Expensive F150 tail-lights ... How crazy is this?

[Speedy3861]

There is hardly more useful device than TPMS. I would put it behind seatbelts but ahead of air bags.

Because we've become a " know nothing " society, everything has to have " nanny" control. Question: How many people have a tire pressure gauge in their cars or even know how to use it? Know how or have the ability to change a tire? Most live in that blissful place where " Someone else will take care of that". People are rapidly losing life skills.

 

[2heeldrive]

Seems like tail lights for a pickup truck should be a low cost consumable part. It's very easy to damage them putting things in the bed. I guess manufacturers don't see it that way.

 

[supton]

Because we've become a " know nothing " society, everything has to have " nanny" control. Question: How many people have a tire pressure gauge in their cars or even know how to use it? Know how or have the ability to change a tire? Most live in that blissful place where " Someone else will take care of that". People are rapidly losing life skills.

I wasn't alive but wasn't there a hue and cry when full service gas stations went out of style? Someone who would check the tires and oil for you? oh and pump gas, all so you wouldn't have to get out of the luxury of your car?

I'm 99% sure that most motorists over the last century were not BITOG'ers. Just like how for the last century 99% of people did not build their own homes (how hard could it be, you just have to swing a hammer, right?).

You say people are losing life skills--I think these life skills were never that common.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Every vehicle with OBD2 had a CAN bus - which is every vehicle since 1996. CAN is an ancient open system network, and its fairly robust, hence its used on Auto's, on commercial vehicles, on locomotives, and in factories. If you ever heard of DeviceNet in a factory, that's a form of CAN.

The bus should not fail with one module going down. You can wire Can in a star, in a drop, or in a daisy chain. Not sure - maybe even a loop? Either way, since this is a thing in 2023 but wasn't in 1996, its FORD not CAN. Yes, you will loose whatever that one module controls - but everything else should work. For example, if you loose the ABS controller, all your ABS / traction control stuff goes away, but your engine, lights and windows should still work.

This is a terrible implementation of any network topology.

Some brands were better than others in the late 90s.

I've had Jeeps refuse to run because of a non-OEM brand oxygen sensor or the overhead console exterior temp sensor going bad under the bumper. Unplug every sensor one-at-a-time until it runs.

 

[SC Maintenance]

Some brands were better than others in the late 90s.

I've had Jeeps refuse to run because of a non-OEM brand oxygen sensor or the overhead console exterior temp sensor going bad under the bumper. Unplug every sensor one-at-a-time until it runs.

Yes, but thats not the bus - its the sensors, or maybe the controllers. Your sensors are hard wired to the controller, which then communicates with the other controllers on the network. At least any I worked on. A typical sensor outputs a voltage, often 0 to 1 V, or 0 to 5V.

My Nissan's dislike non OEM sensors also.

 

[GON]

In case anyone is curious about these lights, here are close up pics from a 2019 f350 led light. The two modules are removed. The last lens picture is an extreme example and f a cracked lens, but cracked lens should not be so surprising for trucks if used for work. The final two pictures are of the module mount. I don't have a module handy to take a photo.

 

[SC Maintenance]

Avoid collision avoidance systems or whatever else is making things like windshields / headlights / taillights super expensive now.

We bought our Toyota with all those things predominantly for our teenage driver. The investment is worth it to keep her safer.

I on the other hand am afraid to drive it, lest I break something expensive

 

[Torrid]

I had the LED tails with the BLIS sensors on my '17. One got hit and broken in a parking lot and it was $670 for the light. That doesn't include the sensor which luckily my sensor was not broken and I was able to swap it into the new light.

 

[MSCH]

If ABS fails, the vehicle presumably loses the ability to collect information about individual wheel speeds. If cruise is allowed to continue operating without that information, loss of traction under one or more drive tire(s) could result in yaw and loss of control.

Some will say "That's why you don't use cruise control in the winter.". For those of us who have driven vehicles without ABS/stability control/traction control, that's fair - but there's now a whole generation of drivers who have only known vehicles with those features, and have had every reason to expect those systems will intervene when needed.

As for 4WD I'm less clear on the reason, but perhaps something along the lines of the system which distributes power to each wheel/axle depending upon available traction, dissimilar wheel speeds due to cornering, etc.

I tend to think Mopar did it that way simply to protect theirselves from liability because of all the lawsuit happy individuals in the world who would blame the vehicle manufacturer for their own stupidity.. aka just a new version of the nanny state having to be engineered against..

 

[edyvw]

Because we've become a " know nothing " society, everything has to have " nanny" control. Question: How many people have a tire pressure gauge in their cars or even know how to use it? Know how or have the ability to change a tire? Most live in that blissful place where " Someone else will take care of that". People are rapidly losing life skills.

You are approaching this in a VERY wrong way! That is like saying: oh if you do not crash, you do not need a seatbelt.

TPMS will warn you of gradual loss of air DURING driving. Yes, it will warn you if you sit in the car in the morning, but what really, REALLY matters is to warn you if something is wrong while driving. That prevents underinflation of tire, possible damage right there that might be fatal to you or OTHERS. However, it might get damaged without you knowing that it is damaged, and then it catches up with you sometimes a year later.

Now, in some cars, you can actually code out TPMS. Nothing stops you from checking whether you can do it and then, there goes that "nanny" control, and you can be know everything tough guy again.

 

[spasm3]

There is hardly more useful device than TPMS. I would put it behind seatbelts but ahead of air bags.

I was not spending and extra $250 to replace them at my last tire replacement on the Hyundai. None of them were working, so I had the tire shop simply delete them and use regular valve stems.

 

[edyvw]

I was not spending and extra $250 to replace them at my last tire replacement on the Hyundai. None of them were working, so I had the tire shop simply delete them and use regular valve stems.

Good for you.

 

[Speedy3861]

Good for you.

I would think that removal or an inactivated safety system of any sort would create a nasty liability issue if that deletion proved contributory to an accident where Injury was involved. I am certified as an expert witness in firearms and in liability cases, the first questions asked involving an accidental or unintended discharge are (1) Were all factory installed safety systems present and functional? And (2) are trigger pull weights within factory specifications and limits? As much as we are sometimes annoyed by the constant intrusion by sometimes wonky, usually government mandated safety systems, in the end, they DO save lives, lessen injuries and occasionally protect people from their own ignorance or oblivious disregard for the laws of physics. The only real cure for stupidity is to let natural selection work, but often innocent bystanders are Involved when you do.

 

[edyvw]

I would think that removal or an inactivated safety system of any sort would create a nasty liability issue if that deletion proved contributory to an accident where Injury was involved. I am certified as an expert witness in firearms and in liability cases, the first questions asked involving an accidental or unintended discharge are (1) Were all factory installed safety systems present and functional? And (2) are trigger pull weights within factory specifications and limits? As much as we are sometimes annoyed by the constant intrusion by sometimes wonky, usually government mandated safety systems, in the end, they DO save lives, lessen injuries and occasionally protect people from their own ignorance or oblivious disregard for the laws of physics. The only real cure for stupidity is to let natural selection work, but often innocent bystanders are Involved when you do.

You are contradicting yourself. You said we really do not need TPMS, but now you actually acknowledge it is a safety system.
When I said "good for you," I was being sarcastic. Sensors, OE ones, and aftermarket ones could be found cheaper (not familiar with Hyundai) but even if not, damage that tire can sustain from underinflation can payoff those sensors.

 

[MSCH]

Because we've become a " know nothing " society, everything has to have " nanny" control. Question: How many people have a tire pressure gauge in their cars or even know how to use it? Know how or have the ability to change a tire? Most live in that blissful place where " Someone else will take care of that". People are rapidly losing life skills.

me, I wish I could disable the TPMS on my truck. I had the sensors removed and I get one warning ding when I start eh vehicle, which I can live with, but I wish I had the option of disabling the system.. I find it more trouble than it saves. When I bought my current RV the previous owner had installed a TPMS on it, I sold that to someone who doesn't know how to check tires..

 

[Speedy3861]

You are contradicting yourself. You said we really do not need TPMS, but now you actually acknowledge it is a safety system.
When I said "good for you," I was being sarcastic. Sensors, OE ones, and aftermarket ones could be found cheaper (not familiar with Hyundai) but even if not, damage that tire can sustain from underinflation can payoff those sensors.

I can understand how you might think so, but no, I do see the value of most of the safety systems, when they work. Most came by government mandate, some by demand. Most are an attempt to make automobiles and trucks safer, as well as "idiot proof". I recently purchased a 23 Honda that came with automatic headlights, which I immediately resented, however, upon reflection, I remember remarking to my wife, not long ago, how many vehicles I observed driving home from work just after the sun set, without headlights in the dark. Thinking about that, realized that I grew up in an era where the dash illuminated only when you turned the lights on. Most vehicles now have what is essentially a computer screen for a dash that's lit up ALL the time, so an automatic headlight system is understandable.
The downside of all this is the added cost and complexity and yes, understandability, additionally, we now take all this for granted in exchange for the hope that it will work as designed. It's better to have basic skills as well as an understanding of the technology. And yes, the TPMS on my earlier Hondas was kind of wonky and frustrating at times, they seem to have sorted it out in recent years.

 

[edyvw]

I can understand how you might think so, but no, I do see the value of most of the safety systems, when they work. Most came by government mandate, some by demand. Most are an attempt to make automobiles and trucks safer, as well as "idiot proof". I recently purchased a 23 Honda that came with automatic headlights, which I immediately resented, however, upon reflection, I remember remarking to my wife, not long ago, how many vehicles I observed driving home from work just after the sun set, without headlights in the dark. Thinking about that, realized that I grew up in an era where the dash illuminated only when you turned the lights on. Most vehicles now have what is essentially a computer screen for a dash that's lit up ALL the time, so an automatic headlight system is understandable.
The downside of all this is the added cost and complexity and yes, understandability, additionally, we now take all this for granted in exchange for the hope that it will work as designed. It's better to have basic skills as well as an understanding of the technology. And yes, the TPMS on my earlier Hondas was kind of wonky and frustrating at times, they seem to have sorted it out in recent years.

Here is the problem with automatic headlights: absolute danger in fog.
Bcs. brightness they won’t activate on many vehicles.
Dash illumination is really Asian vehicle issue (not sure about American). In my wife’s Tiguan dash is on. But, as brightness decreases, so does illumination. In dark it is nit illuminated at all although HID’s are on as DLR’s. In Atlas actually you get constantly message: turn on lights as soon as brightness decreases a bit.
Just bcs. someone has TPMS doesn’t mean it lacks skills or skills will deteriorate. I personally could code my system on BMW once TPMS module died to Euro version to get info from ABS sensor. But, I track my car, and I want immediate signal if there is an issue.
Then, we have to accept that TPMS or not, gauge or not, some people are not going to check it. That annoying light on the dash might actually annoy them enough to take car to shop.

 

[benjy]

you cant even get a simple lens these days, girlfriends 13 oil eating malibu requires a complete taillight assembly $$$$ + it gets worse with newer "fancier" $$$ vehicles, KISS keep it simple stupid!!!

 

[supton]

Here is the problem with automatic headlights: absolute danger in fog.

I hate those things. While it's nice that it works for some people, too often I see people driving in dim light situations, rain/snow/fog, but are too dumb to turn on their headlights. I've mostly given up on flashing high beams at them, it's rare for them to respond.

Some cars are better at than others. On any rainy day I can tell you the ones that aren't.

 

[edyvw]

I hate those things. While it's nice that it works for some people, too often I see people driving in dim light situations, rain/snow/fog, but are too dumb to turn on their headlights. I've mostly given up on flashing high beams at them, it's rare for them to respond.

Some cars are better at than others. On any rainy day I can tell you the ones that aren't.

I told lady on intersection in Infinity Q50 that I couldn’t see her until last moment because she didn’t have lights (really bad fog) and she confusingly said: “but, but, they are on.”