ICE vehicles will be 75% of US car market in 2025

[Torrid]

Let me clarify,

I think Ice can still grow - I dont think the cars are getting better.

The relentless slide is in them being ever more complex and hard to live with - (DPF/GPF/DI/ Dual injection/ small displacement turbos- start stop)

I believe EV's will continue to get better and cheaper and ice will continue to be harder to live with and more expensive and impart more compromise over time.

This is mostly why I went EV. I got tired of the workarounds for efficiency and I just can't stand the resulting start/stop. It's only going to get worse. I was stuck in traffic at a complete standstill this morning for 40 minutes waiting for a train to get out of my way and I didn't once think about how I'd have to defeat start/stop to keep the interior warm or deal with it starting and stopping to compensate for it. Also my vehicle has been the carpool vehicle for class and I get free charging at work. We get paid mileage while in class so it makes it a no brainer for all of us. If I want to get hippy dippy about it I can claim I'm saving the planet by the two riding with me not starting their cars for the day.

I'm legitimately amazed by the benefits I've gotten out of this vehicle. At this point there's absolutely no way I'd go back to ICE for a daily driver. Modern ones are just too annoying and old ones aren't reliable enough for my needs. I also wouldn't be having free gas given to me by my company.

 

[Torrid]

Yes, clearly people want CUV/ SUV now days. However to say my Rav4 is a "light truck" is laughable. Govco logic.

I really should have included that in my comment. For the most part any AWD crossover meets the standard to call it a light truck which is how manufacturers are able to skew the average for larger trucks that still have to be claimed for CAFE. I don't know if it's all companies but Ford for example shows that the FWD Escape counts as a car, but the AWD model is a light truck for emissions and CAFE purposes. My Model Y shows light truck on my registration as well.

 

[Torrid]

Unfortunately I agree, but there's always a ICE cars could get better. In any event it was a win imo, ICE will live on here in the USA longer, and I look forward to better times ahead.

We'll just be behind everyone else on EV development. Hopefully for the time being it'll be a net positive. I will say the only true downside to this is that most car companies that have to meet the metrics in other more strict countries likely won't make something special for us. I'm sure the stupid behemoth trucks will grow like no other as they only sell here.

 

[demarpaint]

We'll just be behind everyone else on EV development. Hopefully for the time being it'll be a net positive. I will say the only true downside to this is that most car companies that have to meet the metrics in other more strict countries likely won't make something special for us. I'm sure the stupid behemoth trucks will grow like no other as they only sell here.

That's your opinion here's mine. No we won't, people will just find it easier to buy what they want with this new administration. If anything the technology will improve because some of the pressure will be lifted from the automakers, and they won't be rushing pushing garbage out the door.

 

[supton]

I was stuck in traffic at a complete standstill this morning for 40 minutes waiting for a train

Wait a minute—don’t you work for a train something or another? I feel like there is some schadenfreude to had here.

 

[SC Maintenance]

We'll just be behind everyone else on EV development. Hopefully for the time being it'll be a net positive. I will say the only true downside to this is that most car companies that have to meet the metrics in other more strict countries likely won't make something special for us. I'm sure the stupid behemoth trucks will grow like no other as they only sell here.

Define we? Ford and GM? They have been behind on everything except full size pickups my entire life.

Stellantis is very global. What they do here is a tiny part of their story.

The Asians, VW, etc are all regrouping to figure out how they compete with BYD, et al - if they even can. Are they part of "we"?

Just trying to understand the framework. I think "we" are better off investing in other things - like AI, or infrastructure.

 

[Arc]

Batteries have got to get better before the EV's take off. My tool batteries are barely any better than when they first came out years ago. The only difference in tool batteries is the increase in price. I tried to charge a one year old battery yesterday and no surprise. ..to cold to charge....and all I got was the flashing red light on the charger and had to switch over to the old not so smart charger.

 

[LavaRand]

It's not like the EVs are unique in being politically favored/disfavored by the regime. The government dances on all the scales to call the winners and losers. People are super sure that EV have to be adopted "by market forces", whatever that means, but there's no market forces in isolation, not even for ICE vehicles. What cars are on the dealer lot are there because the government wants them to be there.

How the government decides whether something is a light truck, and therefore what the rules will be.

 

[Torrid]

Wait a minute—don’t you work for a train something or another? I feel like there is some schadenfreude to had here.

Yeah it’s a bad setup. There’s only one way in and out of our yard and the track going into Union Pacific yard blocks our entrance.

 

[Torrid]

Define we? Ford and GM? They have been behind on everything except full size pickups my entire life.

Stellantis is very global. What they do here is a tiny part of their story.

The Asians, VW, etc are all regrouping to figure out how they compete with BYD, et al - if they even can. Are they part of "we"?

Just trying to understand the framework. I think "we" are better off investing in other things - like AI, or infrastructure.

The US. You may have a point though. It doesn't seem like most of the major US brands are taking EVs seriously, though GM might be starting to catch traction. Of course full size trucks have done well. The government has went out of their way to support trucks to stay ahead of foreign truck options and even have a two staged CAFE standard.

 

[TumblrDucks]

What’s broadband access? My options are 3Mbps for $79/mo thru Frontier. It’s the only option where I live. No T3, DSL, Fiber, or cable. Period. I live 20 minutes from Muncie, Indiana, which is decidedly not “the sticks” considering it’s been an manufacturing center.

I also could get 4G hotspot for $120/mo, and speeds vary and frequently drop out even though the tower is 347 yards from my house. I ended up changing to Starlink for the same $120/mo and speeds vary some but bottom out about 120Mbps.

I was about to say if you are able to get starlink. Really a lifesaver.

 

[alarmguy]

The inaccurate title still drives me nuts, this is incorrect.
"ICE vehicles will be 75% of US car market in 2025"
Also lets not lose site that 2% of the vehicles on the road are EVs and the other 98% are fossil fuel. 35% of that 2% is in California.

IT SHOULD READ

ICE vehicles are forecast to make up 90% of US car market in 2025 and Electric Vehicles are forecast to make up 10% of the sales market.​

​

 

[UncleDave]

Here come the GPF's !

Maverick pickups equipped with the turbocharged 2.0L I-4 EcoBoost engine actually lost a bit of power – 12 horsepower, down to 238 versus 250 for the outgoing model. Now, we know why that’s the case.

“We’ve added a new gas particulate filter to meet emissions requirements, and this reduces the maximum horsepower that we can deliver,” Dawn McKenzie, manager of Ford’s truck communications, explained to Ford Authority
https://fordauthority.com/2024/08/h...,communications, explained to Ford Authority.

 

[UncleDave]

The inaccurate title still drives me nuts, this is incorrect.
"ICE vehicles will be 75% of US car market in 2025"
Also lets not lose site that 2% of the vehicles on the road are EVs and the other 98% are fossil fuel. 35% of that 2% is in California.

IT SHOULD READ

ICE vehicles are forecast to make up 90% of US car market in 2025 and Electric Vehicles are forecast to make up 10% of the sales market.​

​

I despise lazy data work.

 

[Snagglefoot]

I despise lazy data work.

Haha, one you accept that the auto press does not consider a hybrid vehicle to be a ICE vehicle you’ll be happier. Secondly, “ the market “ deals with new sales, not old history about what was sold in the last twenty years. Thirdly, as difficult as it is to accept, California is part of the USA.

 

[JeffKeryk]

The inaccurate title still drives me nuts, this is incorrect.
"ICE vehicles will be 75% of US car market in 2025"
Also lets not lose site that 2% of the vehicles on the road are EVs and the other 98% are fossil fuel. 35% of that 2% is in California.

IT SHOULD READ

ICE vehicles are forecast to make up 90% of US car market in 2025 and Electric Vehicles are forecast to make up 10% of the sales market.​

​

Well, which one gets more attention? Clicks for the win!

 

[E365]

The most disappointing part of this thread is that many people actually believe there is a Federal “EV mandate”. That’s never been a thing.

 

[Snagglefoot]

Folks are getting their shorts in a knot because the nomenclature is that a hybrid is not considered a ICE vehicle. Would you agree hybrids need their own classification separate from ICE vehicles? Hybrids tend to have city gas mileage numbers as high as their highway gas mileage numbers. Truly ICE vehicles cannot do that. Why in the world would you want to lump them in with ICE vehicles? Flame suit on.

 

[Torrid]

The most disappointing part of this thread is that many people actually believe there is a Federal “EV mandate”. That’s never been a thing.

I can give a hint to as who has told people that, but I don't want to make it political.

You're right though. There's never been a Federal mandate. California was the STATE that made it popular and apparently they've cancelled that out as I said would happen. As this thread has made mentioned to of tightening emissions standards, that's what will end the ICE cars. The crap that has been added to ICE cars is why I don't want to own one as far as living with it, let alone the extra costs.

 

[Snagglefoot]

The most disappointing part of this thread is that many people actually believe there is a Federal “EV mandate”. That’s never been a thing.

I believe the “mandate” word came from California, but there is a Chicken dinner for someone who can find that in a government quote. On the federal level there was this, which has recently been eliminated.