Honda Ultimate 0w-20 vs?

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Only being slightly picky here because this is my first new car, 2022 Civic Sport Touring, 1.5L Direct Injected Turbo CVT. I'm not a crazy driver, normally used Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy in my old 2012 Prius just fine. Plan to use the Honda 15400 factory filters either way, but wondering if I should go out of my way to run the Honda Ultimate 0w-20 or stuff like Mobil is close enough not to bother. I drive 10-12000 miles per year, willing to change the oil more often but looking to minimize the inherent issues that these DI Turbo engines can sometimes have (oil dilution, carbon buildup). I was told to look for something with a GF-6 or GF-6a rating, which the Mobil advanced fuel economy does have.
 
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I would go with 5000 mile oil change intervals.
This^^^
If you are set on staying with 0W-20, then get the best 0W-20 you can afford. Something along the lines of HPL, Amsoil, Redline oils.
Cheaper 0W-20 oils will get you through the warranty period, but usually soon after oil consumption issues start to happen.
Also, Honda doesn't seem to be in the hurry to fix their fuel dilution issues. These fuel dilution issues are amplified in cars that are short trippers, although many highway warriors get them too. On Honda-specific forums many owners found a recipe that cuts fuel dilution issues to a minimum and prevents wear-related oil consumption issues at higher mileages. That recipe is 91/93 Octane in the gas tank, and 5w40/0w40 in the crankcase. While higher octane is more expensive upfront - the ECU does make the engine more fuel efficient on it, so overall cost isn't as significant as it seems.
Good luck with your new ride! Wishing you many trouble-free years of ownership.
 
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This^^^
If you are set on staying with 0W-20, then get the best 0W-20 you can afford. Something along the lines of HPL, Amsoil, Redline oils.
Cheaper 0W-20 oils will get you through the warranty period, but usually soon after oil consumption issues start to happen.
Also, Honda doesn't seem to be in the hurry to fix their fuel dilution issues. These fuel dilution issues are amplified in cars that are short trippers, although many highway warriors get them too. On Honda-specific forums many owners found a recipe that cuts fuel dilution issues to a minimum and prevents wear-related oil consumption issues at higher mileages. That recipe is 91/93 Octane in the gas tank, and 5w40/0w40 in the crankcase. While higher octane is more expensive upfront - the ECU does make the engine more fuel efficient on it, so overall cost isn't as significant as it seems.
Good luck with your new ride! Wishing you many trouble-free years of ownership.

I have yet to see a Honda forum that backs these “solutions” with anything resembling objective evidence. Nor have I seen anything that suggests a steady diet of anything but 0w-20, sensible OCIs and top-tier 87 octane fuel shortens engine life. I understand 30 or 40 weight oils and premium fuel won’t hurt and make make owners feel better, but beyond that?
 
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Hindsight is always 20:20

No need to use the Honda filters or their oil.

The 6 month interval at 5k-6k miles is a smart choice, unless an oil life monitors says 'earlier'.

Philly has cool winters. If you're a short tripper, I'd ignore Honda maintenance and be very proactive and aggressive with maintenance unless or until you gather UOA data to prove otherwise. UOA isn't feasible for all.

The only way one could answer what grade to use is to monitor your fuel dilution, if any, and spike the viscosity of the oil for that film thickness.

Premium fuel vs regular depends on driver expectations and cheapness. All my turbo'd gassers always ran premium since it was a no-brainer. Some want to ride the threshold of tuning and knock sensors. Others don't. Regardless of grade you choose, toptier fuel should be considered. You're not a 'crazy' driver. Can I sell you on at least a midgrade?

Going to offend the environmentalists.... but recommend an early <1000 mile break-in change too.

If engine is GDI only, spray a can of intake valve/turbo cleaner into it yearly.

If it were mine, I'd have no problem using a full synthetic SP/GF6 5w30 or 0w30 oil. Beyond that, I'd research the issues that higher mileage owners are reporting. Hoping that Honda has tuned the 1.5t better now.
 
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I would drive short intervals of 7500 kilometres and then change the oil. 0W20 is perfectly sufficient for the engine. Avoiding short distances would be beneficial for every vehicle, especially with this one. Original honda 0W20, mobile 1 0W20 would, I think, work well
 
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I would drive short intervals of 7500 kilometres and then change the oil. 0W20 is perfectly sufficient for the engine. Avoiding short distances would be beneficial for every vehicle, especially with this one. Original honda 0W20, mobile 1 0W20 would, I think, work well
As long as it’s not significantly diluted by fuel. That’s a good thing to know since MOFT always wins.
 
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This^^^
If you are set on staying with 0W-20, then get the best 0W-20 you can afford. Something along the lines of HPL, Amsoil, Redline oils.
Cheaper 0W-20 oils will get you through the warranty period, but usually soon after oil consumption issues start to happen.
Also, Honda doesn't seem to be in the hurry to fix their fuel dilution issues. These fuel dilution issues are amplified in cars that are short trippers, although many highway warriors get them too. On Honda-specific forums many owners found a recipe that cuts fuel dilution issues to a minimum and prevents wear-related oil consumption issues at higher mileages. That recipe is 91/93 Octane in the gas tank, and 5w40/0w40 in the crankcase. While higher octane is more expensive upfront - the ECU does make the engine more fuel efficient on it, so overall cost isn't as significant as it seems.
Good luck with your new ride! Wishing you many trouble-free years of ownership.
+1
Per Honda India for the Honda "Jazz", they clearly state that 0w30 or 5w 30 can easily be used as a replacement.
They even suggest using 10w30 in temps above -20C (-4F) and most importantly that "0w20 oil is formulated to improve fuel economy"
To me, that reads as "if fuel economy is more important to you than engine longevity, use 0w20"
If I'm reading that incorrectly, please let me know what message writers intended to convey - other than the obvious
https://www.hondacarindia.com/ownersmanual/webom/eng/jazz/2016/details/106278046-13011
🤷‍♂️
 
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SammyChevelleTypeS3

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Only being slightly picky here because this is my first new car, 2022 Civic Sport Touring, 1.5L Direct Injected Turbo CVT. I'm not a crazy driver, normally used Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy in my old 2012 Prius just fine. Plan to use the Honda 15400 factory filters either way, but wondering if I should go out of my way to run the Honda Ultimate 0w-20 or stuff like Mobil is close enough not to bother. I drive 10-12000 miles per year, willing to change the oil more often but looking to minimize the inherent issues that these DI Turbo engines can sometimes have (oil dilution, carbon buildup). I was told to look for something with a GF-6 or GF-6a rating, which the Mobil advanced fuel economy does have.
That Honda Ultimate 0w20 oil seems way too expensive to use for short oci. They also do not seem to share one bit of information to explain why you should use it and pay such a hefty (near $19 a quart for it). I do like and keep about 6-8 of the Honda 15400 filters on hand to use.
The ones I have are made by Honeywell and are really solid looking filters. They have the holes and not the simple crimps on the inside. I started out using Amsoil as I have been using for years on other cars until I found out about the oil/fuel dilution issues with the 1.5 like you have in my Accord. I have since gone to using Castrol Edge 0w20 and 3300 to 3500 mi oci. I may end up using Mobil 1 0w30 if I can find it in my local stores.
Good luck. You should enjoy your vehicle - just keep a close eye on that oil level and oci.
 

CleanSump

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+1
Per Honda India for the Honda "Jazz", they clearly state that 0w30 or 5w 30 can easily be used as a replacement.
They even suggest using 10w30 in temps above -20C (-4F) and most importantly that "0w20 oil is formulated to improve fuel economy"
To me, that reads as "if fuel economy is more important to you than engine longevity, use 0w20"
If I'm reading that incorrectly, please let me know what message writers intended to convey - other than the obvious
https://www.hondacarindia.com/ownersmanual/webom/eng/jazz/2016/details/106278046-13011
🤷‍♂️
Per Honda USA: "Use a genuine engine oil or another commercial engine oil of suitable type and viscosity (for the ambient temperature) as shown in the image that follows." The only viscosity shown is 0W-20.
Someone always suggests somebody else throw their warranty out the window.
 
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That Honda Ultimate 0w20 oil seems way too expensive to use for short oci. They also do not seem to share one bit of information to explain why you should use it and pay such a hefty (near $19 a quart for it). I do like and keep about 6-8 of the Honda 15400 filters on hand to use.
The ones I have are made by Honeywell and are really solid looking filters. They have the holes and not the simple crimps on the inside. I started out using Amsoil as I have been using for years on other cars until I found out about the oil/fuel dilution issues with the 1.5 like you have in my Accord. I have since gone to using Castrol Edge 0w20 and 3300 to 3500 mi oci. I may end up using Mobil 1 0w30 if I can find it in my local stores.
Good luck. You should enjoy your vehicle - just keep a close eye on that oil level and oci.
After a lot of research, multiple UOA'S showing both Mobil1 0W-20 EP and AFE thinned below grade by 3000 miles, a conversation with my Honda Service Advisor and the Honda Certified Master Technician that does the service on both of our CR-V'S, reccomended Mobil1 AFE 0W-30 and 3-3500 mile OCI's. (Also suggested by @kschachn ) Needed to stay with an API rated GF-6 oil as our Hondas have extended warranty coverage. The 0W-30 is still thinned below grade at 3k (52.7 [email protected]) , but still within the range of the 0w20 that was running 46.5 at the same intervals. I was able to find the M1 0W-30 AFE at Walmart, Advance and AZ only carry the European Formula. As much as Honda dodges this issue, there are a crap-ton of 1 5t engines is out there still spinning with 200k+ miles.
BTY, when at 3000 miles the UOA shows thinning below grade and the Honda MM happily informs me my oil life is at 60-70% I'm very aware that it's an algorithm to be taken with a grain of salt.
 
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SammyChevelleTypeS3

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Yeah. I shortened my oci to 3300 to 3500 range and things improved a tad. I am certain a few heads will explode and I will be asked "how dare I say that without PROOF." Sorry.... no proof just what I am experiencing as I watch over it like a baby. I have stuck so far wth 0w20 while in warranty. I actually already have boxes of 0w30 in my garage for later down the road. I don't think any major (and popular) automaker such as Honda would be able to keep it a secret from the media if there were suddenly a rash of engine failures with tons of folks raising hell. So for now we are just using the car and enjoying it. The more we talk about these cars and I pay attention to things I am amazed at the amount of the same model Honda Accords + Civics I see when I travel a few miles from the house to run errands. I mean the latest model is all over the place here. Nearly 1 out of 4-5 cars I see are Honda Accords or Civics. So at that rate if things start going kaboom! I dont think we will have any problem finding out about it. Another point of thought is this. I would bet a good 70% maybe even more people at BITOG are auto geeks like me. In other words we probably obsess and over do as much predictive and preventive maintenance on our vehicles as we can fit into our lives. On the other hand I am certain many of us here know a host of people who could care less what goes where and into what part of their car. Give them the keys and they are OFF! Zoom! No look or least concern about what the tires look like. Do they look low? When did I check of add pressure if ever? What oil is in my car? Who changed it and checked under the hood last or what did or should they even check? We know those people. There are plenty of them out there. So it seems to me with the amount of these dilluter cars running all over the roads (and they been out and selling for some years now) we should be hearing reports of implosions, breakdowns, complaints etc.... all over the news and especially social media since there are a bunch of folks driving them who likley are totally unaware of what we been going on and on about here. Wife loves her car. Matter of fact it seems to turn out it is our favorite Accord Exl we have owned since the 90s and we have owned (2) at all times since 1997 even when I had work trucks and other vehicles at home. As we bought new we passed the older down to the sons. I had a host of worries and questions / obsessions about these GDI engines when I learned thats what we ended up with. Most of all the quesions and worries have been put to bed by so many of the good knowledgeable folks here. Even those who been here forever and a day, who HATE or nearly have a BRAIN SEIZURE when a newbie asks a quesion thats been covered to death, they are still nice enough to share what they know. Lets enjoy our vehicles and thanks to those who keep sharing
again and again. :geek:
 
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On Honda-specific forums many owners found a recipe that cuts fuel dilution issues to a minimum and prevents wear-related oil consumption issues at higher mileages. While higher octane is more expensive upfront - the ECU does make the engine more fuel efficient on it,
If this were even remotely true, every manufacturer would move to requiring premium unleaded, and EPA would outlaw anything under that.

If your claim that higher octane made the engine “more fuel efficient”, running straight ethanol would far outpace any mileage available with gasoline since it’s about 105 octane. That is not even remotely true.
 
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Interesting thing is on one major CRV forum, moderators won't even allow that subject to me discussed, they simpley state that Honda has solved the issue, no further discussion allowed. My Honda Service Advisor informs me that MANY Honda 1.5t"s come in for service with oil high on the dipstick and reeking of fuel. When a UOA shows significant thinning out of grade at 3k miles and the MM is indicating 70% oil life, something ain't right..
Of further interest, the base viscosity of M1 5W-30 EP is lower than M1 0W-30 AFE. So staying wit 0w-3]0 for now. Have also given up on the filter battle ,using the Honda A02 rock catcher, with 3.5k OCI's what difference does it make? Engine runs fine getting 30+ mpg.
 
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Per Honda USA: "Use a genuine engine oil or another commercial engine oil of suitable type and viscosity (for the ambient temperature) as shown in the image that follows." The only viscosity shown is 0W-20.
Someone always suggests somebody else throw their warranty out the window.
I'm not suggesting anyone do anything they are not comfortable with.
I'm merely sharing my thoughts and opinion.
Nothing more, nothing less.
🤷‍♂️
 
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Interesting thing is on one major CRV forum, moderators won't even allow that subject to me discussed, they simpley state that Honda has solved the issue, no further discussion allowed. My Honda Service Advisor informs me that MANY Honda 1.5t"s come in for service with oil high on the dipstick and reeking of fuel. When a UOA shows significant thinning out of grade at 3k miles and the MM is indicating 70% oil life, something ain't right..
Of further interest, the base viscosity of M1 5W-30 EP is lower than M1 0W-30 AFE. So staying wit 0w-3]0 for now. Have also given up on the filter battle ,using the Honda A02 rock catcher, with 3.5k OCI's what difference does it make? Engine runs fine getting 30+ mpg.
I still maintain that william is a Honda shill...there's no way he can't be.
 
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