Home Fuel Oil is Insane Right Now in NYS

[alarmguy]

Not to rub salt in a wound, as I posted already 4 years worth of the months gas bill on the first page of this thread in post #9
We have gas heat on the main level but second level rarely used heat pump.
One might wonder what our electric bill is, typically runs around $80 to $90 a month in the winter.
Im always surprised because until moving off Long Island NY this never happened.
Our electric company EVERY year, refunds us money that they didnt need to use. So this months electric bill $26.

 

[brianl703]

Well, if we're comparing utility bills... This is an all-electric 3300sq ft house heated with a heat pump located in a rural area west of DC, with well water and an advanced treatment septic system(so there's electricity needed to run those pumps). Overnight lows in the winter are often below 25F.

And this also includes the electricity to charge a Chevy Volt that's driven 10 to 25 miles per day.

 

[RhondaHonda]

I averaged 134 therms a month for 2021. Used the pool heater a handful of times, 4 NG furnaces, 3 NG water heaters, gas cooktop/ovens and a family of 5. To be fair, 1 water heater and furnace is set very low or off most of the year except for a month to 6 weeks. My average gas bill for 2021 was $113/month.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Called oil company today for an oil delivery, the price of home heating oil here is $5.49... Road diesel is ~$4.60, why is untaxed heating oil above the price of taxed road diesel? Is there any real reason we can think of?

My tank is at one quarter of a tank, which will cost me $1512.00 to fill my tank. ***

You are not going to fill your tank. You are going to get 150gal.

I've never got more than 210 gal in a near empty 275 tank. 50 gal is not used

so, $823.00 today and likely under $750 in two weeks. Then back to "normal" on the next fill.

I am at a 1/3 tank and holding off a couple weeks to see if things improve.

___________________

Just checked my supplier is currently $4.499/gal

 

[Snagglefoot]

You need to switch to a greener form of heating, as oil heating is not liked by the politicians in the NYS government

Yep, even worse here. Because BC has HYdro they want you off natural gas.

 

[HankHill]

You are not going to fill your tank. You are going to get 150gal.

I've never got more than 210 gal in a near empty 275 tank. 50 gal is not used

so, $823.00 today and likely under $750 in two weeks. Then back to "normal" on the next fill.

I am at a 1/3 tank and holding off a couple weeks to see if things improve.

___________________

Just checked my supplier is currently $4.499/gal

I completely ran out of oil in my tank in January.. The fill was for 200 gallons and read between 3/4 and full, and yes I know these gauges are very inaccurate. I agree that I will never get a delivery of 275, I guess I was typing before thinking.

So you're in NH and your current oil cost is $4.50 a gallon? Christ, we're paying $1.19 more than you are.. Everything I've seen or heard of NH has been a dream to me. If I could sell my house I would move there in a heartbeat.

What's the drawback to living there? Maybe wages are less in the area? Lack of employment in the area?

 

[Zee09]

I completely ran out of oil in my tank in January.. The fill was for 200 gallons and read between 3/4 and full, and yes I know these gauges are very inaccurate. I agree that I will never get a delivery of 275, I guess I was typing before thinking.

So you're in NH and your current oil cost is $4.50 a gallon? Christ, we're paying $1.19 more than you are.. Everything I've seen or heard of NH has been a dream to me. If I could sell my house I would move there in a heartbeat.

What's the drawback to living there? Maybe wages are less in the area? Lack of employment in the area?

The only drawback would be having Arco as your neighbor...

 

[HankHill]

As long as he didn't complain about my shooting, we'd get along fine..

 

[supton]

Housing can be a problem. Followed by property taxes.

 

[HankHill]

Housing can be a problem. Followed by property taxes.

Are the taxes higher than average there? Do they sneakily make up for the lack of sales tax by charging you higher taxes? I always wondered how they were able to eliminate sales tax there.. I guess they raise your property and school taxes to compensate for lost income from lack of sales tax?

 

[Donald]

Home heating oil prices are not the biggest issue for people living in NY have to deal with. Property & income & sales tax.

 

[HankHill]

Home heating oil prices are not the biggest issue for people living in NY have to deal with. Property & income & sales tax.

Oh you're not kidding on the taxes here... Its horrible. Town, county, school literally break me for six months after they get paid (always late). I just can't keep up with all the crap that comes at me now..

 

[chrlsful]

here (aint it nation wide?) #2 (home heating/diesel truck) in the vehicle w/o rd tax (color) = 10,000$ fine, no? We chance it/ There is a 55gal bucket on the shop floor sealed tight). Boss uses wood heat so it may go in trucks or B fired thru the Becket gun for space heat, not sure...

 

[HankHill]

Turn in your Hank Hill Badge. He’s a propane man.

I mean there's oil in Texas, so I guess he'd be cool with it. I just can't ever cook with charcoal that would be disrespectful to him (mike judge)!!

 

[HankHill]

here (aint it nation wide?) #2 (home heating/diesel truck) in the vehicle w/o rd tax (color) = 10,000$ fine, no? We chance it/ There is a 55gal bucket on the shop floor sealed tight). Boss uses wood heat so it may go in trucks or B fired thru the Becket gun for space heat, not sure...

Update on my quest to not get molested by oil prices anymore... Still going through with natural gas availability and meeting with the neighbors.. Called a company that sells outdoor boiler units. All the outdoor boilers they sell now have to meet the strict new EPA standards they put in place a few years ago. These new units are at a minimum double the cost of the older units in the same BTU output rating. The smallest "new" unit they sell would be around $13k just in the cost for the stand alone unit.
For example before the emissions regulations that same BTU output unit would be about $6k for the standalone. I could have paid for one of the older units, but these new units are out of reach of my financial capabilities.
he did tell me I could get an indoor coal spec'd unit and put it outside and still burn wood for about again $6k, but I'd have to pour a slab, build a shed and run power out to it and pay for all the extra install parts such as the heat exchanger, piping, etc.. I may just do that this summer..
But I've been searching and it looks like there are plenty of outdoor boilers for sale in various states of disrepair and the prices seem better than new, but all the used units look like junk.. I would guess the liners would be used up too.. So the price of a good used unit after all the issues it may or may not have, would run me a total of about somewhere in the $4300 range for a used unit with older controls and less efficient blower would run about $1600 less than the new coal indoor unit placed outside. Might as well pay for the new unit at that difference in cost. Then I really got to thinking, if the power went out with any of these forms of heat, I'd be screwed..
Now I'm re-considering one of my original thoughts of heat in an emergency.. A standard wood stove doesn't need any power and I can run it in combination with my furnace in the basement. I'd have to get the chimney lined and buy a used or new stove depending on price and size.
I'm calling the local chimney company and getting someone out for a generic quote of the chimney lining cost.

Think I can get a decent large capacity wood stove used for about $400 dollars. I'm guessing lining the chimney (above 2nd story 12 12 pitched roof apex) would be about $1400. And wood is free for me, orchard has tons of wood around.. Maybe I'd build a wood splitter from some plans online. So I'm guessing total cost of wood stove capability would be about maybe $2500 with a wood splitter included.
I grew up with a wood stove in the house, I know what it feels like to have your bedroom window open when its 10* outside, because the entire house is 90* from the **** stove.. And what its like to have super dry air in the house.

 

[Rmay635703]

Derelict CNG tanks can be found for $100 on up

Not a lot of capacity but if you have $2gge gas at a pump nearby could work as a supplemental fuel

 

[hank2]

I completely ran out of oil in my tank in January.. The fill was for 200 gallons and read between 3/4 and full, and yes I know these gauges are very inaccurate. I agree that I will never get a delivery of 275, I guess I was typing before thinking.

So you're in NH and your current oil cost is $4.50 a gallon? Christ, we're paying $1.19 more than you are.. Everything I've seen or heard of NH has been a dream to me. If I could sell my house I would move there in a heartbeat.

What's the drawback to living there? Maybe wages are less in the area? Lack of employment in the area?

FWIW, I've had 3 new "275" oil tanks lifetime. On each occasion they took 249-250 to completely fill. The most recent was 19 years ago so I don't know if that still holds. I can usually estimate within +/- 10 gals. of what a fill up will take from my cheesy gauge.

I got a fill up of No. 2 one month ago and paid $3.40 a gal. It's now about $4.65. For the past 3 or 4 years I paid an average of $2.40 a gal. April futures contracts for heating oil are now at $4.09 a gal for huge wholesale.

The ULS heating oil (same thing as the current diesel fuel) is bad news on lubricity for the burner pumps. It's mandated in NY state but not in Pa. It's what they're quietly selling as heating oil here for some years. You have to add biocide or it quickly goes bad. I do, which adds some lubricity but I've still had to have two $$ pumps replaced in the past 6 or 7 years.

 

[HankHill]

FWIW, I've had 3 new "275" oil tanks lifetime. On each occasion they took 249-250 to completely fill. The most recent was 19 years ago so I don't know if that still holds. I can usually estimate within +/- 10 gals. of what a fill up will take from my cheesy gauge.

I got a fill up of No. 2 one month ago and paid $3.40 a gal. It's now about $4.65. For the past 3 or 4 years I paid an average of $2.40 a gal. April futures contracts for heating oil are now at $4.09 a gal for huge wholesale.

The ULS heating oil (same thing as the current diesel fuel) is bad news on lubricity for the burner pumps. It's mandated in NY state but not in Pa. It's what they're quietly selling as heating oil here for some years. You have to add biocide or it quickly goes bad. I do, which adds some lubricity but I've still had to have two $$ pumps replaced in the past 6 or 7 years.

That's great info about the lubricity issues of my oil, that can explain why I smoked a pump two years ago. I had never even heard of an oil pump failing on a burner, ever, until mine did.
I'm looking up oil lubricity additives right now, and it will be a SOP from now on in my tank. The pump was only like $110 and I replaced it myself, but god **** figuring out that it was the problem was a crash course in oil burner functions and components. It was very frustrating.

What brand biocide do you recommend? just doing some quick and dirty research I've seen a few complaints of excess carbon build up from the additives used in a few brands.
The best rated biocide I've found is Biobor biocide and lubricity additive:
Biobor at Amazon
Seems like what I would choose without any advice or knowledge of the additives used. My tank is inside so I don't think I need any temperature protection, I'd appreciate your input!

 

[hank2]

That's great info about the lubricity issues of my oil, that can explain why I smoked a pump two years ago. I had never even heard of an oil pump failing on a burner, ever, until mine did.
I'm looking up oil lubricity additives right now, and it will be a SOP from now on in my tank. The pump was only like $110 and I replaced it myself, but god **** figuring out that it was the problem was a crash course in oil burner functions and components. It was very frustrating.

What brand biocide do you recommend? just doing some quick and dirty research I've seen a few complaints of excess carbon build up from the additives used in a few brands.
The best rated biocide I've found is Biobor biocide and lubricity additive:
Biobor at Amazon
Seems like what I would choose without any advice or knowledge of the additives used. My tank is inside so I don't think I need any temperature protection, I'd appreciate your input!

I've been using the Biobor JF for about 7 or 8 years. Usually get it in the 32 oz. size. Don't overdose after a shock treatment. It seems to get good reviews. It will take care of the bacteria growth of ULS and perhaps some other problems. I have an outdoor tank, so I add some sort of anti-gel, water dispersant stuff. Most of the time it's Lucas or some "Heat" stuff they sell at Lowes. I have used others also. Most oil dealers have some very pricey products that also work. I used to add about 20 gal. of Kerosene, K-1 or the regular "dirty" No. 1 fuel oil for Winter fill ups.

My original burner pump, from 2003, went 10 or 12 years, then 2 failures, 2 or 3 years apart, even using Biobor JF after the first time. Maybe nothing but a good dosing of higher Sulphur oil will do, but where would you get it? PA. did lower the allowable Sulphur levels from the very high figures a few years ago, but the limit is much higher than ULS. I'm guessing that the refineries in Phila. make as much ULS diesel as they can and can no longer be bothered with higher Sulphur heating oil. I believe that NY state has their legal limit down to almost zilch. You cannot get anyone in the heating oil business nor their friends or family to tell you what they are selling as heating oil around here.

You were smart to replace the pump yourself. I've paid around $300+ a pop for replacements by the dealer.

 

[HankHill]

I've been using the Biobor JF for about 7 or 8 years. Usually get it in the 32 oz. size. Don't overdose after a shock treatment. It seems to get good reviews. It will take care of the bacteria growth of ULS and perhaps some other problems. I have an outdoor tank, so I add some sort of anti-gel, water dispersant stuff. Most of the time it's Lucas or some "Heat" stuff they sell at Lowes. I have used others also. Most oil dealers have some very pricey products that also work. I used to add about 20 gal. of Kerosene, K-1 or the regular "dirty" No. 1 fuel oil for Winter fill ups.

My original burner pump, from 2003, went 10 or 12 years, then 2 failures, 2 or 3 years apart, even using Biobor JF after the first time. Maybe nothing but a good dosing of higher Sulphur oil will do, but where would you get it? PA. did lower the allowable Sulphur levels from the very high figures a few years ago, but the limit is much higher than ULS. I'm guessing that the refineries in Phila. make as much ULS diesel as they can and can no longer be bothered with higher Sulphur heating oil. I believe that NY state has their legal limit down to almost zilch. You cannot get anyone in the heating oil business nor their friends or family to tell you what they are selling as heating oil around here.

You were smart to replace the pump yourself. I've paid around $300+ a pop for replacements by the dealer.

Its actually super easy on my burner once the cover is removed... Diagnosing and identifying the pump was hard, and realizing the procedure for running the burner to bleed the line and prime the pump.. That was messy but I love the smell!!