HMW polyisobutylene

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I still haven't seen my shipment from need4speedpower.com, nor have they replied to my email inquiry. Card was charged the day I ordered, though. Not happy at this point...
 
IIRC, The GTA I ordered came from AZ back in 04. Inquiries about its effectiveness led me to BITOG. I searched pretty extensively for info and my results were inconclusive. However my shotgun approach to cleaning up NOx emissions worked well. I'm gonna dope the fuel with some of the remaining pink glop and will try to pass emissioins with a car that now has 328k on its original cat.
 
This is not sounding good. Has anyone tried the alternative apdinc link that friendly_jacek posted above? All of my purchases have been through APD and have been confirmed by Alan Roth.
 
This is real stuff. Soon it will be in every diesel and gas fuel to decrease emissions. Increase in MPG and octanes is just a side effect. It's sad that such a great discovery took so long to gain recognition.

BTW, despite my gripe with the USA lubrication guy, the clear product is a real polymer, the fluid strings unlike anything I've seen.

My first impression in using it in corolla: nothing!. But wait, where is the engine noise I had on acceleration. Gone! Note sure what happened but seems like I had bad pinging and GTA FE fixed that. Looking forward to checking MPG.
 
FROM NEED4SPEED:


We still have some, but yes, it will be discontinued shortly. They will only make it available for large trucking outfits and gas/oil refineries.


Thank you,

Brett MacKenzie
Need4Speed Power Products
(402) 731-2352
 
quote:
Originally posted by friendly_jacek:

My first impression in using it in corolla: nothing!. But wait, where is the engine noise I had on acceleration. Gone! Note sure what happened but seems like I had bad pinging and GTA FE fixed that. Looking forward to checking MPG.
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Well, the noise came back next day, so the fluid was not such miracle as I initially thought.

I got 2 replies regarding the questionable nature of the fluid purchased from USA lubrications:

GTA representative replied: "It does not appear to be our product. Our product is viscous with a slightly hazy appearance."

Allan Roth with APD inc. wrote: "USA Lubrications is a reseller for us of GTA Fuel Enhancer. The product you received from them is legitimate."

As the fluid I have is clear and thin but strings some, I believe USA Lubrications offers doctored and diluted Viscon. The guy behind USA Lubrications was very upset but offered a partial return if I return the product minus the $12 S&H he charged. I think this is how he makes money.

This reminds me the ebay experience I had with counterfeit perfumes.

Buyers beware.
 
friendly, not specifically, however if you read my blanket warnings long ago here at BITOG about taking non fully formulated ( by a qualified chemist) fuel tricks and home brewing them, then maybe it applies.

Home built,chemistry for fuel adds is a quick way to destroy or fail your fuel delivery system, best outcome might be only to have cash extracted from the pocket book.

Just my opinion.
 
I don't really know how to interpret the last couple of days of this thread. I have nothing negative to contribute about the GTA product as supplied by APDinc. I cannot comment on other suppliers. I think that HMW PIB is a useful fuel additive with respect to emissions and mileage (at least when under load). I think that any interpretation of this thread that suggests that the GTA product was faulty or that HMW PIB is a scam would be an interpretation in error.
 
Word is that Torco T-21 smokeless 2 cycle oil is 38% PIB. Should be easy to use this way and I can't think of any reason this couldn't be used in 4 stroke gas at 1 oz or a bit more to 5 gal and it's also only $7.95 a liter with fixed shiping of $6.95 regardless of quantity. link is to Data sheet. http://www.torcousa.com/images/product/T-2i.pdf Caught the 38% info here. http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Fuel_Efficiency_Additives Might be a good all around additive with both detergency and lubricating properties along with the PIB. It's also coming from a known supplier so you'll get what you order.
 
I've tried to clarifiy this issue before. PIB is very easy to find. It is in many products. However, dissolved high molecular weight PIB is not easy to find. The torco product may be great for something, but I don't think that it is a substitute for HMW PIB.
 
It's why I added the second post. http://deq.mt.gov/Energy/bioenergy/biofuels.asp This test shows that the Torco has significantly less prticulate polution compared to other oils in a 2 stroke and attributes this to the PIB so it's it may be getting a better burn and is acting as more than a detergent here. Then again the HC emisions are a bit higher so that would contradict this though that difference is in the margin of error for the test conditions which were stated as being poor for absolute repeatability. Probably not the right form cosidering the overall visc. of the mix but it may be worth a look.
 
quote:
Originally posted by GMorg:
I don't really know how to interpret the last couple of days of this thread. I have nothing negative to contribute about the GTA product as supplied by APDinc. I cannot comment on other suppliers. I think that HMW PIB is a useful fuel additive with respect to emissions and mileage (at least when under load). I think that any interpretation of this thread that suggests that the GTA product was faulty or that HMW PIB is a scam would be an interpretation in error.
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This is a way to interpret: the legitimate sources of GTA FA dried up.
The only person that still takes orders for GTA on the web sends doctored fluid.

I agree with you that only HMW PIB is the way to go. While this component present in many household items (chewing gum, glues, sealers), you can't buy it in retail.

I think I know why. When I googled for PIB, I found homebrew recipes for plastic explosives with HMW PIB as a primary ingredient.
 
As for Torco smokeless 2-stroke oil, also keep in mind that it is not ashless. Use of such oils as fuel adds introduces a significant mineral stream to the catalytic converter.
 
quote:
Originally posted by goodvibes:
It's why I added the second post. http://deq.mt.gov/Energy/bioenergy/biofuels.asp This test shows that the Torco has significantly less prticulate polution compared to other oils in a 2 stroke and attributes this to the PIB so it's it may be getting a better burn and is acting as more than a detergent here. Then again the HC emisions are a bit higher so that would contradict this though that difference is in the margin of error for the test conditions which were stated as being poor for absolute repeatability. Probably not the right form cosidering the overall visc. of the mix but it may be worth a look.
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You convinced me. I found the TX approval letter for Viscon in diesel fuel (below) that shows decreased PM but slightly increased HC, just like your Montana study.

http://www.tceq.state.tx.us/assets/public/implementation/air/sip/miscdocs/GTAT_letter.pdf

Did you find any benefits from using the Torco fluid?
 
quote:
Originally posted by GMorg:
As for Torco smokeless 2-stroke oil, also keep in mind that it is not ashless. Use of such oils as fuel adds introduces a significant mineral stream to the catalytic converter.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure it's an issue. If you check the Montana study that goodvibes referenced, the Torco oil has only traces of P that is harmful for cats. It has some Ca (probably from detergents) but I'm not sure if Ca is harmful for Ca (doubt it). No data for S though but S is a known reversable cat inhibitor.

Its probably less harmful that ATF or some other 2-cycle oils that some people add to gas.
 
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