I'd be concerned about the warm-up plase of my driving. My typical driving is trips of 10-30 minutes. That means that most of my driving will be with the oil not up to full running temp. I am of the opinion that the first 10 minutes is where most of the engine wear occures. That being said, I would not be doing a good thing to use a heavy oil for my driving cycles. I will be doing the best for my engine by using the factory recomended viscosity of 5w or 10w30. Now if I'm trailer pulling long distances or driving across the desert with air temps at 110+F for hour after hour my manual says 30or40 single wt. or 15/50 is recomended. I will chose the oil viscosity based on my driving conditions that are recomended by the engineers/manufacture. If oil is $0.25 a quart and it's not good for my engine I will not use it. JMO
I just might try a monograde this summer
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I may run my Delo SAE 30 this summer (June through Sept/Oct), but normally I run 10w40 in summer, so I may thicken it up
with half a bottle of Schaeffer's 132 Moly EP Oil Treatment, which I believe is about 220 cSt at 100C.
BTW:
BTW:
I just looked it up. VR-1 Racing Oil comes in SAE 30, 40, 50, and 60 as well as 10w30 and 20w50. There also is a synthetic VR-1. Nice thing about VR-1 is 1300 ppm zinc and 1200 ppm phosphorus.
While I'm generally a fan of SAE 30HD use in warm temperatures, please note that Delo SAE 30 is an HDEO and has some healthy viscosity numbers.
Delo SAE 30 is 12.1 cSt @100C with a 104 VI index.
At 32F (0C) it is 1784 cSt.
50F (10C) it is 744 cSt.
68F (20C) it is 352 cSt.
And at 45F, Havoline 5W-30 is 354 cSt - an example of a start-up with 350 cSt oil.
So, while at 68F, start-ups & the driving cycle warm-up phase generate no real viscosity related problems, I would hesitate to use Delo SAE 30 below 50F and certainly not below 32F if a multi-viscosity oil were available.
The big advantage of an SAE 30 is it's resistance to heat in 90F+ summertime temps for a PCMO application, or in air cooled engines.
Delo SAE 30 is 12.1 cSt @100C with a 104 VI index.
At 32F (0C) it is 1784 cSt.
50F (10C) it is 744 cSt.
68F (20C) it is 352 cSt.
And at 45F, Havoline 5W-30 is 354 cSt - an example of a start-up with 350 cSt oil.
So, while at 68F, start-ups & the driving cycle warm-up phase generate no real viscosity related problems, I would hesitate to use Delo SAE 30 below 50F and certainly not below 32F if a multi-viscosity oil were available.
The big advantage of an SAE 30 is it's resistance to heat in 90F+ summertime temps for a PCMO application, or in air cooled engines.
Actually, it's more like 200cSt @68*F. 10W30 is roughly 350-360cSt @50*F. It's also roughy 735cSt @32*F. Most 10W30's can be recommended at/below freezing (it's in several of my auto's manuals). Your engine will not know the difference running SAE30 in the spring/summer/fall.
Also, alot of 10W30's shear to a high 20wt.
I rechecked my figures. 30 wt oil is an ISO 100 oil which is 10 cst. at 210F. At 68F it is 320 cSt. Mobil 10W-30 is 170 cST @68F. 10W-30's probably will stay a 30 wt. But that isn't much of an issue with respect to wear. You will probably get more wear on startup with a straight 30 wt. than the very minor shearing down of a 10W-30 wt.
Also, alot of 10W30's shear to a high 20wt.
I rechecked my figures. 30 wt oil is an ISO 100 oil which is 10 cst. at 210F. At 68F it is 320 cSt. Mobil 10W-30 is 170 cST @68F. 10W-30's probably will stay a 30 wt. But that isn't much of an issue with respect to wear. You will probably get more wear on startup with a straight 30 wt. than the very minor shearing down of a 10W-30 wt.
The more I read, the less worried I am. When the engine is hot, the Delo should perform similarly to a conventional 5 or 10-30 would. The cold start appears to be the hangup. I certainly won't worry in the summer, as it usually moves in the 85-100 degree range from May to October. For now, I mixed 2 quarts of Hav 5-20, and 2 of Delo 30 for the chilly weather. The viscosity calculator gives me:
69.1 @ 40c
9.8 @ 100c
VI 123
If I interpret the viscocity chart on the home page correctly, this gives me an oil in the 20 weight range when cold, or hot. In comparing with Mobil 7500 5-30, the viscosity from their website is :
cSt at 40°C 62.5
cSt at 100°C 10.6
VI 160
I don't think I am too far out of line with this oil, or my intended use. YMMV
69.1 @ 40c
9.8 @ 100c
VI 123
If I interpret the viscocity chart on the home page correctly, this gives me an oil in the 20 weight range when cold, or hot. In comparing with Mobil 7500 5-30, the viscosity from their website is :
cSt at 40°C 62.5
cSt at 100°C 10.6
VI 160
I don't think I am too far out of line with this oil, or my intended use. YMMV
If we assume that a good running oil temp is 180-210F then 100 F. is COLD oil in a COLD engine. That is one reason why the 0w & 5w & 10w oils are recomended is to get the oil to friction areas fast to reduce wear. Difficult for me to ignore the oil warm up phase for the daily driver. JMO
How about the visc. of 30wt Delo at 60 F compared to a 5W-30 at ~32 F?
If the Delo is not much thicker at 60 than a multigrade at freezing, then I would think start up engine wear wouldn't be that big an issue. After all, lots of cars see a long life even with long winters and cold starts.
If the Delo is not much thicker at 60 than a multigrade at freezing, then I would think start up engine wear wouldn't be that big an issue. After all, lots of cars see a long life even with long winters and cold starts.
I used to go to straight weights in the summer when I learned they would cut oil consumption of an old engine by a great deal.
I also used them in my cross country Greyhounds as warming up only happened once every 3,500 miles or so.
It may be interesting to see how it works for you.
I also used them in my cross country Greyhounds as warming up only happened once every 3,500 miles or so.
It may be interesting to see how it works for you.
TallPaul, how'd you get this engine so dirty? Sounds like someone has been taking dumps in your valve cover.
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That would be a monograde.
That would be a monograde.
Guy had it for 58,000 miles before I bought it. Not my fault.
I figure I will run just the Delo SAE 30 for a while, and then may put the #132 later.
Hey, I have run the following cleaning treatments on the '95 F150 4.9L inline six (has 128,000 miles):
One NAPA Mac's Engine Flush for 5 minutes
Double treatment and rinse cycles of Auto Rx
NAPA Synthetic oil for an OCI
Quart of Redline mixed into Maxlife for last 500 mles
200 mile 5w20 rinse
Still this engine is dirty! Maybe the HDEO will do something.
Hey, I have run the following cleaning treatments on the '95 F150 4.9L inline six (has 128,000 miles):
One NAPA Mac's Engine Flush for 5 minutes
Double treatment and rinse cycles of Auto Rx
NAPA Synthetic oil for an OCI
Quart of Redline mixed into Maxlife for last 500 mles
200 mile 5w20 rinse
Still this engine is dirty! Maybe the HDEO will do something.
Thanks. I have three gallons, so that is exactly what I could do. But, if blotters don't show it loading up, I will want to run it longer.
Quote:
If we assume that a good running oil temp is 180-210F then 100 F. is COLD oil in a COLD engine.
Here is the conversion.
Celsius Farenheit
40.00 104.00
50.00 122.00
60.00 140.00
70.00 158.00
80.00 176.00
90.00 194.00
100.00 212.00
You are correct that 100F is the "cold" oil spec.
[ February 07, 2006, 02:53 PM: Message edited by: beanoil ]
If we assume that a good running oil temp is 180-210F then 100 F. is COLD oil in a COLD engine.
Here is the conversion.
Celsius Farenheit
40.00 104.00
50.00 122.00
60.00 140.00
70.00 158.00
80.00 176.00
90.00 194.00
100.00 212.00
You are correct that 100F is the "cold" oil spec.
[ February 07, 2006, 02:53 PM: Message edited by: beanoil ]
I'm also thinking to try the monograde this summer. Finding a 30 wt. is a challange here and my cheap treasure is the Shell X100, SAE 30. It specs 10.8cSt @ 100°C so I don't expect to see an mpg drop for my cruiser-mode driving.
It is API SF/CC, says "formulated specifically for gasoline cars" though. It is dark and smeels like the ATF, a gun-powderish pungent smell like Mercon-V. I bet for the start-up considerations it has more ZDDP additives.
It also has %(wt) 0.6 sulfatted ash, which is less than half the best oils spec.! What would this give?
It is API SF/CC, says "formulated specifically for gasoline cars" though. It is dark and smeels like the ATF, a gun-powderish pungent smell like Mercon-V. I bet for the start-up considerations it has more ZDDP additives.
It also has %(wt) 0.6 sulfatted ash, which is less than half the best oils spec.! What would this give?
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