Your first sentence describes every HD rider at Sturgis. I swear it's a competition to see who can be the loudest and most annoying...then again, that's pretty much everywhere there are HD riders...the stock exhaust is the first thing to go on a HD...
Harley Davidson Names Topgolf’s Artie Stars as New CEO
- Thread starter Vercingetorix
- Start date
Although the big zook may look like a "crotch rocket" it's actually a sport tourer and pretty conservative from a riding position.
With aftermarket suspension and just a bit taller screen it's a joy to swallow miles on.
Now this Ducati on the other hand....
Well, HD is in a tough position. They need touring sport bikes to compete on a small scale.
With that said they are a luxury motorcycle brand, typically luxury brands do not rule market share. However Harley does rule market share for heavy weight cruisers. As HD sells more cruisers in the USA than all the manufacturers in the world combined. Nothing to sneeze at but demographics are changing.
Bottom line is motorcycles are a dead industry in the sense there is no more growth and never will be. It's just a matter of style of bike for those that ride. Sport tourers are the new fad. Shorter trips, nice style, people feel "cool" riding them.
Source = https://www.bts.gov/browse-statisti...rtation-statistics/number-us-road-motorcycles
With that said they are a luxury motorcycle brand, typically luxury brands do not rule market share. However Harley does rule market share for heavy weight cruisers. As HD sells more cruisers in the USA than all the manufacturers in the world combined. Nothing to sneeze at but demographics are changing.
Bottom line is motorcycles are a dead industry in the sense there is no more growth and never will be. It's just a matter of style of bike for those that ride. Sport tourers are the new fad. Shorter trips, nice style, people feel "cool" riding them.
Source = https://www.bts.gov/browse-statisti...rtation-statistics/number-us-road-motorcycles
I rode my buddy's Road Glide Ultra (a 2017 M8) two years ago. Compared to my 2018 Gold Wing, I found the the bike to be over weight and under powered...
I don't see an adventure bike category. Those bikes are becoming very popular...
The Ducs are a lot like my VTR Super Hawk, which is basically Honda's version of a Duc...
Prob gets munged under dual purpose.
HD Pan America is a very competitive entry in that segment. Dealer enthusiasm varies greatly by location. They should all get behind it.
Can’t please everyone. Some would say your Goldwing is too “sanitized “. I like the six cylinder myself, but people have different tastes.
AZjeff
$50 Site Donor 2023
When was it?
LMAOTHREE times a year, don't forget the Cosplay Sturgis run.
100%A CEO doesn't need to understand customer culture or be a fan boy for commodity products, just the right business experience for the situation. In the case of a product with a long history and culture that needs to attract new customers not get existing customers to buy more a fan boy might not be best. It's a difficult thing to pull off hope someone can.
This guy pops up on my feed on youtube. He’s from Turkey.
Bro, I’m all about that outlaw life style. Oh hey, btw can you help me record this for my Tik Tok?
Too sanitized?
that's like having too much fun...I agree, and as much as I dislike HDs and would never own one, the company going under would be bad for many reasons...When was it?
LMAO
A CEO doesn't need to understand customer culture or be a fan boy for commodity products, just the right business experience for the situation. In the case of a product with a long history and culture that needs to attract new customers not get existing customers to buy more a fan boy might not be best. It's a difficult thing to pull off hope someone can.
This behavior issue is the double edged sword they walk.
This is the image the brand portrays.
Never been a bike guy but around 10-15 years ago some friends of mine all decided they wanted to be bikers because of that Sons of Anarchy show (never watched it, don't really want to). So all of a sudden there were a ton of people I knew that were riding around trying to look and act like bikers on their loud and overpriced Harley's that they could barely afford in most cases.
Fast forward a few years and one guy was killed when a van turned out in front of him and he was thrown from his bike and went head first into a curb. No helmet although even with the helmet he probably still would have died, it probably would have just been quicker by snapping his neck. Spent a few days in the hospital before he finally passed, left behind a wife and 2 kids. Wasn't long after that that all these new "bikers" were only riding their bikes on some special trip. Fast forward a couple more years, all the bikes are sold as they were just sitting in a garage collecting dust.
That's about my experience with Harleys. Maybe they can turn it around if they can get people to buy the bikes but I just don't see that with the generations younger than me. They don't care about bikes or even cars in most cases. Harleys are expensive luxury items. With the way people drive today, no way you are getting me on a bike to just drive around casually like my friend that was killed one night was. All it takes is one inattentive driver paying more attention to their phone than the road and you aren't winning that one on a bike.
Fast forward a few years and one guy was killed when a van turned out in front of him and he was thrown from his bike and went head first into a curb. No helmet although even with the helmet he probably still would have died, it probably would have just been quicker by snapping his neck. Spent a few days in the hospital before he finally passed, left behind a wife and 2 kids. Wasn't long after that that all these new "bikers" were only riding their bikes on some special trip. Fast forward a couple more years, all the bikes are sold as they were just sitting in a garage collecting dust.
That's about my experience with Harleys. Maybe they can turn it around if they can get people to buy the bikes but I just don't see that with the generations younger than me. They don't care about bikes or even cars in most cases. Harleys are expensive luxury items. With the way people drive today, no way you are getting me on a bike to just drive around casually like my friend that was killed one night was. All it takes is one inattentive driver paying more attention to their phone than the road and you aren't winning that one on a bike.
I prefer bikes with “character “ I have a Ducati, a Moto Guzzi, and a Triumph. So some would say a Honda is too sanitized.Too sanitized?
I feel that you need to be a bit more open to the fact that others have valid opinions and preferences. Yours are not the only ones.
AZjeff
$50 Site Donor 2023
The difference with the things you mention is there aren't other people who can kill you while you do what you do.
Was a competitive entry, see below.
Walked into the Manchester NH HD dealership in 2008 to look at a Buell Ulysses, which was kind of an Adventure bike. Wearing riding gear. The salesman ignored me.
The parts guy came out from behind the counter and was very enthusiastic about the bike and knew everything about it. Sales guy never moved. Didn’t seem like they were behind it. Bought another V-Strom.
Built up a 2005 Roadster (sportster with dual front disks, tachometer, and full length shocks) to try and make it a fun back road bike. The big HD riders completely ignored it. But the young sport bike riders went nuts over it.
Fast forward a year or two and HD released the XR - in many ways a factory version of the Roadster. Rode the Roadster to Boston HD. Walked into and asked the salesman if they had an XR. He pointed to their demo bike, which was in a corner of the showroom floor and not even accessible. And he knew literally nothing about it.
HD cut a lot of corners the first year they brought the XR to the U.S. in 2009. They generally used the cheapest Showa component parts available, but this took the cake buy only having a front damper on one fork leg! They upgraded to the euro spec the next year, but the model was discontinued after 2012 and sell for $4-5,000.
So my observations were the HD business model was wedded to financing expensive cruisers and the company and the dealer channel couldn’t - and can’t - adapt to a new customer base. The LiveWire was a fiasco, and Polaris Indian brand cut into their non-dirt ball core market.
HD tried to attract more mainstream riders with the 2021 Pan America. It sold well at first, but has now tanked. They faced strong and very mature offerings from BMW, Honda, and others. They aren’t the only ones to fail outside their lane: the BMW R18 cruiser is a flop, the Triumph Explorer and Yamaha Super Tenere don’t seem too successful.
Have no idea how they will survive. Young Counter-culture “Outlaws” don’t have $25,000 to spend.
Last edited:
Similar threads
