Fuel Savings Going to Redline?

Messages
238
Location
Monterey Park, CA
Anyone document their fuel savings using PAO based oils from the same viscosity dino oil? Extended drains itself help offset the cost of $7.95/qt Redline. But what if there really is a fuel savings. That would be really nice after 12000 miles, I saved X gals of gas to complete offset my initial purchase of my Redline. BTW I will be going to Redline after I put 10000 miles on my new superstroker. Thanks! [Smile]
 
Messages
403
Location
California
I didn't notice any mpg increase when I switched from Factory fill 5w30 at 1000 miles to Mobil 1 5w30. The improvement might occur if the dino increases in Viscosity more than the Synth over the life of the drain. As far as redline giving an improvement, I don't know, it has a bunch of moly in it so if that makes for less friction then there might be an improvement. I wouldn't factor gas mileage increase too much into your decision making based upon my tests.
 

pedaltothemetal

Thread starter
Messages
238
Location
Monterey Park, CA
quote:
Originally posted by rgiles: I didn't notice any mpg increase when I switched from Factory fill 5w30 at 1000 miles to Mobil 1 5w30. The improvement might occur if the dino increases in Viscosity more than the Synth over the life of the drain. As far as redline giving an improvement, I don't know, it has a bunch of moly in it so if that makes for less friction then there might be an improvement. I wouldn't factor gas mileage increase too much into your decision making based upon my tests.
If Redline were to really increase your gas milage to offset your purchase, would you change brands? As soon as I put Redline in will let you know if I get any better gas mileage. I have a very powerful V8 with 12city/21 highway/15 mixed. I'm not a mathematician, and wish I can calculate how much I would be saving if I did save .5 mpg over 12000 miles. That's not asking for much I think. Roughly with my limited math, I got a savings of around 16gal if I do get a 15.5mpg mixed instead of my current 15mpg. That would be a $28.00 over the life of the drain using super unleaded at $1.79 per gallon.
 
Messages
403
Location
California
I would love to switch if verified gas mileage can be had and I liked the other properties of the oil. The problem is every vehicle is different so what works for you might not work for me. Also driving habits have a much bigger impact on gas mileage than synthetic. So if your a lead foot, don't count on any savings. I've been babying my vehicle to figure out what the absolute best mileage I can get, and then that will be the number to beat. I went through the same calculation and thought process about gas mileage improvements paying back some of the expense of synthetic. I hope it's paying itself back, but just too difficult to determine without long term tests. Keep me posted on your results [Smile]
 

Patman

Staff member
Messages
22,003
Location
Guelph, Ontario
You will NEVER make up the difference in MPG compared to the difference in price between $8 Redline and $1 dino oil. Generally speaking you are very lucky if you even notice any MPG increase when switching from dino to synthetic. I've never noticed any change myself and I keep very detailed MPG logs on all my cars.
 

pedaltothemetal

Thread starter
Messages
238
Location
Monterey Park, CA
quote:
Originally posted by Patman: You will NEVER make up the difference in MPG compared to the difference in price between $8 Redline and $1 dino oil. Generally speaking you are very lucky if you even notice any MPG increase when switching from dino to synthetic. I've never noticed any change myself and I keep very detailed MPG logs on all my cars.
Hi Patman, How are you! I'm the same pedaltothemetal on ls1.com, and I really appreciate all your contributions during the early years on developing those free mods. Sorry to hear what Redline claims is all hype then. My speed shop guy also says you will feel a difference. Better power! Guess that's all hype too maybe. He is the same guy I mentioned in another thread with the 1984 454Suburban with 300000 miles. Only thing he ever changed was his timing chain with once a year oil changes. He changes on the same date every year. That's what I want to do. I got so much money in my superstroker and want it to last. Now have to decide on which oil to get. Being a dino guy all my life, it's hard to change. Got to get with the 21st century program! BTW a Redline distributor claims Mobil changed to a cheaper formula so they can sell at Walmart for less. [ December 14, 2002, 11:02 AM: Message edited by: pedaltothemetal ]
 

Al

Messages
19,251
Location
Elizabethtown, Pa
Once again I have to agree with Patmen [Roll Eyes] I had difficulty evaluating the difference when I switched. Since for the most part, gas milage will increase with decreasing viscosity-I think synthetic base stocks have little to do with it. I'd like to say there are savings-but I really can't. I think folks who claim savings, are looking for savings and either consciously or unconsciously drive more restrained to give the best shot at achieving this better milage. For instance they are unlikely to "lead foot" at this time. (Just my opinion) Don't try to justify savings in this area by going to syn.
 

MolaKule

Staff member
Messages
21,910
Location
Iowegia - USA
Pedal, Thanks for the link. I always thought Amsoil gave 4-ball wear tests with 0.4 mm or smaller scars. That link shows 0.514 mm. Hmmm.
 
Messages
47,791
Location
Everson WA - Pacific NW USA
Terry wrote:
quote:
Amsoil 20w-50 series 2000 4 ball wear values increase dramatically as the oil is used
This doesn't show up in analysis with 10,000 miles of hard use in a turbo - perhaps another knife in the 4 balls (vs. real life) Please elaborate on "increase dramatically"...is there a chart posted?
 
Messages
34,215
Location
NJ
Amsoil has .39mm on the back of my Series 2000 0w-30 oil. And they have no Moly??? Thats pretty good! [Big Grin]
 
Messages
3,845
Pablo, Bob has got the racing oil comparo chart cataloged either here or its in the files on Noria. This chart/paper was put out by Redline to answer the 4 ball Amsoil tests we read on the bottles of Amsoil products. It certainly was a "knife in the Balls" of some at Amsoil. And those of us that had been recommending its use over other products. We went through this deal about 2 years ago when I started seeing increases in Amsoil oxidation and vis consistantly in my customers who used it, including my personal cars. Note I USED to be a dealer, brother still is. We also were using OAI to do the majority of the "consumer" testing. Thats also about the time Amsoil dropped the Redline comparison from the bottles. Buster,The Series 2000 0w-30 is tested at less kg of force than the 20w-50 thus the lower wear scars/values.
 
Messages
47,791
Location
Everson WA - Pacific NW USA
The Redline paper I can accept, but in real life I maintain that I have yet to see a huge amount of wear metals in my 10,000 mile oil in a TURBO. The second "paper" is BS. There is no Volvo engine B23S....and the oil completely breaking down and going "acidic" at 7,500 miles, etc is just something he made up. People do go 25,000 miles with Amsoil - and I'm a dealer that does NOT recommend it for ALL cars. He makes some statement that Amsoil is not recommend extended OCI's any more. Still are. EDIT: Almost forgot, Mr. "Know it all" doesn't seem to know do-do about Volvo heads. There were essentially no different oil passage changes in any OHC Volvo 4 from 1976-1993 and they certainly NEVER had any issues either - these engines - mostly non-turbos go 400,000 miles plus regularly. I know these motors. [ December 14, 2002, 04:28 PM: Message edited by: Pablo ]
 
Messages
34,215
Location
NJ
lol...i really love these oil battles. You really have to laugh sometimes. I think we are all a different breed. I'm not a chemist or oil expert, but I really think it is not wise for any oil company to claim 25,000 miles for a drain. Now I see why Mobil doesn't. As far as the oil breaking down at 7,500, that seems very low but it looks like there is some data in the oil analysis section that does support the fact that Amsoil in certain engines does tend to fade a little earlier then they would have you think.
 
Messages
3,845
As always the "brand" is not the issue, performance is and the only way to know a oil works well in your engine is by testing it periodically.
 
Messages
1,874
Location
Ocala, Florida
As for those articles,I didn't write it. Just thought it was a good way to show how marketing has played in this. For every one instance someone says theirs is better, there's always someone else stating the oposite. For every action there is a oposite and equal re action. Everytime a politician states a "Fact" against one, the other states a "fact" just the oposite. LE say's their oils the best, Others will tell you the oposite. Someone show's their oils tests are better, someone else comes out with the same test showing theirs was better. Marketing... This is one reasn why I don't like to see testimonials and quite frankly, in house test results against other oils unless actual #'s and or details provided. I think that I have seen more useful information come off the oil analysis as it gives a more over all concept on how an oil works in real time applications. Of course, even that varies because there is no two tests identical but you look and take all the variables into account, give it your best guess on quality, then the ultimate way to prove to yourself if its the best, is to see if it is the best for you and your application by running it in your vehicle and use oil analysis to verify you made the correct choice for yourself.
 
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