hybrid yet you get an estimated 14 more MPG with the hybrid. The difference for the hybrid should be paid for within 3.5 years based on OP’s usage.
If you want to debate anything, debate the economics of a new vs sub-3 year old vehicle and Hybrid vs Regular drivetrains.
I’m squarely in the brand new Hybrid camp for OP’s situation. OP racks up the mileage so he will benefit from Toyota’s new 150K battery warranty coverage and with the used market being so hot, 2-3 year old hybrids are going for just as much as a new one. In addition, take the Camry LE vs Camry Hybrid LE; there is only a roughly $2,100 premium to move from a normal drivetrain up to a hybrid yet you get an estimated 14 more MPG with the hybrid. The difference for the hybrid should be paid for within 3.5 years based on OP’s usage.
A new Camry non-hybrid is a 41mpg car, if he doesn’t do much city it is the winner here considering you save on both taxes and insurance
Louisiana bill to increase gas tax rejected while bill to extend sales tax increase advances
Saying something must be done to find the money to fix the state’s crumbling highways and dangerous bridges, the Louisiana House’s tax writing committee late Tuesday night rejected the latest
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As hybrids age they can have expensive repairs, a standard Camry not as much
The only “hybrid” that would significantly save money TCO (depending on his electric rates) would be the Prius Prime which can be purchased brand new after tax credits out of Rhode Island for about $19,000
A hybrid Camry once the $250 hybrid tax cuts in won’t save money over the non-hybrid that is exempt from the extra fees.
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Not sure if this is a consideration for the OP, but another thing to consider where I live is that a hybrid is allowed to go into the HOV lanes at any time, even if single occupant. This can save a lot of time during rush hour.
OPs area permits a PHEV or BEV (plug in) special considerations / potential rebates but you get to pay extra taxes for the potential benefits and no HOV access in LA without extra people in said car
State Policies Promoting Hybrid and Electric Vehicles
States are exploring policies to support hybrid and plug-in electric car adoption to increase energy security and reduce greenhouse gas emissions.
www.ncsl.org
No HOV lanes here and I never sit in traffic.
I rent them all the time, I average 32MPG. The base model Camry is noisy and I don't really like them. The MPG they achieve is partly due to the 40% efficient engine's soft throttle response and requires slow driving. Its annoying driving characteristics let me to place a block under the gas pedal to see if I was crazy, as the car kept slowing without me lifting my foot. Sure enough, the rental Camry lost speed without any throttle lift. I found it infuriating.
I was ONCE able to get really good MPG (near 40) at speeds well below the 65MPH speed limit. At typical highway speeds, it gets 36MPG and at my typical high speeds, and general driving, it gets 32MPG. In the thousands of miles I've driven rental Camry's, only one tank achieved anything near 40MPG, and that took an effort to achieve.
I will say this, the Camry gets superior MPG when compared to the equally noisy and slow Malibu. The Malibu gets 28 with me at the helm.
EDIT: The Accord 1.5t also gets 32 with me driving. I find the Accord a much more pleasant car.
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HOV lane is a location dependend thing, we had that 10 years ago but not anymore, not even for EV now (only discount if you are paying for the toll road HOV).
Hybrid will only cost 4k more for a new battery pack (labor included if I remember right) at 15 year / 200k or so. It will definitely beat the 2.5L mpg and it will definitely pay for itself over that long of an ownership (I do not believe 2.5L Camry will get 41mpg, more like 33-35, and I think Camry hybrid can easily get higher if my Prius V can get 40 practically, I think the 51mpg even if you tune it down to 44 would still be very much worth going for).
Hybrid will only cost 4k more for a new battery pack (labor included if I remember right) at 15 year / 200k or so. It will definitely beat the 2.5L mpg and it will definitely pay for itself over that long of an ownership (I do not believe 2.5L Camry will get 41mpg, more like 33-35, and I think Camry hybrid can easily get higher if my Prius V can get 40 practically, I think the 51mpg even if you tune it down to 44 would still be very much worth going for).
My old Cobalt XFE would seem to get 40mpg highway even at rather high speeds
I guess Toyota is now in the “inflatgate “ mode like Hyundai
Even still $250 of taxes buy at least 3000 miles of fuel not to mention that insurance is 25%+ higher on the hybrid
The fallacy in your argument is that I don't know anybody who buys a vehicle for "investment purposes". Buying a beater on this forum seems to be a badge of honor. The rest of us will just enjoy no wrenching and the other benefits of "newer vehicles". Enjoy the junk yard.......
Why would insurance be higher on the hybrid? If you get in a wreck is the exact same body panels, and I would think they would think a hybrid owner would be a more “responsible” driver.
I’ve never heard anywhere that hybrids cost 25% to insure? I got back to back quotes when shopping for my RAV4 and the hybrid was $18 less to insure every six months than the naturally aspirated model.
As for the “inflategate” comment. Toyota sold me a hybrid and said that I should expect 40 MPG average. So far I’ve been averaging 43.3 MPG over the past 32K miles. That’s with the seasonal temperature penalties and about 6K of high speed driving 80-112 MPH. So where are you getting that they are inflating their mileage figures?
Ya insurance here is not any more expensive.
One thing I have found with the prius, its very easy to meet/beat mpg claims. The wife is an aggressive driver, and we are beating the listed mpg claims buy about 5% atleast. Not sure if this is hybrid thing, or the revised way they come up with the mpg claims. Only other newish car was a 2015 200c with the 2.4 , and never got to rated mpg. Not sure when they changed the way they came up with test procedure?
read Cujets comments, he says his 41mpg highway car averages 32mpg on the highway
My experience with other cars was that I could usually beat the highway metric closing the gap between NA and hybrid drivetrain
For me hybrid and plug in PHEV vehicles have been much more expensive to insure and I’m told in collisions they are harder to repair if any portion of the drivetrain or cooling system is touched.
Maybe your state or insurance is odd or maybe you were overpaying for your naturally aspirated cars insurance
Cujet was talking about average MPG vs the other comments saying that the Camry gets 41 on the Highway. I can totally believe those figures. Every NA vehicle I’ve ever had gets below the EPA estimates while every hybrid I’ve owned has beaten the EPA estimates.
Every stick shift I have owned beats epa and every auto is below.
Here is my economy average after a fill up from putting around the city in my old stick shift car, it’s only rated about 37mpg (aka worse than Cujets car that gets 32)
Blame lobbiests for making the tests favor (exaggerating) automatic ICE
That said the RAV4 hybrid up here in the north is nowhere near epa highway in the fall through spring but city is spot on.
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Agreed. All hybrids including my RAV4 suffer from a winter temperature penalty. My spring through fall mileage is enough to counter the cold weather penalty. At least here in VA.
Ya but ANY car suffers a mileage hit in the winter....
