European OEM's and their EV timelines

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25,809
Location
PNW
I dont mind having the option of electric cars, but I do feel that it will drive many business obsolete. Bitog wouldn't even be relevant in the future. Wouldn't need oil change shops, tune ups. Only front end, tires, brakes and body work. It just seemed rather boring. But to each his own.
Then it would become ... Bitog Is The Obsolete Group
 
Messages
9,963
Location
MA
A carbon tax.... "To push people"....

Is that a real appropriate function of the elected people ??

I have a novel concept....

Let people make up their own minds.... And ... Let companies be innovative and creative to be able to either be successful or unsuccessful in attempting to push and sell these newer type vehicles. Though... The there were vehicles built very early on that were electric... Until it was found that the new "bad future" technology was far more efficient and gave far greater range.... Like going from diesel powered subs to nuclear powered....

Is there is a market for these types of vehicles ?

Yes.

However let the people decide what works best for them. Given their individual needs....
You do realize that they already do that now. High gas taxes in Europe push people to smaller cars. EV tax credits in the US to push people toward EVs. I could go on and on.

 
Messages
361
Location
Scottsdale, AZ
Apartment, Condo and Townhouse is the next big issue. More and more people are asking for the ability to charge their EVs.
Condo meetings are getting requests (demands?) to install 240v outlets or charging stations. Lotta controversy.

Charging at Superchargers can get expensive, especially non-Tesla sites.
I would not own an EV if I couldn't charge at home.
There are people who are surprised when they plug in their new Tesla to their 110v and see 4 MPH.
Perspective buyers ask me about our car; the 1st thing I ask is, "Can you afford this car?"
2nd is, "How you gonna charge it?" You would be surprised at some of the responses.
Great point, It’s a huge issue, we sold our house and are currently getting a sweet heart deal leasing a little old lady’s condo. Plans are to build a house or buy another house and do a massive DIY renovation in the next 8 or so months (different story for a different threads) which would make this a moot point. We looked at all sorts of luxury apartment rentals few hundred unit mid rises, very affluent customer base, rents way more than a mortgage and they all had maybe 3/4 charging docks all in at each one. Our 1 car garage doesn’t have a 240v and I guess from my conversations with the neighbors the condo board isn’t jumping to let everyone get them installed. We have a charging docks few up front next to the fitness areas and pool, but I mean there just isn’t a lot of space for them and who is going to buy a $40k car to then park so far from their front door? Unless I was very old and very settled I’m not sure I’d jump to go EV outside of Tesla, purely for the rapid charging network.
 
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4,744
Location
down in the park
In europe manufacturers risk to be fined 95 euro per gram of CO2 over 95/km for the entire fleet. So if you sold 100k vehicles, and the average C02 output is 105 grams, that means 10 x 95 x 100k = 95 million euro fine... the cost of which will be added to ICE cars I'm sure.

That also drives the EV timelines for european manufacturers as those count as 0 gram vehicles and really bring the average down. It also stimulates the sale of hybrids, though they have less impact.
 
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5,191
Location
Atlanta,GA
In europe manufacturers risk to be fined 95 euro per gram of CO2 over 95/km for the entire fleet. So if you sold 100k vehicles, and the average C02 output is 105 grams, that means 10 x 95 x 100k = 95 million euro fine... the cost of which will be added to ICE cars I'm sure.

That also drives the EV timelines for european manufacturers as those count as 0 gram vehicles and really bring the average down. It also stimulates the sale of hybrids, though they have less impact.
Well govt is going to have to provide some heavy subsidies to encourage buyers. The WSJ has an interesting article on VW and their problems with the ID.3. They unlike Tesla can't afford to build only expensive 100k models and then trickle down to the cheaper models. They have to compete with the Model 3 immediately. In any case allegedly the VW ID.3 outsold the Model 3 in December so who knows. One thing is certain and that it's difficult to transition a company built on mechanical engineering into one built on software engineering.
 
Messages
17,087
Location
NH
Drive a Model 3. Welcome to the dark side. There is no going back; they are that good.
I'm sure they are. I'm sure it has a nice, simple to read, non-backlit dashboard that will be easy on the eyes while driving in the dark. And easy to use controls that don't require me to read an owners manual. And a low beltline with great 360 degree visibility. And nice high profile tires to soak up road imperfections while being nice and cheap, inline with being an economical car. Cheap to reproduce keys, so all members of the family can have their own copy.

Last car I bought was $1,500. I'm sure a $40k car ought to beat it, right?
 
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15,870
Location
...
I'm sure they are. I'm sure it has a nice, simple to read, non-backlit dashboard that will be easy on the eyes while driving in the dark. And easy to use controls that don't require me to read an owners manual. And a low beltline with great 360 degree visibility. And nice high profile tires to soak up road imperfections while being nice and cheap, inline with being an economical car. Cheap to reproduce keys, so all members of the family can have their own copy.

Last car I bought was $1,500. I'm sure a $40k car ought to beat it, right?


Unfortunately for you, Studebaker is no longer making automobiles.
 
Messages
17,087
Location
NH
Unfortunately for you, Studebaker is no longer making automobiles.
Nah, IIRC they didn't have very good acceleration, braking or cornering. I also think they had pretty high emissions too? and lousy crash protection? not even sure if they had seatbelts...

Just has to be better than my Camry, that's all.
 
Messages
17,087
Location
NH
Lately cars seem more expensive, have features I didn't want, and seem to suffer from poor visibility, poor headlights, and expensive things I didn't need (like keys). Going fast is nice, 0-60 that is, but so is getting low TCO. If anything, low TCO is more important to me than most anything else, although not having to do repairs for as long as possible is nice too.

You know, being an appliance.
 
Messages
5,576
Location
Los Gatos, CA
Lately cars seem more expensive, have features I didn't want, and seem to suffer from poor visibility, poor headlights, and expensive things I didn't need (like keys). Going fast is nice, 0-60 that is, but so is getting low TCO. If anything, low TCO is more important to me than most anything else, although not having to do repairs for as long as possible is nice too.

You know, being an appliance.
Our Model 3 saves money on keys cuz there ain't any.
Our Model 3 saves money on maintenance cuz there aint any.
Our Model 3 saves money on gas cuz it ain't got a gas tank.

Saves money on knobs too. Ain't but 2. Just say, "Set the temperature to 72 degrees."
Brakes last 100K or so.

Personally I like $1,500 Camrys. Pretty hard to beat in many ways.
All good.
 
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