Housing prices, other issues---People are avoiding moving to Denver

[GON]

Watched a video from Denver7, stating " People are avoiding moving to Denver".

What the video failed to capture is Denver/ Colorado 24 months ago became the second highest housing cost state in the US, only Hawaii was higher. The greater Denver area can forever build new housing forever east/ south/ north, so the sky-high housing costs didn't make sense.

We were in need of interim housing 18 months ago. Although we have grandchildren on the greater Denver area, we avoided buying an interim home in the greater Denver area because the housing costs at that time seemed like a poor value proposition- higher risk than other areas for short term home ownership.

 

[NiwradND]

Was wondering about Denver. Our friends that had pot smoking kids are moving to Colorado, and then other classmates that were living there for years are moving back out of Denver as they are complaining how drugs have ruined the state??

 

[Chipdumper]

I recently moved out of metro Denver (Lakewood) a few months ago back to the Midwest. I was there for about 18 months on a work assignment. I had the option to stay for perpetuity but my wife and I LAUGHED at the affordability and quality of life. The apartment we rented was $2500/mo all-in for a one-bedroom with two parking garage spaces. We have zero mortgage and zero car payments and paid cash for our house in WI. And trust me - I would totally stay in Denver for the rest of my life EXCEPT when it comes to actual costs of living. A “starter home” in the Denver area is $500-700k. Yup, my young colleagues at work had zero apprehension on getting a note for 500k+ at 7%. I always threw at them the concept of LEAVING COLORADO and living like a King/Queen elsewhere in a nice area. It’s nice to actually have disposable income to buy nice furniture, electronics, etc. The USA is a big place (I’ve moved five times with my employer all over the USA and world so it’s easy for me to say). Meanwhile my wife and I going bananas after doing some budgeting on how much cash flow we would have buying a home in DEN even after selling our WI house and putting 20% down. We gross 200k and have kids part time. Living/buying Denver (in the 2020’s) is just a GD fantasy. The homeowners insurance premiums rival the Florida coast. Auto insurance is almost double that of WI. Utilities? Power is about 25% higher than WI and then the whole water thing. Colorado is akin to California with water shortage issues and it tastes like garbage. I had zero water bill in WI as artesian wells are everywhere; you can hand drive a sand point in two hours start to cleanup. As the old saying goes, “it’s a nice place to visit but I wouldn’t want to live there”. I relocated from the second “most expensive place to live in the USA” to the second from the BOTTOM of that list and we love it. Zero riff raff, zero trouble, cheap land, and milder weather than MI/WI where I’m from.

 

[duck__dodgers]

people want to live on the mountain-facing side of Denver, and all the good land near jobs/amenities are gone.

Not the prairie side unless you run a planespotter website. Classic supply demand.

Denver is a lot like Phoenix or Las Vegas....lots and lots of transplants, seemingly more than natives

 

[walterjay]

I remember back in the 90's when Denver was growing rapidly. There was a shortage of skilled tradesmen. One guy I know moved there. He got something like a 15K bonus to take the job in construction. Said he would get an additional 10K bonus if he brought someone like him along.
Plumbers were in short supply. One plumber said he had more work than he could handle. A fast food place was being built and he was asked to bid it. He didn't want it for being overwhelmed. He figured the job and then quoted double the price. He was awarded the job.
I guess those were the Denver glory days.

 

[Vercingetorix]

3 million people live there. It must be terrible.

 

[alarmguy]

deleted

 

[CKN]

I recently moved out of metro Denver (Lakewood) a few months ago back to the Midwest. I was there for about 18 months on a work assignment. I had the option to stay for perpetuity but my wife and I LAUGHED at the affordability and quality of life. The apartment we rented was $2500/mo all-in for a one-bedroom with two parking garage spaces. We have zero mortgage and zero car payments and paid cash for our house in WI. And trust me - I would totally stay in Denver for the rest of my life EXCEPT when it comes to actual costs of living. A “starter home” in the Denver area is $500-700k. Yup, my young colleagues at work had zero apprehension on getting a note for 500k+ at 7%. I always threw at them the concept of LEAVING COLORADO and living like a King/Queen elsewhere in a nice area. It’s nice to actually have disposable income to buy nice furniture, electronics, etc. The USA is a big place (I’ve moved five times with my employer all over the USA and world so it’s easy for me to say). Meanwhile my wife and I going bananas after doing some budgeting on how much cash flow we would have buying a home in DEN even after selling our WI house and putting 20% down. We gross 200k and have kids part time. Living/buying Denver (in the 2020’s) is just a GD fantasy. The homeowners insurance premiums rival the Florida coast. Auto insurance is almost double that of WI. Utilities? Power is about 25% higher than WI and then the whole water thing. Colorado is akin to California with water shortage issues and it tastes like garbage. I had zero water bill in WI as artesian wells are everywhere; you can hand drive a sand point in two hours start to cleanup. As the old saying goes, “it’s a nice place to visit but I wouldn’t want to live there”. I relocated from the second “most expensive place to live in the USA” to the second from the BOTTOM of that list and we love it. Zero riff raff, zero trouble, cheap land, and milder weather than MI/WI where I’m from.

A starter home in the Greater Salt Lake Valley where anyone wants to live is also $500,000+

 

[loneryder]

A young couple just bought their first home next to my GF for $900k. Where do they get the money??

 

[Dave Hess]

Ultimately people move to areas where the jobs are at.

A young couple just bought their first home next to my GF for $900k. Where do they get the money??

Bank of Mom & Dad

We helped with 3 down payments for our adult children to buy their home.
Zero money given for any wedding.

 

[rijndael]

A young couple just bought their first home next to my GF for $900k. Where do they get the money??

I know a lot of younger couples, mid 20s, having a combined income north of 250K.

 

[Dave Hess]

people want to live on the mountain-facing side of Denver, and all the good land near jobs/amenities are gone.

Not the prairie side unless you run a planespotter website. Classic supply demand.

Denver is a lot like Phoenix or Las Vegas....lots and lots of transplants, seemingly more than natives

Denver might be the next Seattle….

 

[Astro14]

I know a lot of younger couples, mid 20s, having a combined income north of 250K.

Which gets you into a starter home at $700K, if you don’t mind being house-poor on 250K/year.

 

[97prizm]

Watched a video from Denver7, stating " People are avoiding moving to Denver".

What the video failed to capture is Denver/ Colorado 24 months ago became the second highest housing cost state in the US, only Hawaii was higher. The greater Denver area can forever build new housing forever east/ south/ north, so the sky-high housing costs didn't make sense.

We were in need of interim housing 18 months ago. Although we have grandchildren on the greater Denver area, we avoided buying an interim home in the greater Denver area because the housing costs at that time seemed like a poor value proposition- higher risk than other areas for short term home ownership.

As of October 2025 Denver's average housing price has dropped from $675,000 to $655,000.

 

[4wd]

I know a lot of younger couples, mid 20s, having a combined income north of 250K.

So do I - but they buy a first home for $400k in Houston burbs …

 

[Bob in Utah]

A young couple just bought their first home next to my GF for $900k. Where do they get the money??

Not having 20% down I’m sure

PMI mortgage insurance probably for the life of the 50 year note

No thank you to Denver Colorado

 

[Chipdumper]

What was the old rule as far as income to mortgage ratio? Five times? Whatever ratio it is today has to be severely affected by the substantial cost of many other factors like food, energy, and even entertainment costs. The world is evolving at a faster rate than ever. Wealth measured by the value of what’s in the bank/IRA/real estate may be meaningless in the next ten years, if not sooner. The old experts that told the 80’s kids to calm down about automation always brought up the invention of the tractor how it changed the agrarian society etc. Well it’s a totally different ballgame when everything but a select group of manual trades are left for humans to actually do…for now.

 

[Astro14]

What was the old rule as far as income to mortgage ratio? Five times? Whatever ratio it is today has to be severely affected by the substantial cost of many other factors like food, energy, and even entertainment costs. The world is evolving at a faster rate than ever. Wealth measured by the value of what’s in the bank/IRA/real estate may be meaningless in the next ten years, if not sooner. The old experts that told the 80’s kids to calm down about automation always brought up the invention of the tractor how it changed the agrarian society etc. Well it’s a totally different ballgame when everything but a select group of manual trades are left for humans to actually do…for now.

The old rule was 2.5 times annual gross. Max 30% of monthly to a mortgage, max 35% of monthly to debt service.

So, either the kids buying a $700,000 starter home are making $250K+ - or they are way over extended.

 

[SC Maintenance]

What was the old rule as far as income to mortgage ratio? Five times? Whatever ratio it is today has to be severely affected by the substantial cost of many other factors like food, energy, and even entertainment costs. The world is evolving at a faster rate than ever. Wealth measured by the value of what’s in the bank/IRA/real estate may be meaningless in the next ten years, if not sooner. The old experts that told the 80’s kids to calm down about automation always brought up the invention of the tractor how it changed the agrarian society etc. Well it’s a totally different ballgame when everything but a select group of manual trades are left for humans to actually do…for now.

Current Fannie Mae underwriting is 45% Debt to Income max for the mortgage, 50% total. You can go higher but thats a process.

Minimum down is only 3%. So doing the math - 700K house, $679K loan, back of napkin says thats $4500 a month. So income requirement would be around $10K / month or $120K per year.

At that payment you would be flat out broke / house poor. But never fear, 50 year mortgage is on its way.

 

[supton]

But never fear, 50 year mortgage is on its way.

While I have my fears of a 50 year mortgage, to play devil's advocate, young professionals just starting out could have the chance to lock in a house price early on while watching their income rise as the years/decades pass by. They could pay down principal as income improves in the future.

Most won't, but in theory, some could. Those who won't will become the next generation of renters. Not sure how I'd place my bets on how 50 year mortgages will play out...

Prior to federally backed mortgages, weren't most mortgages interest only? [Albeit a 5 year year term.] A 50 year mortgage isn't far removed from that. Seems like a regression to older times.