Expedition has consumed oil - First time ever....
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Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
That's odd. I just went 10,000 miles on AZO and the oil level didn't move a single, solitary crosshatch on the dipstick in that time.
This engine clearly needs Pennzoil Ultra to clean up those rings.
hahhahahaah, definitely!
I'll probably run this out to 10K miles (it has 2K to go) and then change it. I need to order some more AZO as I broke into my 4 quart jug to top it off.
Where differences, if any, have you noticed with AZO so far?
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
That's odd. I just went 10,000 miles on AZO and the oil level didn't move a single, solitary crosshatch on the dipstick in that time.
This engine clearly needs Pennzoil Ultra to clean up those rings.
hahhahahaah, definitely!
I'll probably run this out to 10K miles (it has 2K to go) and then change it. I need to order some more AZO as I broke into my 4 quart jug to top it off.
Where differences, if any, have you noticed with AZO so far?
to me that sounds like either an extended oci side effect or a pcv valve issue. either way that's nothing. you have to use more oil than that to join the oil burners anonymous!!! buy a saturn then you can be a card carrying member!
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Expedition has consumed oil - First time ever....
Well, you know what they say...
...there's a first time for everything.
Congratulations. Think of it as:
Speaking of loosing oil - I've had engines that show full (or close) before an oil change, but seem to be a good quart short when counting what actually drained out. Weird.
Expedition has consumed oil - First time ever....
Well, you know what they say...
...there's a first time for everything.
Congratulations. Think of it as:
- a chance to experiment with High Mileage oil,
- freshen your crankcase with a top-off,
- or the immenent death of your engine.
Speaking of loosing oil - I've had engines that show full (or close) before an oil change, but seem to be a good quart short when counting what actually drained out. Weird.
Engines do reach a point where they start to consume noticeable amounts of oil.
Also, consumption can vary.
In our older Accord, I had to add a quart after 4K on a fill I ran 6K total.
I ran the next fill 5K with no adds needed.
It has used a quart in 4K on the current fill.
All of these runs were on PP.
Interestingly, the two runs showing consumption were on 10w30, while the 5K run with no noted consumption was on 5w30.
So, consumption will likely increase with hours and miles and consumption can be observed, or not, for no reason you or I will ever be able to do more than speculate about.
Also, consumption can vary.
In our older Accord, I had to add a quart after 4K on a fill I ran 6K total.
I ran the next fill 5K with no adds needed.
It has used a quart in 4K on the current fill.
All of these runs were on PP.
Interestingly, the two runs showing consumption were on 10w30, while the 5K run with no noted consumption was on 5w30.
So, consumption will likely increase with hours and miles and consumption can be observed, or not, for no reason you or I will ever be able to do more than speculate about.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: buster
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
That's odd. I just went 10,000 miles on AZO and the oil level didn't move a single, solitary crosshatch on the dipstick in that time.
This engine clearly needs Pennzoil Ultra to clean up those rings.
hahhahahaah, definitely!
I'll probably run this out to 10K miles (it has 2K to go) and then change it. I need to order some more AZO as I broke into my 4 quart jug to top it off.
Where differences, if any, have you noticed with AZO so far?
None. Seems to be basically identical to AFE
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
That's odd. I just went 10,000 miles on AZO and the oil level didn't move a single, solitary crosshatch on the dipstick in that time.
This engine clearly needs Pennzoil Ultra to clean up those rings.
hahhahahaah, definitely!
I'll probably run this out to 10K miles (it has 2K to go) and then change it. I need to order some more AZO as I broke into my 4 quart jug to top it off.
Where differences, if any, have you noticed with AZO so far?
None. Seems to be basically identical to AFE
Its all that dang M1 you ran in it. Your pistons are just bouncing around in the bores, and your cam is non-existent. I would bump it to 20w50, or even straight 50.
I bet its just the switch of chemistry, my F150 did the same thing on a change of PP a few years ago, went away on the second OCI.
I bet its just the switch of chemistry, my F150 did the same thing on a change of PP a few years ago, went away on the second OCI.
try a 5w20 in it. seriously, on two modular fords that ive owned, both hit a point at like 120k miles where they would use a qt of 5w30 every 5k miles. when the TSB came out to switch to 5w20, i switched them to 5w20 MC. they then only used 1/4 qt every 5k. i was baffled... thinner and using less? i couldn't believe it, or explain it. one of those engines has 265k on it now and still only uses 1/2 qt every 5k. it has ran on Mc5k and Mobil Super 5000 5w20 for a few years now. seriously give a 20wt a try.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Gokhan
Chances are that the valve-stem oil seals have just given out. The only thing that will reduce the oil consumption is to switch to a higher kinematic viscosity, such as xW-40. NOACK volatility etc. won't make much difference.
My 4A-LC virtually completely stopped consuming oil, save for a minor leak at the oil pan, after I replaced the valve-stem oil seals. I run 0W-20 now. Before I replaced the valve-stem oil seals, I had to run 15w40 in order to control the oil consumption. From 0W-20 to 15w40, there is about a factor of 4 in oil consumption, which seems to be inversely proportional to the square of the kinematic viscosity:
Oil consumption ~ 1/(kinematic viscosity)^2
(empirical formula from my own experience)
I highly doubt it. It doesn't smoke, EVER. It used 1.5 quarts of oil in 8,000 miles. This is hardly excessive consumption, simply more than what it has used in the past.
I think it's the swap in formulation.
Originally Posted By: Gokhan
Chances are that the valve-stem oil seals have just given out. The only thing that will reduce the oil consumption is to switch to a higher kinematic viscosity, such as xW-40. NOACK volatility etc. won't make much difference.
My 4A-LC virtually completely stopped consuming oil, save for a minor leak at the oil pan, after I replaced the valve-stem oil seals. I run 0W-20 now. Before I replaced the valve-stem oil seals, I had to run 15w40 in order to control the oil consumption. From 0W-20 to 15w40, there is about a factor of 4 in oil consumption, which seems to be inversely proportional to the square of the kinematic viscosity:
Oil consumption ~ 1/(kinematic viscosity)^2
(empirical formula from my own experience)
I highly doubt it. It doesn't smoke, EVER. It used 1.5 quarts of oil in 8,000 miles. This is hardly excessive consumption, simply more than what it has used in the past.
I think it's the swap in formulation.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: buster
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
That's odd. I just went 10,000 miles on AZO and the oil level didn't move a single, solitary crosshatch on the dipstick in that time.
This engine clearly needs Pennzoil Ultra to clean up those rings.
hahhahahaah, definitely!
I'll probably run this out to 10K miles (it has 2K to go) and then change it. I need to order some more AZO as I broke into my 4 quart jug to top it off.
Where differences, if any, have you noticed with AZO so far?
None. Seems to be basically identical to AFE
You say this is your longest OCI yet? Any plans to get UOA with TBN for the crowd here?
Originally Posted By: buster
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
That's odd. I just went 10,000 miles on AZO and the oil level didn't move a single, solitary crosshatch on the dipstick in that time.
This engine clearly needs Pennzoil Ultra to clean up those rings.
hahhahahaah, definitely!
I'll probably run this out to 10K miles (it has 2K to go) and then change it. I need to order some more AZO as I broke into my 4 quart jug to top it off.
Where differences, if any, have you noticed with AZO so far?
None. Seems to be basically identical to AFE
You say this is your longest OCI yet? Any plans to get UOA with TBN for the crowd here?
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
try a 5w20 in it. seriously, on two modular fords that ive owned, both hit a point at like 120k miles where they would use a qt of 5w30 every 5k miles. when the TSB came out to switch to 5w20, i switched them to 5w20 MC. they then only used 1/4 qt every 5k. i was baffled... thinner and using less? i couldn't believe it, or explain it. one of those engines has 265k on it now and still only uses 1/2 qt every 5k. it has ran on Mc5k and Mobil Super 5000 5w20 for a few years now. seriously give a 20wt a try.
If you noticed, my first OCI was with a 20-weight. We tried 5w20 in my dad's Expedition (it is an '00) and we had some rather unpleasant noise. We immediately swapped back to 5w30/0w30.
This engine was originally spec'd for 5w30 (it isn't a 3V) and subsequently, that's what it gets. Though I have tried heavier oils in the past.
try a 5w20 in it. seriously, on two modular fords that ive owned, both hit a point at like 120k miles where they would use a qt of 5w30 every 5k miles. when the TSB came out to switch to 5w20, i switched them to 5w20 MC. they then only used 1/4 qt every 5k. i was baffled... thinner and using less? i couldn't believe it, or explain it. one of those engines has 265k on it now and still only uses 1/2 qt every 5k. it has ran on Mc5k and Mobil Super 5000 5w20 for a few years now. seriously give a 20wt a try.
If you noticed, my first OCI was with a 20-weight. We tried 5w20 in my dad's Expedition (it is an '00) and we had some rather unpleasant noise. We immediately swapped back to 5w30/0w30.
This engine was originally spec'd for 5w30 (it isn't a 3V) and subsequently, that's what it gets. Though I have tried heavier oils in the past.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
You say this is your longest OCI yet? Any plans to get UOA with TBN for the crowd here?
Yeah, but we just boosted the poo out of the TBN and diluted everything with this quart and a bit of added oil
You say this is your longest OCI yet? Any plans to get UOA with TBN for the crowd here?
Yeah, but we just boosted the poo out of the TBN and diluted everything with this quart and a bit of added oil
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Thax
Perhaps try Mobil 1 High Mileage 5w30 in it along with a new PCV valve , might eliminate the consumption after 2 oci's.
PCV valve was done sometime last year. I don't do High Mileage oils. It doesn't leak a drop, it doesn't smoke on start-up, it has no leaking seals that "need conditioning". And the consumption was, well, minor, given the mileage.
I think it is just the change in oil brands frankly.
Perhaps try Mobil 1 High Mileage 5w30 in it along with a new PCV valve , might eliminate the consumption after 2 oci's.
PCV valve was done sometime last year. I don't do High Mileage oils. It doesn't leak a drop, it doesn't smoke on start-up, it has no leaking seals that "need conditioning". And the consumption was, well, minor, given the mileage.
I think it is just the change in oil brands frankly.
It is upset that you sold the Capri.....
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: TooManyWheels
It is upset that you sold the Capri.....
Quite possibly
It is upset that you sold the Capri.....
Quite possibly
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
try a 5w20 in it. seriously, on two modular fords that ive owned, both hit a point at like 120k miles where they would use a qt of 5w30 every 5k miles. when the TSB came out to switch to 5w20, i switched them to 5w20 MC. they then only used 1/4 qt every 5k. i was baffled... thinner and using less? i couldn't believe it, or explain it. one of those engines has 265k on it now and still only uses 1/2 qt every 5k. it has ran on Mc5k and Mobil Super 5000 5w20 for a few years now. seriously give a 20wt a try.
If you noticed, my first OCI was with a 20-weight. We tried 5w20 in my dad's Expedition (it is an '00) and we had some rather unpleasant noise. We immediately swapped back to 5w30/0w30.
This engine was originally spec'd for 5w30 (it isn't a 3V) and subsequently, that's what it gets. Though I have tried heavier oils in the past.
Fair enough, our 2v's are happy on the 20wts, that is the reason I suggested it. Both of them are 2v one a 97 4.6l and the other a 99 6.8l
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
try a 5w20 in it. seriously, on two modular fords that ive owned, both hit a point at like 120k miles where they would use a qt of 5w30 every 5k miles. when the TSB came out to switch to 5w20, i switched them to 5w20 MC. they then only used 1/4 qt every 5k. i was baffled... thinner and using less? i couldn't believe it, or explain it. one of those engines has 265k on it now and still only uses 1/2 qt every 5k. it has ran on Mc5k and Mobil Super 5000 5w20 for a few years now. seriously give a 20wt a try.
If you noticed, my first OCI was with a 20-weight. We tried 5w20 in my dad's Expedition (it is an '00) and we had some rather unpleasant noise. We immediately swapped back to 5w30/0w30.
This engine was originally spec'd for 5w30 (it isn't a 3V) and subsequently, that's what it gets. Though I have tried heavier oils in the past.
Fair enough, our 2v's are happy on the 20wts, that is the reason I suggested it. Both of them are 2v one a 97 4.6l and the other a 99 6.8l
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
try a 5w20 in it. seriously, on two modular fords that ive owned, both hit a point at like 120k miles where they would use a qt of 5w30 every 5k miles. when the TSB came out to switch to 5w20, i switched them to 5w20 MC. they then only used 1/4 qt every 5k. i was baffled... thinner and using less? i couldn't believe it, or explain it. one of those engines has 265k on it now and still only uses 1/2 qt every 5k. it has ran on Mc5k and Mobil Super 5000 5w20 for a few years now. seriously give a 20wt a try.
If you noticed, my first OCI was with a 20-weight. We tried 5w20 in my dad's Expedition (it is an '00) and we had some rather unpleasant noise. We immediately swapped back to 5w30/0w30.
This engine was originally spec'd for 5w30 (it isn't a 3V) and subsequently, that's what it gets. Though I have tried heavier oils in the past.
Fair enough, our 2v's are happy on the 20wts, that is the reason I suggested it. Both of them are 2v one a 97 4.6l and the other a 99 6.8l
No problem. If I had a 3V, I'd run 5w20 or 0w20 in it. I just feel more comfortable with a 30-weight in this engine. That's what our '00 calls for, our '02 lists 5w20 on the cap but with the exact same engine.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
try a 5w20 in it. seriously, on two modular fords that ive owned, both hit a point at like 120k miles where they would use a qt of 5w30 every 5k miles. when the TSB came out to switch to 5w20, i switched them to 5w20 MC. they then only used 1/4 qt every 5k. i was baffled... thinner and using less? i couldn't believe it, or explain it. one of those engines has 265k on it now and still only uses 1/2 qt every 5k. it has ran on Mc5k and Mobil Super 5000 5w20 for a few years now. seriously give a 20wt a try.
If you noticed, my first OCI was with a 20-weight. We tried 5w20 in my dad's Expedition (it is an '00) and we had some rather unpleasant noise. We immediately swapped back to 5w30/0w30.
This engine was originally spec'd for 5w30 (it isn't a 3V) and subsequently, that's what it gets. Though I have tried heavier oils in the past.
Fair enough, our 2v's are happy on the 20wts, that is the reason I suggested it. Both of them are 2v one a 97 4.6l and the other a 99 6.8l
No problem. If I had a 3V, I'd run 5w20 or 0w20 in it. I just feel more comfortable with a 30-weight in this engine. That's what our '00 calls for, our '02 lists 5w20 on the cap but with the exact same engine.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: Gokhan
Chances are that the valve-stem oil seals have just given out. The only thing that will reduce the oil consumption is to switch to a higher kinematic viscosity, such as xW-40. NOACK volatility etc. won't make much difference.
My 4A-LC virtually completely stopped consuming oil, save for a minor leak at the oil pan, after I replaced the valve-stem oil seals. I run 0W-20 now. Before I replaced the valve-stem oil seals, I had to run 15w40 in order to control the oil consumption. From 0W-20 to 15w40, there is about a factor of 4 in oil consumption, which seems to be inversely proportional to the square of the kinematic viscosity:
Oil consumption ~ 1/(kinematic viscosity)^2
(empirical formula from my own experience)
I highly doubt it. It doesn't smoke, EVER. It used 1.5 quarts of oil in 8,000 miles. This is hardly excessive consumption, simply more than what it has used in the past.
With bad valve-stem oil seals, you would only see smoke when you drive off from a red light after having idled for more than a minute with a hot engine. You don't see smoke when idling or during cruising with bad valve-stem oil selas.
It's possible that some of the valve-stem oil seals have given out and the others will give out in the next few years. If you have four bad seals now, when all 32 give out, the oil consumption will get 8 times as bad; so, you would have to add 12 quarts of makeup oil in 8,000 miles. Valve-stem oil seals are made of synthetic rubber and they eventually give out, usually after 15 - 20 years. Therefore, it's quite likely that your oil consumption will gradually get worse as your valve-stem oil seals age more. You may eventually need to have them replaced or use xW-40 to control the consumption, but right now the 0.2 quarts per 1,000 mile consumption with xW-30 is still fairly small. If you used xW-20, the consumption would be about the double.
Originally Posted By: Gokhan
Chances are that the valve-stem oil seals have just given out. The only thing that will reduce the oil consumption is to switch to a higher kinematic viscosity, such as xW-40. NOACK volatility etc. won't make much difference.
My 4A-LC virtually completely stopped consuming oil, save for a minor leak at the oil pan, after I replaced the valve-stem oil seals. I run 0W-20 now. Before I replaced the valve-stem oil seals, I had to run 15w40 in order to control the oil consumption. From 0W-20 to 15w40, there is about a factor of 4 in oil consumption, which seems to be inversely proportional to the square of the kinematic viscosity:
Oil consumption ~ 1/(kinematic viscosity)^2
(empirical formula from my own experience)
I highly doubt it. It doesn't smoke, EVER. It used 1.5 quarts of oil in 8,000 miles. This is hardly excessive consumption, simply more than what it has used in the past.
With bad valve-stem oil seals, you would only see smoke when you drive off from a red light after having idled for more than a minute with a hot engine. You don't see smoke when idling or during cruising with bad valve-stem oil selas.
It's possible that some of the valve-stem oil seals have given out and the others will give out in the next few years. If you have four bad seals now, when all 32 give out, the oil consumption will get 8 times as bad; so, you would have to add 12 quarts of makeup oil in 8,000 miles. Valve-stem oil seals are made of synthetic rubber and they eventually give out, usually after 15 - 20 years. Therefore, it's quite likely that your oil consumption will gradually get worse as your valve-stem oil seals age more. You may eventually need to have them replaced or use xW-40 to control the consumption, but right now the 0.2 quarts per 1,000 mile consumption with xW-30 is still fairly small. If you used xW-20, the consumption would be about the double.
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