Wouldn't a B-12 potentially free up actually sizeable particles that could scratch the cylinder walls if it is that aggressive?
Freeing up dirty, stuck oil control rings?
- Thread starter racin4ds
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Rotella T5 10W-30, lots of detergents.
Used a lot on Saturn S-Series, which have a similar oil burning problem.
However it is winter, and a 10W-30 is going to be thick on start up. I would add half 0W-30 full synthetic, and half 10W-30 Rotella T5...
Use of a full synthetic instead of dino oil can help prevent the problem...
Used a lot on Saturn S-Series, which have a similar oil burning problem.
However it is winter, and a 10W-30 is going to be thick on start up. I would add half 0W-30 full synthetic, and half 10W-30 Rotella T5...
Use of a full synthetic instead of dino oil can help prevent the problem...
Originally Posted By: mattwithcats
Rotella T5 10W-30, lots of detergents.
Used a lot on Saturn S-Series, which have a similar oil burning problem.
However it is winter, and a 10W-30 is going to be thick on start up. I would add half 0W-30 full synthetic, and half 10W-30 Rotella T5...
Use of a full synthetic instead of dino oil can help prevent the problem...
Good thinking Matt, does the Rotella really have that much more detergents than standard pass car oils? What about a thicker High Mileage oil like some MaxLife?
Rotella T5 10W-30, lots of detergents.
Used a lot on Saturn S-Series, which have a similar oil burning problem.
However it is winter, and a 10W-30 is going to be thick on start up. I would add half 0W-30 full synthetic, and half 10W-30 Rotella T5...
Use of a full synthetic instead of dino oil can help prevent the problem...
Good thinking Matt, does the Rotella really have that much more detergents than standard pass car oils? What about a thicker High Mileage oil like some MaxLife?
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Originally Posted By: SumpChump
Wouldn't a B-12 potentially free up actually sizeable particles that could scratch the cylinder walls if it is that aggressive?
There have been several postings on its use as a piston soak and I do not recall anyone stating that. Also, it would likely dissolve the carbon, not just cause it to flake off.
Wouldn't a B-12 potentially free up actually sizeable particles that could scratch the cylinder walls if it is that aggressive?
There have been several postings on its use as a piston soak and I do not recall anyone stating that. Also, it would likely dissolve the carbon, not just cause it to flake off.
B-12 is a pretty darn good solvent cocktail at a good price. I have some in my garage now along with a couple quart cans of Kreen which is not as easy to get nor as inexpensive. But Kreen has shown good results when added to the oil without necessarily requiring an immediate oil change.
When I first got my beater 1997 Dodge Neon it used 1 quart every 300 miles. Between Rislone, a B-12 piston soak and 15W-40 Delo I got it down to 1 quart every 1500 miles.
When I first got my beater 1997 Dodge Neon it used 1 quart every 300 miles. Between Rislone, a B-12 piston soak and 15W-40 Delo I got it down to 1 quart every 1500 miles.
Originally Posted By: SumpChump
Wouldn't a B-12 potentially free up actually sizeable particles that could scratch the cylinder walls if it is that aggressive?
I know its a Honda, but the cylinder walls better not be THAT soft. Carbon grit is still softer than metal, and this is a one-time thing. There'll be a little wear, but the engine will come out a net reduction in oil consumption. Anything much milder just won't ever get the deposits out of there, IMO.
Wouldn't a B-12 potentially free up actually sizeable particles that could scratch the cylinder walls if it is that aggressive?
I know its a Honda, but the cylinder walls better not be THAT soft. Carbon grit is still softer than metal, and this is a one-time thing. There'll be a little wear, but the engine will come out a net reduction in oil consumption. Anything much milder just won't ever get the deposits out of there, IMO.
There's a YouTube video where a '96 Geo Prizm had varnish buildup blocking the oil return holes to the oil control rings. The only cure was to literally remove the pistons and drill out the oil return holes on the under side of the pistons. The Geo was burning oil because the oil control rings were not allowed to move freely in their ring lands. This is why I tell people to change their oil before there's a chance of varnish forming.
VIDEO
VIDEO
Stuck rings usually means carbon coke. That is hard carbon locking the rings in place.
I use Break-Free gun solvent to loosen stuck rings. Cold engine, big shot in each cylinder through the plug holes and let it soak over night at least...
Fire it up next day and let it warm up. Drain oil and refill. Do it again just before next oil change. Usually get it in first go, but sometimes it takes a second shot. Much more aggressive than B-12. Will clean a carbon loaded gun barrel in 10 swipes with a bronze brush.
The amount you shoot in through the plug hole will be a thimble full at most. It will not dilute the engine oil enough to worry about for as long as it takes to warm up before change.
I'd run Rotella T-6 and not sweat the cold start. All HDEO's have more detergents than PCMO's. Move over to T-6 and start really cleaning the engine. It'll start just fine. T-6 is on the thin side for an HDEO
I use Break-Free gun solvent to loosen stuck rings. Cold engine, big shot in each cylinder through the plug holes and let it soak over night at least...
Fire it up next day and let it warm up. Drain oil and refill. Do it again just before next oil change. Usually get it in first go, but sometimes it takes a second shot. Much more aggressive than B-12. Will clean a carbon loaded gun barrel in 10 swipes with a bronze brush.
The amount you shoot in through the plug hole will be a thimble full at most. It will not dilute the engine oil enough to worry about for as long as it takes to warm up before change.
I'd run Rotella T-6 and not sweat the cold start. All HDEO's have more detergents than PCMO's. Move over to T-6 and start really cleaning the engine. It'll start just fine. T-6 is on the thin side for an HDEO
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Thanks BrocLuno- never thought of using the Break-free, that is good stuff there! Used it on my AR's many times!
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
There's a YouTube video where a '96 Geo Prizm had varnish buildup blocking the oil return holes to the oil control rings. The only cure was to literally remove the pistons and drill out the oil return holes on the under side of the pistons. The Geo was burning oil because the oil control rings were not allowed to move freely in their ring lands. This is why I tell people to change their oil before there's a chance of varnish forming.
VIDEO
That is how some people dealt with S-series Saturns.
I would have done the same, but I didn't feel like saving my Saturn.
A better option would be to buy pistons from a company who builds problem solving engine components, run a flex-hone down each bore, then re-install everything.
There's a YouTube video where a '96 Geo Prizm had varnish buildup blocking the oil return holes to the oil control rings. The only cure was to literally remove the pistons and drill out the oil return holes on the under side of the pistons. The Geo was burning oil because the oil control rings were not allowed to move freely in their ring lands. This is why I tell people to change their oil before there's a chance of varnish forming.
VIDEO
That is how some people dealt with S-series Saturns.
I would have done the same, but I didn't feel like saving my Saturn.
A better option would be to buy pistons from a company who builds problem solving engine components, run a flex-hone down each bore, then re-install everything.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
Hey fellas, what is my absolute best oil/cleaning additive to free up the infamous stuck/gummed up oil control rings in an 03 Honda CR-V with the KA24 engine? I just bought this thing for the wife very cheap and its in excellent condition with fairly low mileage for a Honda (130k) one owner and meticulously maintained.
I bought it knowing it was consuming oil, just didn't realize it was so much. Problem is you cannot see even a bit of blue smoke from the exhaust when running. I've also slid cardboard under it to make sure it wasn't a leak and its clean and dry so it has to be burning it. After some research on various sites I found the 02-03 CR-V and Accords with this engine have oil control ring issues and consume oil fairly rapidly. I'm hoping a good cleaning will at least lessen it or stop it completely. Oil used for its entire life has been bulk Honda dealer 5W20 so who knows what it was. I now have a PYB/MMO OCI in there.
If the car was "meticulously maintained" then it wouldn't have ring coking problems if that's what is wrong with it.
Not always the case unfortunately. Sometimes poor design wins over meticulous maintenance. Over the years there were several threads about sludge monsters and the like. Many were very meticulously maintained.
Sometimes how a vehicle is used can also play a part.
I don't think so. There's no way we can prove that. In my many years of auto maintenance I have never had that problem(ring coking). The only times I have seen sludged or heavily varnished engines has been with poorly cared for engines.
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
Hey fellas, what is my absolute best oil/cleaning additive to free up the infamous stuck/gummed up oil control rings in an 03 Honda CR-V with the KA24 engine? I just bought this thing for the wife very cheap and its in excellent condition with fairly low mileage for a Honda (130k) one owner and meticulously maintained.
I bought it knowing it was consuming oil, just didn't realize it was so much. Problem is you cannot see even a bit of blue smoke from the exhaust when running. I've also slid cardboard under it to make sure it wasn't a leak and its clean and dry so it has to be burning it. After some research on various sites I found the 02-03 CR-V and Accords with this engine have oil control ring issues and consume oil fairly rapidly. I'm hoping a good cleaning will at least lessen it or stop it completely. Oil used for its entire life has been bulk Honda dealer 5W20 so who knows what it was. I now have a PYB/MMO OCI in there.
If the car was "meticulously maintained" then it wouldn't have ring coking problems if that's what is wrong with it.
Not always the case unfortunately. Sometimes poor design wins over meticulous maintenance. Over the years there were several threads about sludge monsters and the like. Many were very meticulously maintained.
Sometimes how a vehicle is used can also play a part.
I don't think so. There's no way we can prove that. In my many years of auto maintenance I have never had that problem(ring coking). The only times I have seen sludged or heavily varnished engines has been with poorly cared for engines.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
http://www.lcdinc.com/tests_dyson.php
Very interesting ... I might have to get me some of that
http://www.lcdinc.com/tests_dyson.php
Very interesting ... I might have to get me some of that
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
Hey fellas, what is my absolute best oil/cleaning additive to free up the infamous stuck/gummed up oil control rings in an 03 Honda CR-V with the KA24 engine? I just bought this thing for the wife very cheap and its in excellent condition with fairly low mileage for a Honda (130k) one owner and meticulously maintained.
I bought it knowing it was consuming oil, just didn't realize it was so much. Problem is you cannot see even a bit of blue smoke from the exhaust when running. I've also slid cardboard under it to make sure it wasn't a leak and its clean and dry so it has to be burning it. After some research on various sites I found the 02-03 CR-V and Accords with this engine have oil control ring issues and consume oil fairly rapidly. I'm hoping a good cleaning will at least lessen it or stop it completely. Oil used for its entire life has been bulk Honda dealer 5W20 so who knows what it was. I now have a PYB/MMO OCI in there.
If the car was "meticulously maintained" then it wouldn't have ring coking problems if that's what is wrong with it.
Not always the case unfortunately. Sometimes poor design wins over meticulous maintenance. Over the years there were several threads about sludge monsters and the like. Many were very meticulously maintained.
Sometimes how a vehicle is used can also play a part.
I don't think so. There's no way we can prove that. In my many years of auto maintenance I have never had that problem(ring coking). The only times I have seen sludged or heavily varnished engines has been with poorly cared for engines.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I've seen pics on this site of well maintained engines with problems, and helped close friends deal with it in well maintained cars. Later we came to find the cars had a design flaw or history of issues.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: racin4ds
Hey fellas, what is my absolute best oil/cleaning additive to free up the infamous stuck/gummed up oil control rings in an 03 Honda CR-V with the KA24 engine? I just bought this thing for the wife very cheap and its in excellent condition with fairly low mileage for a Honda (130k) one owner and meticulously maintained.
I bought it knowing it was consuming oil, just didn't realize it was so much. Problem is you cannot see even a bit of blue smoke from the exhaust when running. I've also slid cardboard under it to make sure it wasn't a leak and its clean and dry so it has to be burning it. After some research on various sites I found the 02-03 CR-V and Accords with this engine have oil control ring issues and consume oil fairly rapidly. I'm hoping a good cleaning will at least lessen it or stop it completely. Oil used for its entire life has been bulk Honda dealer 5W20 so who knows what it was. I now have a PYB/MMO OCI in there.
If the car was "meticulously maintained" then it wouldn't have ring coking problems if that's what is wrong with it.
Not always the case unfortunately. Sometimes poor design wins over meticulous maintenance. Over the years there were several threads about sludge monsters and the like. Many were very meticulously maintained.
Sometimes how a vehicle is used can also play a part.
I don't think so. There's no way we can prove that. In my many years of auto maintenance I have never had that problem(ring coking). The only times I have seen sludged or heavily varnished engines has been with poorly cared for engines.
I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. I've seen pics on this site of well maintained engines with problems, and helped close friends deal with it in well maintained cars. Later we came to find the cars had a design flaw or history of issues.
Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
Originally Posted By: Shannow
http://www.lcdinc.com/tests_dyson.php
Very interesting ... I might have to get me some of that
I'd be careful with lc20. From this thread http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=789819&page=1, the active ingredient is cyclohexanone, which is a ketone. Ketones dissolve lots of nasty stuff, but also dissolve viton, a common valve stem seal material, o-ring material. I'd avoid unless you know it's going to be compatible with all the materials in your engine.
Here's something about viton and cyclohexanone: http://www.fbs-online.com/Centre/Prod/Viton-chem-com-res.htm
P.S. I'm not sure what the composition of lc20 is. I just know that I wouldn't put anything other than engine oil down the fill hole.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
http://www.lcdinc.com/tests_dyson.php
Very interesting ... I might have to get me some of that
I'd be careful with lc20. From this thread http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=789819&page=1, the active ingredient is cyclohexanone, which is a ketone. Ketones dissolve lots of nasty stuff, but also dissolve viton, a common valve stem seal material, o-ring material. I'd avoid unless you know it's going to be compatible with all the materials in your engine.
Here's something about viton and cyclohexanone: http://www.fbs-online.com/Centre/Prod/Viton-chem-com-res.htm
P.S. I'm not sure what the composition of lc20 is. I just know that I wouldn't put anything other than engine oil down the fill hole.
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