GM Spending Big Money on EV Production Plants

You know Uncle Dave-this technology is coming. Whether it's Rivian or somebody else. You are among the many on here. New tech phobia and the acceptance thereof on here is a disease. You guys can jet keep buying I.C.E. motors and wrenching on weekends until your hearts content. For me-while I won't be replacing my Siverado with an EV anytime soon. It's definitely a consideration as a replacement for my wife's car next time around.
Happy Wrenching!
UD is just bringing reality vs. hype into the conversation. The point is, Tesla has been doing this for 10 years. There have been a lotta promises about Tesla killers, great range, etc. But so far, the hype has not come to fruition. Not even close.

AFAIC, competition makes everyone better with the consumer being the winner. The Hummer has got me baffeled. How many do they expect to sell? Seems like a stupid move, financially at least.
All good.
 
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UD is just bringing reality vs. hype into the conversation. The point is, Tesla has been doing this for 10 years. There have been a lotta promises about Tesla killers, great range, etc. But so far, the hype has not come to fruition. Not even close.

AFAIC, competition makes everyone better with the consumer being the winner. The Hummer has got me baffeled. How many do they expect to sell? Seems like a stupid move, financially at least.
All good.

Look at it this way. Cut your teeth on a "boutique model" (The Hummer) and then filter down the technology to models that will sell at scale.
 
The Tesla fast charging is supposed to be bad for the battery. They say it themselves. That has to be resolved. GM has always been big on electric drive back into the days of Electro Motive. Nothing like the pulling power of electric. It was the only way to replace steam locomotives I think. GM is gambling. I hope it works for them. Ford and GM are all we have left. In time of war if it happens again, they are our domestic suppliers.
The prime mover in an Electromotive Division locomotive was a diesel engine. Every bit of energy to move the train came from diesel fuel. The diesel engine drove a generator that supplied current to wheel motors. Electric drive was a great way to get a 2000 ton train started without burning out the clutches of a mechanical transmission. But electric drive is not without its problems. Wheel motors needed to be rebuilt occasionally. In heavily loaded applications such as freight railroading, the high continuous current would significantly heat the motors, causing the varnish insulation on the windings to break down, and the efficiency of the motors would degrade over time.
 
Look at it this way. Cut your teeth on a "boutique model" (The Hummer) and then filter down the technology to models that will sell at scale.
My point is, you can't learn from something that sells in tiny numbers. I see your point; the Tesla Model 3 sales exploded after the Lotus based Roadster and Model S paved the way. But a $80K to $130K Hummer? They shoulda done an SUV that would have a chance to sell. GM has not made a lotta good financial decisions in the past 20 years...
 
My point is, you can't learn from something that sells in tiny numbers. I see your point; the Tesla Model 3 sales exploded after the Lotus based Roadster and Model S paved the way. But a $80K to $130K Hummer? They shoulda done an SUV that would have a chance to sell. GM has not made a lotta good financial decisions in the past 20 years...


I agree 100% but I may reserve one.
I have owned many hybrids and I think they have something here but unfortunately not for the masses yet.
 
Who is leapfrogging teslas battery range?

Rivian

No, the 400 mile range quote is around town. It's still 200 on the highway, and the battery is a stupidly expensive and large de-rated 200,000 watt hour battery, weighing 3000 pounds! The specific energy and energy density of the Rivian battery is no better than any other EV battery pack.


Nobody would ever say that a larger gas tank results in better MPG, or more efficiency. Only that the larger tank provides longer range. And so it is with batteries. Ever larger battery packs provide more range. They are not cheap, they are not light, and the science is very well understood.

Furthermore, billions of dollars have been spent in an attempt at "pushing the science" for better batteries. The best we can say is that we will see a 20% improvement in specific energy in 10 years, and "possibly" a 40% improvement in specific energy in 20 years. That, unfortunately, is where we are.
 
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The prime mover in an Electromotive Division locomotive was a diesel engine. Every bit of energy to move the train came from diesel fuel. The diesel engine drove a generator that supplied current to wheel motors. Electric drive was a great way to get a 2000 ton train started without burning out the clutches of a mechanical transmission. But electric drive is not without its problems. Wheel motors needed to be rebuilt occasionally. In heavily loaded applications such as freight railroading, the high continuous current would significantly heat the motors, causing the varnish insulation on the windings to break down, and the efficiency of the motors would degrade over time.
I realize it is diesel electric. I see the prime mover as the electric motor only. The diesel is like a gas tank in a gas car, the power source. It can be extended on and on to say where the stored energy in the diesel fuel comes from, until the beginning of the universe I would say.
The website for the Hummer says reservations are filled, out of luck other rich folks.
 
I realize it is diesel electric. I see the prime mover as the electric motor only. The diesel is like a gas tank in a gas car, the power source. It can be extended on and on to say where the stored energy in the diesel fuel comes from, until the beginning of the universe I would say.
The website for the Hummer says reservations are filled, out of luck other rich folks.

If you want to take the cosmic view, the energy stored in hydrocarbon fuels is energy from the sun that made plants grow, which dinosaurs ate and grew big and strong. Then they died and were buried in the earth's crust where they turned into the primordial black ooze that is crude oil. Releasing energy from hydrocarbons is really solar power that has been stored for millenia in chemical bonds.
 
If you want to take the cosmic view, the energy stored in hydrocarbon fuels is energy from the sun that made plants grow, which dinosaurs ate and grew big and strong. Then they died and were buried in the earth's crust where they turned into the primordial black ooze that is crude oil. Releasing energy from hydrocarbons is really solar power that has been stored for millenia in chemical bonds.
And that energy came from the giant fusion reactors we call stars :)
 
this technology is coming. Whether it's Rivian or somebody else. You are among the many on here. New tech phobia and the acceptance thereof on here is a disease.

Even "new tech" is subject to the ceilings the laws of physics puts on it and no amount of plans, puff articles, dreaming or subsidized production and carefully cooked metrics is going to change that.
 
The prime mover in an Electromotive Division locomotive was a diesel engine. Every bit of energy to move the train came from diesel fuel. The diesel engine drove a generator that supplied current to wheel motors. Electric drive was a great way to get a 2000 ton train started without burning out the clutches of a mechanical transmission. But electric drive is not without its problems. Wheel motors needed to be rebuilt occasionally. In heavily loaded applications such as freight railroading, the high continuous current would significantly heat the motors, causing the varnish insulation on the windings to break down, and the efficiency of the motors would degrade over time.
This is where marine applications (now AC/VFD) have an advantage … various types of heat exchangers will use seawater cooling somewhere in the process …
 
If you want to take the cosmic view, the energy stored in hydrocarbon fuels is energy from the sun that made plants grow, which dinosaurs ate and grew big and strong. Then they died and were buried in the earth's crust where they turned into the primordial black ooze that is crude oil. Releasing energy from hydrocarbons is really solar power that has been stored for millenia in chemical bonds.
Add a little gravity in there too. But the sun is but another power source, a couple more steps back from that and it is thread lock time.

Electric motors are advancing, I learned how the Prius and the Bolt have actually gone to lower hp electric motors able to spin a higher rpms which enables low gearing and massive torque and high vehicle speed. Things are not going to stay the same.
 
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I learned how the Prius and the Bolt have actually gone to lower hp electric motors able to spin a higher rpms which enables low gearing and massive torque and high vehicle speed.

It might be best for you to go back and learn the rest of it
 
Add a little gravity in there too. But the sun is but another power source, a couple more steps back from that and it is thread lock time.

Electric motors are advancing, I learned how the Prius and the Bolt have actually gone to lower hp electric motors able to spin a higher rpms which enables low gearing and massive torque and high vehicle speed. Things are not going to stay the same.

Electric motors are older technology than gasoline and diesel engines. Their power characteristics are well known, and they are efficient in the low average power range required for consumer passenger car use. The challenge of making practical electric cars is the range, size, mass, and reliability of the battery.
 
The challenge of making practical electric cars is the range, size, mass, and reliability of the battery.
And the batteries are a huge cost componet...
Tesla is close on reliability. The new 4680 could easily outlast the car.
4680 Battery

Being a pure play EV company allows Tesla to focus ecxlusively on EV tech while GM and others have to share resources across internal combustion and electric power. The results are evident.
 
And the batteries are a huge cost componet...
Tesla is close on reliability. The new 4680 could easily outlast the car.
4680 Battery

Being a pure play EV company allows Tesla to focus ecxlusively on EV tech while GM and others have to share resources across internal combustion and electric power. The results are evident.
Uh, Jeff … you do realize GM, Ford, others have to do real work for millions in the meantime, right ?
I live in a region of farmers, ranchers, construction, and oilfield
Tesla does little to nothing for them, Ok ?
 
Uh, Jeff … you do realize GM, Ford, others have to do real work for millions in the meantime, right ?
I live in a region of farmers, ranchers, construction, and oilfield
Tesla does little to nothing for them, Ok ?
That's exactly the point.
 
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